Christian Atheism...it's a thing.

taxslave

taxslave

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MHz said:
The book is literally the word of God. Men could not include this verse unless they could see as far as Re:22 goes. Nor will you understand very much after reading it like a novel, it is a book that needs to be studied, that quality also means men could not have written it without some serious help.

Isa:42:9:
Behold,
the former things are come to pass,
and new things do I declare:
before they spring forth I tell you of them.
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Only if you are a believer in mythology.

Twila said:
Because he has decided to punish us for eternity because adam and eve ate a fruit of a tree. Basically he's super pissed that we wanted to be smart. At least that's what I've gathered from the story when viewed as a parable.

If viewed as fact, then we're talking extreme stupidity by believers..
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The second choice.
 
Motar

Motar

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Ludlow said:
Not rhetoric. It's as if some have no voice of their own, apart from the dogma. Do you have an opinion on God apart from what is written in those books?
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Earlier in this discussion, I was asked to comment about the significance of the Old Testament to Christians, necessitating reference to the text, LL.
 
Motar

Motar

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Ludlow said:
It's okay. I'm thinking maybe someone might have a personal belief in something. No one has to share what is personal.
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I'm certain we all share what is personal, but perhaps not entirely original. Earlier I commented, "Hypocrite, thy name is human." Do you recognize the format/author of this statement? It is not Biblical, but it is personally significant to me.
 
L

Ludlow

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Motar said:
I'm certain we all share what is personal, but perhaps not entirely original. Earlier I commented, "Hypocrite, thy name is human." Do you recognize the format/author of this statement? It is not Biblical, but it is personally significant to me.
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In debate there is what they call appeal to authority. Which in a theist sense would be the bible. I guess my idea of authority would be something else which would not necessitate any appeal. I guess I don't really believe in debate and apologetics. I don't think it's necessary. That's just my opinion though.

I think it is interesting how others believe and feel about spiritual things but I also think that is a personal thing. None of my business what another's beliefs are.
 
Motar

Motar

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Ludlow said:
In debate there is what they call appeal to authority. Which in a theist sense would be the bible. I guess my idea of authority would be something else which would not necessitate any appeal. I guess I don't really believe in debate and apologetics. I don't think it's necessary. That's just my opinion though.

I think it is interesting how others believe and feel about spiritual things but I also think that is a personal thing. None of my business what another's beliefs are.
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Yes, we all appeal to our authorities in our thoughts and posts, LL. DB is fond of A. B. Kuhn and regularly credits him. Others parrot Richard Dawkins without ascribing credit.
 
Motar

Motar

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Ludlow said:
That's the thing. Why appeal to anyone or thing. Why try and prove anything or make any claims?
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I cannot speak for anyone else here in this discussion forum, LL, but I am here to grow in Christ. And I am not disappointed.

"As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another." (Proverbs 27:17 NIV)

Motar said:
I'm certain we all share what is personal, but perhaps not entirely original. Earlier I commented, "Hypocrite, thy name is human." Do you recognize the format/author of this statement? It is not Biblical, but it is personally significant to me.
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"Frailty, thy name is woman!" (Hamlet, William Shakespeare) It seems that only Biblical references offend in this forum.
 
Twila

Twila

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Ludlow said:
I don't know but I'm thinking if I had to look at that Tyra Banks avatar or whatever for more than ten minutes I might lose my mind.
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yeah, she was funny at first. but I think it's time to change it too.

she might come back next halloween though...
 
Nick Danger

Nick Danger

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If one can let go of the traditional "God" concept, you know, the flowing white beard, chorus of angels, big "G" on his sweatshirt etc., it gets a little easier to overcome our tendency to resist the idea that there might be something greater than ourselves. I think ideas like "intelligent design" and the "benevolent dictator" muddy the waters by trying to apply human characteristics to something that is so far beyond our understanding as to defy classification of any sort. For me the word "God" is just a vehicle for concepts that can (and do, for me) make our lives better by dispensing with the thoughts and actions that result in negative influence, stuff like anger, dishonesty (both with others and ourselves), guilt, fear, shame, and on and on, and develop an appreciation for the stuff at the other end of the scale like love, beauty and community. I can read "God speaks to me" as another way of referring to intuition or conscience, or can see "God's hand" in a sunset or an autumn landscape. I don't dwell on just what "God" is, just that it is something beyond the reach of human understanding, and appreciate the sunset for it's beauty and know that it is something not created by human hand.
 
