Islamists threaten bless us or die

[northstar]

Islam thinks that the POPE is in Turkey to visit them, and like children having a temper tantrum, they are threatening violence...I think that they really want a blessing, perhaps mass conversion to Christianity????

"Say we are non-violent or else we will kill you" --an anonymus IMAM who didn't want to be quoted as he screamed with the anonymus crowd...


Okay, so l am warming up to this Pope Fella Ben, I got the information, that the media could really have shared a little earlier about the purpose of his visit.

I had forgotten about the Rev. Andrea Santoro, who had been murdered by the Non-Violent Islamists, due to the cartoons that was a humorous look at some aspect of faith...and we all know that there is no humor in Islam, well l guess the humor is in the gleeful celebration of murder....

A Turkish [Islamic} teenager [after consulting their Quran and finding verification}shot the priest in February as he knelt in​

prayer in his church in the Black Sea port of Trabzon.​

The attack was believed linked to the outrage over the cartoons.​

Two other Catholic priests also were attacked in Turkey this year.​

"Let us sing joyfully, even when we're​

tested by difficulties and dangers as we have learned from the fine witness​

given by the Rev. Andrea Santoro, whom I am pleased to recall in this​

celebration,"​

Benedict said at an outdoor Mass...​

He was addressing the Christians, note, had it been the Islamists he would have been in a pickle...​

....and at least he didn't sell out the basic foundation of the Western Religions, when he basically told Turkey that the many, many violent verses of the Quaran were not acceptable-​

On Tuesday, the first day of his trip to Turkey, the pope urged religious​

leaders of all faiths to "utterly refuse" to support any form of violence in the​

name of faith.​

Good Going Pope Ben....no more torturing the Christain Prisioners!!!

It is interesting that the Muslims recieve him with such passion, and give the Pope so much power, l believe that deep down they yearn to be Catholic...

reaching out to the Turks and the larger Muslim world during his trip,
Benedict also reached out to this country's Catholics, describing them as "the
little flock" in largely Muslim Turkey. He said he wanted to "offer a word of
encouragement and to manifest the affection of the whole church." "With great
love, I greet all of you here present," he told 250 worshippers who gathered
next to the ruins of a house where the Virgin Mary is thought to have spent her
last years. "I have wanted to convey my personal love and spiritual closeness,
together with that of the universal church, to the Christian community here in
Turkey, a small minority which faces many{many, many, many} challenges and difficulties daily,"
the Pope said.

Now here l noted that he wisely side-stepped the constant threats and violent behavior and lack of freedom of speach, and imprisionment very very deftly...inspiring these Christians that dared to venture forth amid the threatening violent behavior of the Islamists...

Maybe there will be converts ... you just never know, because here is a body of people who must find a way into the world of today with the irrational and twisted words of a demented warlord...

l think they want the Pope to love them and embrace them...

Kind of like a child having a temper tantrum...

SO the Pope is not there for the Muslims, although they want to contact him. I think they think he came just to be with them, and we shall just let them believe this, okay...

He is actually tending to the-

Of Turkey's 70 million people, some 65,000 are Armenian Orthodox
Christians, 20,000 are Roman Catholic, and 3,500 are Protestant, mostly converts
from Islam. Another 2,000 are Greek Orthodox and 23,000 are Jewish.

However, besides encouraging the Christains, and pass on the message "no to violence" the most vital reason of his visit is this....

The European Union has called on Turkey to expand
religious freedoms.


​

Ah-hah!!!
Finally the cat is out of the bag and we get to the meat of the matter!!! this is partially and most importantly about RELIGIOUS FREEDOMS....ie. the freedom to convert or just plain old turn aethiest if you want to and not be terrified to share the good news.


And who is rotting away in some sinister grimmy Turkish Prision? Yes, you've got it!!! Christians who have gone to there Quran looking for answers, looking for peace, looking for compassion, looking for truth and goodness. And not finding this, they have converted and in the enriched understanding want to tell those who have not found the courage to challenge Mohammad's story [which is thought of by many as a fable, or tall tale] ...currently to do this is a criminal offense and there are a number of accused facing death sentences and trial in the torturous existance of a Turkish prision...

So the European Union is not accepting Turkey unless it changes the barbaric cruel and violent laws that limits, punishes and does not recognize religious freedom.

The Pope is helping with the religious freedoms, and approaching the Turkish Leaders in a peaceful and compassionate manner, especially given the horendous ordeal Christians have faced over the past hundred or so years, and are currently facing now.

