America Doomed,Depression & War Looms
- Thread starter darkbeaver
- Start date
Sorry we have a way to go yet before the roof falls in. It is nice to see that some are now
talking about an outstanding amount of debt floating around the world. There are deficits
in all countries, there are trade issues for everyone and mounting debt. The programs to
free us from the social ills of life, are now making us societies prisoner of those very over
all benefits. It is not the the programs that are the problem it is the fact that successive
governments have not administered them properly. In other words its not how much money
they have its how they spend the money.
Some say if America falters, China will take over. I personally have a problem with that. Both
countries have now put themselves in a position that if one goes under they both go under.
The problem with that is they will take us all with them, Harper has not saved us, he has put off
the dooms day scenario for a while.
On of the greatest problems is the derivatives market. America sold the real estate properties
in bundles without keeping the actual deeds and they sold them in varied packages. Foreclosure
is even becoming questionable because the lending institution no longer has the actual deed
they lent the money on. Around the world, the estimated derivative debt has risen to 1.2 quadrillion
dollars. No those figures are a year or so out of date, but that only means it is probably higher
because these and other funds are still not regulated, as mentioned by some other posters on
this thread.
China is now facing inflation, and they haven't experienced that before as they change to the
economy they have now. If America keeps printing money, it will devalue, and China will end up
with bundles of worthless paper. Slowly but surely Europe enters the picture, and they bring to
the table, several countries, with enormous debt problems. Spain, Greece, Portugal, Ireland,
Britain, France, Iceland and Germany. The haves and the have nots are in danger of losing
their economic place in the world. Combine that with the problems in America and Asia. It should
also be remembered that Japan has been in various stages of recession since 1982..
We have painted a thin layer of veneer over one hell of a mess, the economic ship has gone down
and we are doing a salvage operation on the leftovers before it all sinks.
What is the future for Canadians if the United States defaults on its debt? The world will unravel
like a giant ball of twine, or should I say ticker tape.
Does this translate into war? That is not as clear. The countries of the world have diversified themselves
for economic rather than a military future. They are entwined and it is difficult to fight with someone when
you are economically dependent on them. Granted there could be war but with who?
Europe and America are linked at the hip, South America is moving to being stronger economically and
are not interested in conflict. We are already at war with the Middle East that war has not expanded yet,
but it will. So we take on China? Remember they have all the factories and the labour force, so that is
not a good idea.
talking about an outstanding amount of debt floating around the world. There are deficits
in all countries, there are trade issues for everyone and mounting debt. The programs to
free us from the social ills of life, are now making us societies prisoner of those very over
all benefits. It is not the the programs that are the problem it is the fact that successive
governments have not administered them properly. In other words its not how much money
they have its how they spend the money.
Some say if America falters, China will take over. I personally have a problem with that. Both
countries have now put themselves in a position that if one goes under they both go under.
The problem with that is they will take us all with them, Harper has not saved us, he has put off
the dooms day scenario for a while.
On of the greatest problems is the derivatives market. America sold the real estate properties
in bundles without keeping the actual deeds and they sold them in varied packages. Foreclosure
is even becoming questionable because the lending institution no longer has the actual deed
they lent the money on. Around the world, the estimated derivative debt has risen to 1.2 quadrillion
dollars. No those figures are a year or so out of date, but that only means it is probably higher
because these and other funds are still not regulated, as mentioned by some other posters on
this thread.
China is now facing inflation, and they haven't experienced that before as they change to the
economy they have now. If America keeps printing money, it will devalue, and China will end up
with bundles of worthless paper. Slowly but surely Europe enters the picture, and they bring to
the table, several countries, with enormous debt problems. Spain, Greece, Portugal, Ireland,
Britain, France, Iceland and Germany. The haves and the have nots are in danger of losing
their economic place in the world. Combine that with the problems in America and Asia. It should
also be remembered that Japan has been in various stages of recession since 1982..