Twila

Twila

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Nick Danger said:
If one can let go of the traditional "God" concept, you know, the flowing white beard, chorus of angels, big "G" on his sweatshirt etc., it gets a little easier to overcome our tendency to resist the idea that there might be something greater than ourselves. I think ideas like "intelligent design" and the "benevolent dictator" muddy the waters by trying to apply human characteristics to something that is so far beyond our understanding as to defy classification of any sort. For me the word "God" is just a vehicle for concepts that can (and do, for me) make our lives better by dispensing with the thoughts and actions that result in negative influence, stuff like anger, dishonesty (both with others and ourselves), guilt, fear, shame, and on and on, and develop an appreciation for the stuff at the other end of the scale like love, beauty and community. I can read "God speaks to me" as another way of referring to intuition or conscience, or can see "God's hand" in a sunset or an autumn landscape. I don't dwell on just what "God" is, just that it is something beyond the reach of human understanding, and appreciate the sunset for it's beauty and know that it is something not created by human hand.
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that's beautiful Nick.
 
Motar

Motar

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Nick Danger said:
For me the word "God" is just a vehicle for concepts that can (and do, for me) make our lives better by dispensing with the thoughts and actions that result in negative influence, stuff like anger, dishonesty (both with others and ourselves), guilt, fear, shame, and on and on, and develop an appreciation for the stuff at the other end of the scale like love, beauty and community. I can read "God speaks to me" as another way of referring to intuition or conscience, or can see "God's hand" in a sunset or an autumn landscape. I don't dwell on just what "God" is, just that it is something beyond the reach of human understanding, and appreciate the sunset for it's beauty and know that it is something not created by human hand.
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If I understand your testimony, ND, "God" cannot or does not want to be known objectively, but only experienced subjectively as "my god".
 
B

bluebyrd35

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selfsame said:
Quran 4: 123-124, which means:

[Some Jewish men and some Muslim men boasted to each other; the Jews said: "We are the chosen people of God, and God will forgive us our sins whatever sins we may commit."
While the Muslims said: "No, but it is we to whom God will forgive our sins, because we have believed in God and His messenger Mohammed."
Therefore, this aya was revealed:]

123. It is not according to your vain desires [Muslims] a, nor the vain desires of the people of the Bible [: Jews and Christians] b;
but anyone who does evil shall be punished accordingly c, and shall not find for himself apart from God any patron d or helper e.

[Then God – be glorified – explained that the expenditure on the poor, feeding of the food and other righteous acts are accepted from believers exclusively, but are not accepted from associaters in particular:]

124. Anyone – male or female – does the righteous [deeds] and being a believer f, such g shall enter into Paradise, and shall not be wronged h [any bit] even a jot i.
...................................................

a O Muslims, the forgiveness and remission of the punishment is not according to your desires and wishes.

b Jews and Christians who commit sins then say: "We shall be forgiven."
This is confirmed by His saying – be glorified – in the Quran 7: 169, which means:
(And there succeeded,after them, [their] progeny who inherited [from their fathers] the Book [: the Torah]; they accepted [as a bribe] the [temporary] property of this low [Worldly life and] say [to themselves for excuse]: "[This time, everything] will be forgiven us [and we shall not repeat it again.]")
It means: They take the bribe in their judgment and say: God will forgive us.

c Either in the life of the World or in the Next Life. As is it indicated by His saying – be glorified – in the Quran 99: 7-8, which means:
(And he who does the weight of an atom of good shall see it [written in the book of his deeds.]
And he who does the weight of an atom of evil shall see it [written in the book of his deeds.])

d To take care about him.

e To help and save him from God's punishment.

f He believes in God, the apostles, Doomsday and the Judgment, and moreover he devotes himself to God alone without associating anything or anyone with God.

g i.e. the monotheists who devote themselves to God alone without associate.

h Concerning their reward.

i i.e that which a bird pecks of the seeds.

The interpretation is by Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hilly.



God is Eternal and Everlasting; He is the First and the Last.

Quran 57: 3, which means:
{He is the First f [: no god before Him], and the Last [: no god after Him], and the Dominant g, and the Invisible h, and He is Most Aware about all things.}
....................................................

f In divinity.

g i.e. Who is Dominant over His creatures with His might and authority, so that none is above Him.

h To His creatures so that none knows His essence.


The interpretation is by Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hilly.
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Most human conflicts have a religious basis. When religions were created, they provided a kinder moral belief system than existed at that time. They were a blueprint for ethics in civilizations that had few or none.

I feel that most atheists have simply gone from believing in a personally involved deity to developing their own behavioural standard . We live in an evolving universe, and "religions" are slowly being replaced. I hope it is evolving into a gentler, and more caring belief system.

It is an action.....reaction type of world, even if the reaction sometimes doesn't always happen immediately or in some cases misses the mark completely. Oh well, it is not a perfect world but it is all we have. .
 
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