When l think of those Christians in those mean torturous Turkish jails...it makes me cringe and reach for my Latte'...which l guess a prisoner wouldn't get, a world without Latte...l would sell out my mother in two seconds...

OH, and of course there is Bart, the Orthodox fella, the Pope has begun the process to bring the Orthodox faith under the Catholic umbrella.

Bart probably could use some support, apparently being a Christian can get you killed, raped, tortured robbed...so who knows maybe there is a chance for one religion...maybe this will see a bunch of Islamists seeking his pardon...

The pope planned to travel to Istanbul later Wednesday to meet​

Bartholomew I, leader of the world's 300 million Orthodox Christians. The two​

major branches of Christianity represented by Bartholomew and Benedict split in​

1054 over differences in opinion on the power of the papacy. The two spiritual​

heads will meet in an attempt to breach the divide and reunite the churches​

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061129/ap_on_re_mi_ea/pope_turkey​

I wonder if the Muslims will release the Christians they have locked up facing charges of something or other...if theTurks want into the European Club they have to give up their control that limits religious freedom. They were the first to give up the burka, so there might be a shred of hope, that is if the Pope makes it out alive....

Then perhaps they can make a profit on selling the antiquitious torture devices on ebay, and buy a few camels...

 

[Sassylassie]

Is the Pope's advisors mad, some whack job will try and "Off" the Pope.

 

[Logic 7]

Islamist threathen bless us or die, right from the start the title doesnt even make sense, everyone who has a brain, knows it is pratically impossible, which islamic nation is military capable to kill the whole occident?? none of them,on the other hand, according to muslim the way they see the west, is "either you are with us, or you die" and this is exactly what is happening in afganisthan, iraq, palestine, and very soon in iran.

 

[Sassylassie]

Could someone please translate Logic's post for me, I haven't a clue what he means?

Pist, Logic to many magic mushrooms fry the old grey matter lad.

 

[DurkaDurka]

Could someone please translate Logic's post for me, I haven't a clue what he means?

Pist, Logic to many magic mushrooms fry the old grey matter lad.

I tried to decipher his post earlier this afternoon to no avail. I think he is speaking in tongues.

 

[CDNBear]

I tried to decipher his post earlier this afternoon to no avail. I think he is speaking in tongues.

I don't get it, one minute, they're legible, the next, it's like a monkey typed it.

WTF?

 

[DurkaDurka]

I don't get it, one minute, they're legible, the next, it's like a monkey typed it.

WTF?

I guess he didn't take advantage of the education system...

 

[Toro]

Logic is a "she".

And no, I cannot translate.

 

[Sassylassie]

Well I read and re-read Logic's post and I think she/he said I love Toro and I want to bear your chickens. I may need to read the post a few more times.

 

[earth_as_one]

I think it was a reference to something Bush said:

...Every nation, in every region, now has a decision to make. Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists...(Applause.)

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/09/20010920-8.html

Since Iraq opposed US activities, Bush was then able to claim since Iraq opposes us, they must be helping the terrorists behind 9/11. As a result, Bush who is a self described Christian started a war which slaughtered tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis.

Christians are not holier than Muslims. All relgions at one time or another have been used to justify killing innocent people. Passages from most religious texts including the Old Testament, the New Testament and the Qu'ran can be twisted to either support violence or non-violence. That doesn't mean these relgions are violent, just that violent people have used religion to justify their violence. Many Popes, Rabis and Imans are guilty of this.

I think the Pope is guilty of generalizing Muslims and misinterpreting the Qu'ran. What he should be doing is focusing on the parts of the Qu'ran and the Bible which promote tolerance, compassion, charity, honesty and modesty to show Muslims that Christians and Muslims share common values and can be partners in peace.

Religions don't kill people. People kill people.

 

[Sassylassie]

Earth sometimes you leave me speechless, the Pope should do this-the Pope miss-quoted the Koran you are just another example of pandering to the muslim community. The Pope is the Head of the Catholic church and a learned scholor, he didn't miss quote the Koran he told the truth and that is why Muslims were ranting and frothing at the mouth in rage. Have you read the Koran, the entire book or tome? Passage and Passage of violent edicts. The Pope doesn't need to teach tolerance, the Extreme Islamists need to learn tolerance of Christians and moderate Muslims.

 

[earth_as_one]

By the way, here is how Al Jazeera reported the Pope's visit to Turkey:

Turks make peace with the PopeBy David O'Byrne in Istanbul

The pontiff shakes the hand of Ali Bardakoglu,
Turkey's top religious official in Ankara​

On the face of it, the visit of Pope Benedict XVI to Turkey could not have come at a worse time.