We have painted a thin layer of veneer over one hell of a mess, the economic ship has gone down
and we are doing a salvage operation on the leftovers before it all sinks.
What is the future for Canadians if the United States defaults on its debt? The world will unravel
like a giant ball of twine, or should I say ticker tape.
Does this translate into war? That is not as clear. The countries of the world have diversified themselves
for economic rather than a military future. They are entwined and it is difficult to fight with someone when
you are economically dependent on them. Granted there could be war but with who?
Europe and America are linked at the hip, South America is moving to being stronger economically and
are not interested in conflict. We are already at war with the Middle East that war has not expanded yet,
but it will. So we take on China? Remember they have all the factories and the labour force, so that is
not a good idea.
My understanding of fiat currency is that it is based on dept, so the more you are in dept, the more you are worth. But it is not based on anything tangible, so it is actually worthless. So the massive dept that is floating around unregulated tells me that no matter how high the figure is, it is still worthless, nothing more than binary code on computers. The sytem has been milked to the Nth degree by the slimy greedy and is long over due to collapse. I say, give it a shove over the edge. The sooner it collapses, the sooner people will take back their countries and financial institutions and hang the pricks who created this abomination in the first place.
It is utterly irrational, and infested with greed and corruption. If it were efficient you would see a equitable sharing of wealth with growing productivity.. instead you see a massive polarization of wealth and de-industrialization.
Yes from the publics perspective it is utterly irrational however from the perspective of those who profit from chaos it is the rational exploitation of an irrational economic construct. That de industrialization was a factor in every emperial collapse Dutch, Spanish etc. Financial replaced industrial in each case and in each case the result was the same. And it will not be any different in our case except in the scale of destruction and dislocation. The wealth consolodates, hides, waits for the smoke to clear and the stench of death to evaporate and then it comes out from under the rocks and developes the exact same construct again. This is traceable since the height of Babylon.
by the way it was not the OP that I found funny but the Bernake Hu skit
There is a struggle going on in America between two competing philosophies. The middle is rapidly disappearing. Everyone will ultimately have to make a choice and hope for the best.
Both sides have become radicalized. One side has embraced the ideal of individual liberty and personal freedom. The other side has embraced the ideal of equality.
The contest between these philosophies has shaped the perception of the federal govt. in the US. One side sees the federal govt. as the vehicle to achieve equality of result. The other side sees the federal govt. as the source of oppression.
The financial crisis in America and the greatest recession since the Great Depression has created a level of structural unemployment that has ripped away the mask and disguise of purported prosperity.
American private sector workers are now in direct competition with workers in the Third World. They are frightened because they realize that it generally doesn't make sense to create jobs in America from a cost/benefit standpoint. They realize their children will in many cases be unable to have a standard of living approaching the ones they have known.
At the same time American private sector workers see American public sector workers enjoying compensation, benefits and defined benefit pension plans that aren't available to private sector workers. This has caused a sea change in attitudes.
American public sector employees are now threatened with the loss of their superior wage, benefit and pension packages. This can be seen playing out in the State of Wisconsin.
One side will win, and the other side will have its ideology and dogma swept away. Americans now live in interesting times.
Both sides have become radicalized. One side has embraced the ideal of individual liberty and personal freedom. The other side has embraced the ideal of equality.
The contest between these philosophies has shaped the perception of the federal govt. in the US. One side sees the federal govt. as the vehicle to achieve equality of result. The other side sees the federal govt. as the source of oppression.
The financial crisis in America and the greatest recession since the Great Depression has created a level of structural unemployment that has ripped away the mask and disguise of purported prosperity.
American private sector workers are now in direct competition with workers in the Third World. They are frightened because they realize that it generally doesn't make sense to create jobs in America from a cost/benefit standpoint. They realize their children will in many cases be unable to have a standard of living approaching the ones they have known.
At the same time American private sector workers see American public sector workers enjoying compensation, benefits and defined benefit pension plans that aren't available to private sector workers. This has caused a sea change in attitudes.
