Christianity and Religion

[darkbeaver]

Not what I've been told. We are all Gods children, and as such, we will all be forgiven our transgressions in the end. No one will be turned away.

Under god there is no away to be turned to any case. According to many of the old guys, at least as far through the pile as I've gotten, and that's not far, foot foot and a quarter maybe, there is only one sort of punishment and that is self inflicted simply by failing the test of life, apparently you may repeat actually they say you will repeat life here in hell until you pass through to the other side having completed the life test, finally. Either your little light shines with the creators frequency or it dosn't and you repeat the grade.Somethin like that.

Check this out, good reading

Takes me back to my university philosophy classes, DB : )

What did you like the best?

 

[Motar]

Take your spam elsewhere.--God aka Andem

Religion:
"Then the Pharisees went out and laid plans to trap him in his words. They sent their disciples to him along with the Herodians. 'Teacher,' they said, 'we know that you are a man of integrity and that you teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. You aren’t swayed by others, because you pay no attention to who they are. Tell us then, what is your opinion? Is it right to pay the imperial tax to Caesar or not?” (Matthew 22:15-17 NIV)

Christianity:
"But Jesus, knowing their evil intent, said, 'You hypocrites, why are you trying to trap me? Show me the coin used for paying the tax.' They brought him a denarius, and he asked them, “Whose image is this? And whose inscription?' 'Caesar’s,' they replied. Then he said to them, “So give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.” (Matthew 22:18-21)

Yet again, religion questions Christianity as recorded in the gospel of Matthew. This time religion (Pharisees) aligns with politics (Herodians) in a show of allied human force. The result:

"When they heard this, they were amazed. So they left him and went away." (Matthew 22:22 NIV)

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

Okay then.. We will then just eat cake and rejoice that it is White Cake, with sponge like texture.

Mark 12:26 The book of Cake.

 

[Cliffy]

<b>

After he had journeyed
And his feet were sore
And he was tired
He came upon an orange grove
And he rested
And he lay in the cool
And while he rested
He took to himself an orange
And tasted it
And it was good
And he felt the earth to his spine
And he asked

And he saw the tree above him
And the stars
And the veins in the leaf
And the light
And the balance
And he saw magnificent perfection
Whereon, he thought of himself in balance
And he knew he was​

Just open your eyes
And realize
The way it's always been
Just open your mind
And you will find
The way it's always been
Just open your heart
And that's a start

And he thought of those he angered
For he was not a violent man
And he thought of those he hurt
For he was not a cruel man
And he thought of those he frightened
For he was not an evil man

And he understood...
He understood himself
Upon this he saw
That when he was of anger
Or knew hurt
Or felt fear
It was because he was not understanding
And he learned
~~Compassion~~
And with his eye of compassion
He saw his enemies like unto himself
And he learned
~~Love~~
Then, he was answered

A Question of Balance - The Moody Blues​

</b>

 

[Motar]

What did you like the best?

Well, DB, my university experience was BC (before Christ), so it was quite a while ago and viewed through a different lens. But I remember philosophy taught me to love and seek truth. I also recall that philosophy instructed me to standardize discussion terminology with others so as not to waste time debating semantics : )

Okay then.. We will then just eat cake and rejoice that it is White Cake, with sponge like texture. Mark 12:26 The book of Cake.

In truth, angel food cake has always been me favorite, RCS : )

Was Jesus Christ religious? Is Christianity a religion?

