Americans suspect Iranians are behind Iraq chaos

[I think not]

Let's absolve Iran of any wrongdoing, just because the US is seen as inherently evil.
That's the starw the Left uses, and it will eventually break the camel's back....as always.

 

[mabudon]

HAHAHAHAHA

Right, so the US is all good and everyone else is on notice??

I sincerely hope that whatever is motivating the US campaign for global dominance gives up soon- a REAL world war, were one to happen in the near future, would be pretty much the fault of whoever actually casts the first stone.

There is NO way to actually believe that the foreign policy of the US is based on altruism OR the stated "realities" of the current global situation

I am glad that there are morons who think that attacking Iran could be "quick and easy" just like Iraq,since the sooner the US (NOT the people of the US in general or anything, the power-mad folks who are actually running the show) makes the FATAL mistake that appears to be coming, the sooner the rest of the world can get on with actual reality

 

[L Gilbert]

The only war the Iranian Theocracy has ever officially fought was a defensive war against Iraq. But I think Iran's leaders have come to the conclusion that sooner or later they are going to have to fight the US and Israel. Iran likely does contribute to problems the US has in Iraq and problems Israel has along its border with Lebanon.

Not quite. There's a bit of history about Iran before it was called Iran. The Persians built an empire, just like the Yanks are now attemptng. That activity requitres aggression. But, I think Iran has been adding a burr under saddles in various places for a long time all the while hoping that everyone else thinks it is too insignificant to formally call to account for the irritations it causes. I hope the near future isn't the time this comes about because I am tired of hearing about the grief in the ME. But I also expect the worst.

 

[L Gilbert]

There is NO way to actually believe that the foreign policy of the US is based on altruism OR the stated "realities" of the current global situation

Yeah, it is a bit of a joke that the US admin speaks as if everything it does is based on altruism. Facts point otherwise and the rest of the planet knows it, but there's good ol' Junior pontificating about democracy in his typically demogogic way.

 

[MHz]

(Their viewpoint not mine, but lets face it, their medieval sensibilities are offended by bikinis, accessible porn, online gambling, rampant corruption...) But this isn't a good reason for war and cultural differences can be addressed by compromise and mutual respect.

That doesn't mean Iran wouldn't welcome families that wanted a week of skiing in mountains that are pretty much barren of other skiers (snow apart from the established ski resorts).
Make places in Iran like Cuba, a playground for the rich and famous (and the lifestyle you mentioned) before all the embargoes, doesn't enrich the people who live there, the pennies they make do not allow then to buy nice cars and have all the toys the rich have. I tried to finf a link to some pics I have seen of their cities today and they certainly don't look 'medieval' at all. Outside the city that changes more.

http://www.worldisround.com/articles/98910/index.html

http://www.pbase.com/k_amj/throughout_iran&page=all

 

[MHz]

It happens, Mike. Get some idiots with too much power and they like to show off. It's an inherent thing with anthropoids. Unfortunately very few of them can handle the power properly.

Just so I'm not trying to read your mind, just which country are you referencing America or Iran?

 

[#juan]

What is curious, is bombing the hell out of the country, subjecting the country to brutal sanctions, the combination of which resulted in a million deaths, and then even thinking that somebody other than themselves was causing the chaos.

 

[earth_as_one]

Let's absolve Iran of any wrongdoing, just because the US is seen as inherently evil.
That's the starw the Left uses, and it will eventually break the camel's back....as always.

I never claimed the US in inherently evil. I don't claim Iran is inherently good. I do support judging a tree by the fruit that it bears.

What fruit has Bush's foreign policy borne?

I wouldn't say every foreign policy decision by the Bush adminstration has been a mistake. But manipulating fears related to 9/11 into support for an unprovoked war to gain control of Iraq's oil resources for the benefit of the power elite was a mistake.

G, you must have been watching 300 :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/300_(film)#Depiction_of_Persians

You would have to go back quite far into the past to find evidence of Persian empire building.

J,

 

[earth_as_one]

That doesn't mean Iran wouldn't welcome families that wanted a week of skiing in mountains that are pretty much barren of other skiers (snow apart from the established ski resorts).
Make places in Iran like Cuba, a playground for the rich and famous (and the lifestyle you mentioned) before all the embargoes, doesn't enrich the people who live there, the pennies they make do not allow then to buy nice cars and have all the toys the rich have. I tried to finf a link to some pics I have seen of their cities today and they certainly don't look 'medieval' at all. Outside the city that changes more.

http://www.worldisround.com/articles/98910/index.html

http://www.pbase.com/k_amj/throughout_iran&page=all

I was referring to their attitudes, not their cities. For example:
Ahmadinejad:

...He singled out the female British captive, Leading Seaman Faye Turney, 26, and said: "You will know that among the detainees there is one lady who is a mother of a child. Why is it that the most difficult work like patrolling at sea should be given to a woman?
"Why is there no respect for motherhood? Why does the West not value its women?"...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/04/04/wiran704.xml

and

Iran women's bill rejected

By Miranda Eeles
BBC correspondent in Tehran

A bill calling on Iran to join an international agreement on women's rights has been rejected by the government's supervisory body.
The Guardian Council has defied parliament and rejected an international treaty which aims to eliminate discrimination against women.