American public sector employees are now threatened with the loss of their superior wage, benefit and pension packages. This can be seen playing out in the State of Wisconsin.
One side will win, and the other side will have its ideology and dogma swept away. Americans now live in interesting times.
The times were always interesting. Now Americans are becoming aware maybe. The distractions of Reality TV will never compete with an empty stomach or a leaking roof.
Start stocking up on rice, oat meal, lentils, beans, flour, sugar, powdered milk and cooking oil. Why start with scratch like on the reality shows?
Real reality has no commercial breaks and TV isn't going to teach you how to **** over your neighbour for half a rotten potato.
The manufacturing of the crisis was global and continues to be however the crisis will be most keenly felt by those locations which off shored their manufacturing in accordance with the steps to realize the manufactured crisis. It is felt that the crisis is as usual best addressed by global war, which everybody knows stimulates innovation both economic and technical across the board providing the long term good paying jobs our youth desperately need, at least for those that survive the bio-weapons the radiation -weapons the high energy plasma weapons and the general starvation and widespread civil unrest. Democracy rules.[/QUOTE]
Nonsense. The great depression is a minor blip in a steady rise in GDP. But we can talk ourselves into a depression
again if we want. The U.S. has traditionally been the world's biggest market. China is crowding a bit but they are still in the position that Japan was in after WW2. The label "made in occupied Japan" was usually a mark of poor quality but it changed. I'm sure China's quality control will get better but it will take a while.
USA annual real GDP from 1910–60, with the years of the Great Depression (1929–1939) highlighted.
The manufacturing of the crisis was global and continues to be however the crisis will be most keenly felt by those locations which off shored their manufacturing in accordance with the steps to realize the manufactured crisis. It is felt that the crisis is as usual best addressed by global war, which everybody knows stimulates innovation both economic and technical across the board providing the long term good paying jobs our youth desperately need, at least for those that survive the bio-weapons the radiation -weapons the high energy plasma weapons and the general starvation and widespread civil unrest. Democracy rules.[/QUOTE]
Nonsense. The great depression is a minor blip in a steady rise in GDP. But we can talk ourselves into a depression
again if we want. The U.S. has traditionally been the world's biggest market. China is crowding a bit but they are still in the position that Japan was in after WW2. The label "made in occupied Japan" was usually a mark of poor quality but it changed. I'm sure China's quality control will get better but it will take a while.
USA annual real GDP from 1910–60, with the years of the Great Depression (1929–1939) highlighted.
Nice graph, GDP means nothing to the poor, marvelous GDP and deep poverty regularly occur together, eight million extra dead during that same period says everything. We literally already have been talked into a depression, the neo liberal lunatic shift to globalization speech and the idiot service economy coupled to deregulation and the virtues of free trade speeches talk talk talk and now we got depression. Gross domestic product reflects nothing about wealth distribution.
Don't forget fire wood.
Actually darkbeaver, there is a lot more than that floating around. A little over a year ago the
estimate on leveraged debt or derivatives, was at 1 quadrillion dollars world wide. If America
goes the whole thing goes. Japan fell into recession around 1980 to 1982 and they are still
in a recession. America is the currency most stable in the world, at least for the time being,
but then it is in serious trouble.
We are all doomed to depression and it is coming fast if some serious things are not done.
Inflation is a killer but the only way to prop up the economy is printing money. The main reason
is we don't have the high paying jobs we once had, to sufficient levels to pay the taxes required
to support the societies lifestyle and no one is willing to change anything until the music stops
and by then it will be too late.
What people don't realize is, we were broke in 2005 and it slowly consumed what was left of
our reserves from then until now. People are spoiled and self centered and their day of
reckoning is coming at an alarming rate. I noticed some are saying Yawwwn, and that is the
problem. No one believes anything will happen, until it does. Same thing happened during the
Great Depression one morning people woke up to the fact their future was frozen in time.