Only two months ago the recently elected pontiff managed to cause furore in the Islamic world with a remark made in a speech in Germany in which he appeared to claim that Islam was a religion of violence and barbarism.

bodyVariable350="Htmlphcontrol1_lblError";Equally controversial and recently subject to much attention in Turkey have been remarks made during his time as a cardinal when he expressed open opposition to Turkey's membership of the European Union.
Even so, actual open opposition to the visit of Benedict XVI has been surprisingly muted.

bodyVariable300="Htmlphcontrol2_lblError";What had been billed as a major demonstration against the visit, organised in central Istanbul on Sunday by the ultra-Islamic Saadet political party, managed to attract only 25,000 participants.

This was a tiny number given the city's population of more than 14 million, and the fact that Saadet had bussed in supporters from other cities.

And with the majority of placards carrying anti-Christian slogans written in English, the widely voiced criticism has been that it was aimed less at rallying opposition to the papal visit as putting on a show for the visiting international media, which was only too ready to publish photographs of angry Turks protesting.

Media response
By stark contrast, coverage of the papal visit in the Turkish media has been surprisingly positive and the little criticism that has emerged, is surprisingly muted.

With the big selling secular dailies having long advertised the visit as an opportunity for bridge-building between the Islamic and Christian worlds and a chance for Turkey to improve its international reputation, the only significant criticism has come from the more extreme Islamic media.

Milli Gazete, daily a staunch supporter of the Saadet Party, chose to lead its coverage of the pope's arrival and meeting with Turkish prime minister Recep Tayip Erdogan with claims of a disagreement between the two as to whether Turkey's population was 95% or 99% Muslim - a claim not reported elsewhere.

Radical Islamist daily Vakit, traditionally the most strident in criticism of Western and Christian values, opted for once to avoid controversy, choosing instead to point out that while being greeted last night at the presidential palace by Turkish president Ahmet Necdet Sezer, Benedict XVI was allowed to wear his traditional religious robes and cross, a concession not offered to wearers of Islamic traditional dress who are barred from entry to both the presidential palace and the Turkish parliament.

Religious peace
The mainstream Islamic media however, in common with its secular counterpart, chose to take a positive view of the papal visit, with big-selling dailies Zaman and Yeni Safak both leading with the pope's message of support for Turkey's EU membership, and his call for peace between Islam and Christianity.

Yeni Safak went so far as to claim that by wearing a plain overcoat with no visible cross when alighting from his aircraft, Benedict XVI had made an important gesture towards his Muslim hosts.

Pope Benedict XVI celebrates mass in Selcuk​

But while the media has for the most part been broadly supportive of the papal visit, among ordinary Turks awaiting his arrival in Turkey's main city of Istanbul there was a distinct ambivalence, with many questioning why, after making such a pointed criticism of Islam as recently as September, he was so keen to visit Turkey.

"I'm not against his visit, but if he really believed the things he said, then I have to wonder why he chose to come here," said Eren Karabuk, breaking off from offering traditional prayers outside an Islamic shrine in the devout Istanbul suburb of Fatih.

"After the things he said I really didn't want him to come here," echoed Ali Kirklareli, a flower seller in Istanbul's main Taksim square. "I think this visit is just a media show, he wants to pretend he has made peace with the Islamic world. But even so, I'll be happy if the visit passes without incident."

Turkish hospitality
But others were more welcoming, happy to take the opportunity to display Turkey's famed hospitality and to offer the pontiff the occasion to atone for his remarks.

"He's visiting Turkey so he is our guest," said the owner of the adjacent flower stall, Hediye Ozturk. "Even after what he said, if he wants to visit my house I'd be very happy to receive him."

"He's old," said Selim Sen, a bearded shopkeeper in Istanbul's former European quarter of Beyoglu.
"Sometimes old people get confused and say things they don't mean. If he's visiting us in a spirit of friendship, that’s good enough for me.”

Others too were keen to emphasise that the papal visit was the perfect opportunity to heal wounds.

Visit has benefits
"I think his visit here will be of benefit to our relations with the Christian world," said Zafer Karanfil, an Istanbul shopkeeper of Arabic origin who claims descent from the tribe of Prophet Muhammad.
"He's the head of a Christian church and we should treat him with respect," he said quoting the 24th century Sufi Islamic mystic, Mevlana - "If god loves you, I should love you too."