Iranian women are treated like second class citizens

Iranian state television said the Council had decided to turn down the United Nations' convention claiming it was against Sharia law and the constitution. The reformist-dominated parliament ratified the bill last month believing it would help promote Iran's image abroad and help domestic problems at home. That decision provoked bitter denunciation by hardliners, many of whom claimed the convention was colonialist and against the Islamic code...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3145969.stm

But times are a changin, even in Iran:
BBC

The number of women graduating from Iran's universities is overtaking the number of men, promising a change in the job market and, with it, profound social change.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5359672.stm

In some subjects 70% of Iran's graduates are women

 

[MHz]

I was referring to their attitudes, not their cities.
BBC

From that same BBC article
"Despite enjoying greater freedoms than many other Islamic countries, Iranian women are treated as second class citizens. In the courts they are worth half the value of men, have fewer rights in divorce and child custody and need their husband's permission to work or travel abroad."


Also notice it was Britain that announced a woman was in the group that were captured, not Iran. I don't know for sure but it sounds like Iran doesn't allow women in the military. That is bad because....?


Luckily, in the West, no husband ever offers any opinion of where his wife decides to work. LOL Tell me about any father who wouldn't like to have some kind of advantage in divorce or custody matters.

 

[earth_as_one]

Within a generation or two, Iranian women will make up the majority of university educated people in Iran. Eventually they will be the majority of doctors, engineers, lawyers, politicians... A which point how a group of old men interpret Sharia Law will be beside the point.
Iran's future:

Masoumeh Ebtekar (Persian: معصومه ابتکار; born 1960) is an Iranian scientist and politician.
She was the first female Vice President of Iran, as the head of the Environment Protection Organization of Iran during the administration of President Mohammad Khatami, and is currently a city councilwoman elect of Tehran.[1] Ebtekar is also famous for being the spokeswoman of the students who had occupied the US Embassy during the Iran hostage crisis and as a critic of the Taliban's oppresion of women. She is a member of the reformist political party, the Islamic Iran Participation Front.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masoumeh_Ebtekar

 

[MikeyDB]

Americans believe whatever their media tells them....We have an urgent necessity facing us...Iraq is stockpiling WMDs.... We have to help those poor nations where internecine violence and conflict threatens American "interests"....
You can't blame Americans for this....
Canada on the other hand has answered the call to its committment in Afghanistan...we'll spend whatever it takes to purchase or lease new tanks to support our troops....to protect the American erected petroleum cartels that run this planet... and yet...will Canadians be prepared to pay for heavy-lift aircraft to deploy the DART relief organism of the DND to help people...why no....
Canadians embrace their "peacekeeper" image on the world stage and are loathe to admit that Canadian firms reap enormous profits from supplying the American war machine with everything from DU to massive amounts of high explosives and ordinance....
Canadians are fooling themselves....

 

[hermanntrude]

from about two months ago, everything has been Iran's fault. Before that, somehow Iran didnt seem part of the picture. weird

 

[MikeyDB]

Herm
Americans love to have somone to blame...French surrender monkeys....the evils of communism....damn democrat tree huggers....hippies and dope-heads......NRA gun nuts.....
Entirely in keeping with the American appetite for exclusion from any and all responsibility for anything....

 

[darkbeaver]

Canadians are inherantly evil. We have little to be proud of. None of our UN peace keeping missions were peace keeping, they were all just keeping the neo colonial machine alive and sucking the wealth out of third world countrys, in my opinion we're dumber than Americans and just as greedy.
Our mission in Hati should be a matter of national shame and disgust.I am no longer proud to be Canadian, and I won't be again untill the neo liberal capitalist system is smashed and burried forever.

Screw Dion, Screw Layton, Screw May, Screw Harper twice, screw them all, mouthy moralistic assholes and liars.

 

[hermanntrude]

wow. Two massive sweeping generalisations

 

[darkbeaver]

Nevertheless that's how I feel, or would you rather long detailed reasoning, perhaps a study group or outside consultants, or a crown inquiry. Oh yah, there's more than two sweeping generalizations isn't there?

 

[hermanntrude]

if you believe there's a country out there that isnt run by liars and cheats and a place where good things happen to good people, please let me know where it is. If not, maybe we could make the best of what we have?

 

[MikeyDB]

Is it the people of a nation that are inherently evil or is the governments they (according to Herm at least) have no opporunity to impact?
Isn't Canada dependent on the U.S. for its national defence? Don't Canadians prosper at their close relationships with American businesses? Does anyone really think that the Canadian shame in Somalia isn't every bit as damning as the brutality of Abu Ghraib? While Chretien opted us out of the Coalition of the Incredibly Gullible...we did participate in Bosnia Herzagovenia...we did give false information to the FBI to kidnap one of our citizens...we did supply DU and massive quantities of ordinance to the American war machine during the hey-days of the Viet Nam debacle..We are pro-Aemerican in many respects because we don't want to upset our economy by dealing with the outcomes of the lies and broken "deals" with America so we accept that a billion dollars stolen from us is perfectly OK....
We allowed ourselves to accept some of the victims of the 9/11 tragedy to be told by Americans on this forum that Americans don't really care what Canadians think...
Who pollutes and consumes far more energy per capita than the United States? Which nation has "led the way" in addressing greehnhouse gas emmissions....Canada or the United States?
If we're going to discuss the culpability of the United States...unlike Americans we should be willing to look at our own responsibilities and failures....

 

[#juan]

Canadians are inherantly evil. We have little to be proud of. None of our UN peace keeping missions were peace keeping, they were all just keeping the neo colonial machine alive and sucking the wealth out of third world countrys, in my opinion we're dumber than Americans and just as greedy.
Our mission in Hati should be a matter of national shame and disgust.I am no longer proud to be Canadian, and I won't be again untill the neo liberal capitalist system is smashed and burried forever.

Screw Dion, Screw Layton, Screw May, Screw Harper twice, screw them all, mouthy moralistic assholes and liars.

Darkbeaver what the hell are you talking about? Can we assume this is some kind of extreme satirical rant? It makes no sense otherwise.