Religion:
"That same day the Sadducees, who say there is no resurrection, came to him with a question. 'Teacher,' they said, 'Moses told us that if a man dies without having children, his brother must marry the widow and raise up offspring for him. Now there were seven brothers among us. The first one married and died, and since he had no children, he left his wife to his brother. The same thing happened to the second and third brother, right on down to the seventh. Finally, the woman died. Now then, at the resurrection, whose wife will she be of the seven, since all of them were married to her?” (Matthew 22:23-27 NIV)

Christianity:
"Jesus replied, 'You are in error because you do not know the Scriptures or the power of God. At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven. But about the resurrection of the dead—have you not read what God said to you, 'I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not the God of the dead but of the living.” (Matthew 22:29-32 NIV)

Another religion versus Christianity encounter in the gospel of Matthew. Another religious group experiences the same outcome:

"When the crowds heard this, they were astonished at his teaching." (Matthew 22:33 NIV)

 

[Cliffy]

In case you are wondering why I injected the Moody Blues into this conversation, I will explain. In my late teens and early 20s I rejected the bible, god and religion in general. Then I was introduced to the Moody Blues. Their lyrics and music inspired me to start my spiritual journey. I became ravenous to devour all I could concerning spirituality and our relationship with Life, the Universe and the Creative Force behind it all.

What I found was so far beyond anything I was taught, I looked at the world and saw that 2000 years of Christianity had got us no where. We were still barbarians, still killing each other over doctrine and dogma. There was still suffering, starvation, and war. Christians had learned nothing from the teachings of Jesus or the bible. Everything in this religion is about personal salvation and everybody else be damned. So I looked into the teachings of all the other religions I could find.

I spoke to numerous people of a wide variety of religious persuasions. I went to prayer meetings, healing circles, ceremonies and rituals, always looking for what would bind us all in spiritual union. What I found was that religion is the singular most disruptive force on Earth that separated us, each thinking that their way was the only way. What I found was that there is a unifying principle that does bind us all as humans. It has nothing to do with religion or beliefs. It is only about loving ourselves as we would like others to love us. Love is the only unifying principle in the Universe. Religion does nothing toward this end. It only promotes exclusivity. There is no faith in religion, only belief.

There has always been those who found faith through the path of religion, but they are few and far between. Faith is can only be found with an open mind and heart. Thinking that you have found the answer is a sure way to stop your spiritual growth, which is an evolutionary process that never ends. Even the Creative Force evolves as we do. God is not a stagnant being and it is not separate from us or any other part of the Universe. It is everything and grows with everything in It.

 

[Motar]

In case you are wondering why I injected the Moody Blues into this conversation, I will explain.

Thank you for sharing your testimony, Cliffy.

 

[darkbeaver]

Well, DB, my university experience was BC (before Christ), so it was quite a while ago and viewed through a different lens. But I remember philosophy taught me to love and seek truth. I also recall that philosophy instructed me to standardize discussion terminology with others so as not to waste time debating semantics : )
(Matthew 22:33 NIV)

I can appreciate the utility of standardized discussion terminology. What would you suggest as a suitable standard to apply to a spiritual discussion?

 

[Motar]

I can appreciate the utility of standardized discussion terminology. What would you suggest as a suitable standard to apply to a spiritual discussion?

Online dictionaries include spiritual terminology. Some are more accurate than others. The parties in a discussion can agree on an acceptable definition from one of these resources. Do you have any suggestions?

 

[MHz]

In case you are wondering why I injected the Moody Blues into this conversation, I will explain.

This one is probably not in your collection yet.
Thunder Child - Jeff Wayne's The War Of The Worlds - YouTube

 

[Motar]

What is religion? Was Jesus Christ religious? Is Christianity a religion?

Religion:
"Hearing that Jesus had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees got together. One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: 'Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” (Matthew 22:34-36 NIV)

Christianity:
"Jesus replied: 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” (Matthew 22:37-40)

Religion is relentless in opposing Christianity as the Pharisees take another run at Christ in the gospel of Matthew. As Jesus points out, the standards of God are lived out in two essential relationships with God and men. The Pharisees were confident in their righteousness towards God, so Jesus added a second unsolicited standard to uphold in their interpersonal relationships.

 

[Spade]

Saying what few of us believe over and over and over again is being no different from a devout blackfly that tries to raise a welt of belief on those who try to either swat or ignore.

I am surprised you haven't waded in on the discussion about elves and faeries.