The only way out was war. The problem is we are already at war and still things don't improve.
There are no sustainable jobs in the numbers required to make a difference as corporations
that are financed by us through share purchase and government taxes, have already abandoned
us for cheap labour and no regulations.
Yes we are in serious trouble and the worst has not even begun, and it will continue until people
take the matter seriously.
estimate on leveraged debt or derivatives, was at 1 quadrillion dollars world wide. If America
goes the whole thing goes. Japan fell into recession around 1980 to 1982 and they are still
in a recession. America is the currency most stable in the world, at least for the time being,
but then it is in serious trouble.
We are all doomed to depression and it is coming fast if some serious things are not done.
Inflation is a killer but the only way to prop up the economy is printing money. The main reason
is we don't have the high paying jobs we once had, to sufficient levels to pay the taxes required
to support the societies lifestyle and no one is willing to change anything until the music stops
and by then it will be too late.
What people don't realize is, we were broke in 2005 and it slowly consumed what was left of
our reserves from then until now. People are spoiled and self centered and their day of
reckoning is coming at an alarming rate. I noticed some are saying Yawwwn, and that is the
problem. No one believes anything will happen, until it does. Same thing happened during the
Great Depression one morning people woke up to the fact their future was frozen in time.
The only way out was war. The problem is we are already at war and still things don't improve.
There are no sustainable jobs in the numbers required to make a difference as corporations
that are financed by us through share purchase and government taxes, have already abandoned
us for cheap labour and no regulations.
Yes we are in serious trouble and the worst has not even begun, and it will continue until people
take the matter seriously.
of course, because co-operation is a foreign concept to so many. Only selfish self interest. Killing to survive.
Judge not lest ye be judged.
Don't jump to conclusions. Societal collapse is what I was referring to.
Americans are now too polarized to cooperate. Because of that fact political paralysis will continue. Political paralysis will lead to the inability to deal with the ongoing finanacial and budgetary crisis. That leads to economic collapse. Economic collapse leads to social disorder. Social disorder requires everyone to protect themselves.
Some people point to rising stock markets and that is the danger for the situation we are in.
Rising markets not based on production is the key to disaster and is what happened during
the last Great Depression. What is happening right now is the same pattern that took place
before. Things went down hard, struggled back and then collapsed into a total breakdown.
The comments about people being polarized adds to the mix here, as people are divided by
politics, religion, and self interest and there is no worse mixture. The trouble is this is not for
America alone. The world is a much more dangerous place because our attitudes have made
it so. People in the past were at least hopeful and necessity forced them to work together for
the common good. Today people are afraid of everything and the people who are not afraid
are resented by everyone else. Personally I don't like being negative about the economy
but the fact is we are in serious trouble and until we address the issues that got us to this
point, we will not be in a position to change anything.
Rising markets not based on production is the key to disaster and is what happened during
the last Great Depression. What is happening right now is the same pattern that took place
before. Things went down hard, struggled back and then collapsed into a total breakdown.
The comments about people being polarized adds to the mix here, as people are divided by
politics, religion, and self interest and there is no worse mixture. The trouble is this is not for
America alone. The world is a much more dangerous place because our attitudes have made
it so. People in the past were at least hopeful and necessity forced them to work together for
the common good. Today people are afraid of everything and the people who are not afraid
are resented by everyone else. Personally I don't like being negative about the economy
but the fact is we are in serious trouble and until we address the issues that got us to this
point, we will not be in a position to change anything.
I agree with you. It takes so long to wake up to reality. We are already engaged in low intensity war when the last real wealth has been sucked up and tucked away then the total; war will begin to erase the history of today and when the masters deem it time to civilize again a new utopic super state will start the same crooked game all over again. Create destroy create destroy create destroy. The yawners probably sleep in a lot and watch way too much TV, forget them they ain't got any skills, they'll just be liabilitys in the hard times ahead.