"I'm a good Muslim," Kerem Aydin, a taxi driver, said. "I pray five times a day and my wife wears a headscarf, but I don't have any bad feelings towards Christians - why should I?"
"I don't even blame him for this," he said, throwing up his arms in despair as police moved to block off a main road prior to Benedict XVI's arrival, causing a lengthy tailback.
"If it wasn't the Pope causing a tailback, it would be something else. This is Istanbul, the traffic's always terrible."

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/F4553E88-C76B-4508-AA21-DC9E601AF677.htm

I find it amazing how the same story can be reported so differently by different news sources.

 

[Curiosity]

Sassy

Toro can make chickens???? :smilebox:

 

[DurkaDurka]

Logic is a "she".

And no, I cannot translate.

Logic is a "she"? never woulf have thought that

 

[Sassylassie]

Me either Durka.:angel8:

 

[CDNBear]

I think it was a reference to something Bush said:



Since Iraq opposed US activities, Bush was then able to claim since Iraq opposes us, they must be helping the terrorists behind 9/11. As a result, Bush who is a self described Christian started a war which slaughtered tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis.

Christians are not holier than Muslims. All relgions at one time or another have been used to justify killing innocent people. Passages from most religious texts including the Old Testament, the New Testament and the Qu'ran can be twisted to either support violence or non-violence. That doesn't mean these relgions are violent, just that violent people have used religion to justify their violence. Many Popes, Rabis and Imans are guilty of this.

I think the Pope is guilty of generalizing Muslims and misinterpreting the Qu'ran. What he should be doing is focusing on the parts of the Qu'ran and the Bible which promote tolerance, compassion, charity, honesty and modesty to show Muslims that Christians and Muslims share common values and can be partners in peace.

Religions don't kill people. People kill people.

Umm ya right???!!!

 

[earth_as_one]

Earth sometimes you leave me speechless, the Pope should do this-the Pope miss-quoted the Koran you are just another example of pandering to the muslim community. The Pope is the Head of the Catholic church and a learned scholor, he didn't miss quote the Koran he told the truth and that is why Muslims were ranting and frothing at the mouth in rage. Have you read the Koran, the entire book or tome? Passage and Passage of violent edicts. The Pope doesn't need to teach tolerance, the Extreme Islamists need to learn tolerance of Christians and moderate Muslims.

I saw all the Muslims ranting and frothing at the mouth on the news too...

Out of 1.2 billion Muslims, only 25,000 came out to protest the Pope. 25,000 is a small number even for Istanbul which has more than 10 million people. 25,000 out of 10,000,000 is about 0.25%. Of that probably less then 10% of the crowd was actually ranting and frothing at the mouth. Thats about 0.025% of Istanbul's population. Does your perception that all Muslims reacted to the Pope's visit that way make sense or is it possible what you were seeing was designed more to entertain and promote intolerance?

By the way, I have read the Old and New Testament, the Qu'ran, the Book of Mormon as well as the Tibetan Book of the Dead. I also saw the movies.
The Ten Commandments










How about you? Have you read the Qu'ran?

 

[CDNBear]

How about you? Have you read the Qu'ran?

I'm in the process of, thank you very much. I'm at the end of Surah XXX The Romans.

No one is worried about the 1.2 billion Muslims, only the 25,000 lunatics. It only takes one moron, oops i mean martyr to screw up a nice day in Israel.

 

[Logic 7]

Could someone please translate Logic's post for me, I haven't a clue what he means?

Pist, Logic to many magic mushrooms fry the old grey matter lad.

You guys always come up with non-sense thread about islamist doing this , doing that,terrrorist who could kill us all with nuclear weapons etcc , or whatever you are afraid of , why don't you guys come up with ,since the creation of canada and usa, how many peoples did you guys kill for the same reasons, israel in palestine or the coalitions of the willing are killing everyday in middle east??


then probably you would start understanding why, western democracy are always at war, from many peoples point of view around the world, is because it is time to take responsabilities and grow up, and look what probleme you have inside your policy.

 

[CDNBear]

You guys always come up with non-sense thread about islamist doing this , doing that,terrrorist who could kill us all with nuclear weapons etcc , or whatever you are afraid of , why don't you guys come up with ,since the creation of canada and usa, how many peoples did you guys kill for the same reasons, israel in palestine or the coalitions of the willing are killing everyday in middle east??


then probably you would start understanding why, western democracy are always at war, from many peoples point of view around the world, is because it is time to take responsabilities and grow up, and look what probleme you have inside your policy.

This is almost to funny to be true coming from a French woman.

How many people have you kind killed in South East Asia, North and South America?

Now you are running your mouth off in another thread defending people who have exhibited the same cruel rights abuses on Native peoples in recent history. Puzzling.