 

[MHz]

So cliffy you fine some spiritual meaning in some songs by some bands. Would Enigma fit into that classification also. How do you classify something as being spiritual, if it inspires thoughts about God is it a 'hymn' or do the lyrics have to mention God or Jesus before it gets that title? The song, 'Have I told you lately that I love you.' was originally an song dedicated to God by the writer. That could apply to any version of it that exists today or it could be about a person that is loved and that would alter the original meaning

 

[darkbeaver]

Online dictionaries include spiritual terminology. Some are more accurate than others. The parties in a discussion can agree on an acceptable definition from one of these resources. Do you have any suggestions?

I suggest further study of the proposal and extra diligence keeping lines of communication open and free of charge.

 

[Cliffy]

So cliffy you fine some spiritual meaning in some songs by some bands. Would Enigma fit into that classification also. How do you classify something as being spiritual, if it inspires thoughts about God is it a 'hymn' or do the lyrics have to mention God or Jesus before it gets that title? The song, 'Have I told you lately that I love you.' was originally an song dedicated to God by the writer. That could apply to any version of it that exists today or it could be about a person that is loved and that would alter the original meaning

Spirituality is not necessarily dependent on deities. It is a personal journey into the mysteries of life. My journey has taken me beyond religion, beliefs and deities. Although I believe in the possibility of some divine creator, it is so far beyond our comprehension that to dwell on it is a waste of time. What is more interesting to me is the divine nature of humanity. It is much closer to home and available.

The Universe is infinite and we are finite. But we are made up of the same stuff the universe is made of: the creative energy that caused all this to come into being. As Jesus supposedly said, once we realize our full potential (our divine nature) we will be able to do far more than he could ever do. Jesus was trying to show us our potential, but those who would control us have worked diligently to keep our divine nature from us, otherwise how could they control us? Religion has always been a tool for control and the bible was written by the controllers.

 

[Motar]

What is religion? Was Jesus Christ religious? Is Christianity a religion?

And so we come to it, the chapter in Matthew's gospel where Christianity publicly denounces religion:

"Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 'The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.
Everything they do is done for people to see: They make their phylacteries wide and the tassels on their garments long; they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; they love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and to be called ‘Rabbi’ by others." (Matthew 23:1-7 NIV)

"The Pharisees substituted ritual for reality, formality for faith, and liturgy for God." (J. Vernon McGee)

 

[gerryh]

And so we come to it, the chapter in Matthew's gospel where Christianity publicly denounces religion:

"Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 'The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.
Everything they do is done for people to see: They make their phylacterieswide and the tassels on their garments long; they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; they love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and to be called ‘Rabbi’ by others." (Matthew 23:1-7 NIV)

"The Pharisees substituted ritual for reality, formality for faith, and liturgy for God." (J. Vernon McGee)

No, "Christianity" did nothing of the sort. Jesus Christ did.

 

[Cliffy]

And so we come to it, the chapter in Matthew's gospel where Christianity publicly denounces religion:

"Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 'The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.
Everything they do is done for people to see: They make their phylacterieswide and the tassels on their garments long; they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; they love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and to be called ‘Rabbi’ by others." (Matthew 23:1-7 NIV)

"The Pharisees substituted ritual for reality, formality for faith, and liturgy for God." (J. Vernon McGee)

Your argument is based on your inability to separate an institution from the man it is based on. Seems rather absurd to me. How can anybody debate an absurdity?

 

[darkbeaver]

No doubt about that either, Christianity was invented in the third century.

Your argument is based on your inability to separate an institution from the man it is based on. Seems rather absurd to me. How can anybody debate an absurdity?

It might be a good spot in this thread to thank Lucifer for his interjection of enlightening absurdities. Sin never sleeps.

We should also not forget to thank the Pharisees for their tireless and eternal work educating us as to the law.

 

[Motar]

Your argument is based on your inability to separate an institution from the man it is based on. Seems rather absurd to me. How can anybody debate an absurdity?

Cliffy (and Gerry), your misunderstanding of my post is due to analogical reasoning and personification.