Patricia O'Byrne kept in jail
- Thread starter JLM
- Start date
She's obviously a flight risk, I see nothing wrong with denying her bail. We spend enough time and money on electronic monitors for people after sentencing, I see no reason for her to not sit and await trial.
The fact that there are people worse doesn't mean we ought to ignore the smaller crimes.
That's what a trial is for.
Which is made quite apparent by the fact that you think a flight risk child abductor should be given bail just because there are 'worse' people than her.
I suspect that is part of why the judge denied bail. It was her own kid, she's obviously not a 'public' risk, but she does need to face some repercussion for what she did. After the trial, she'll likely see house arrest or weekend jail time or some other such scheme designed to keep people productive members of society. This will be their only time to get some justice in hubby's eyes, and assure she makes it to trial.
What? I've met plenty of unfit mothers who are nothing more than manipulative abusers. My cousins were raised by a schizophrenic, my best friend by a psychopathic bi-polar patient who made their life a living hell. They'd grab those kids and disappear in a heart beat too. It didn't make them fit to raise them. My girlfriend's dad stuck around until they'd all moved out of the house and then promptly split with a sigh of relief that he didn't have to protect his kids anymore. The notion that 'mothers' are better is false.
There are some other things to consider here, as it is not a normal case really. Yes it
was abduction, yes she deprived the other parent and yes she should face some kind
of penalty. The fact is the child is an adult. As an adult we should here from her first.
She is the one most effected by the actions of her mother. Does she feel her mother
should be punished? If so by what means? The child now an adult was the most
impacted here and she should play a prominent role in the decisions.
It is still possible to establish a relationship with her father, and if so does she want to?
As I point out this is not a normal case. There may have been other considerations,
for example what is the mental stability of the mother? What was the home situation
that the child was removed from, by her mother and what was the motivating factor
that led to her actions? All we have heard so far is the point of view of the defence and
the position of the crown.
No I am not taking sides but we can find a suitable punishment without jail time in this
case it might be best for all concerned. In my opinion, the fact that the child is an adult
and is not dead or worse leads me to believe we have to treat this as an exception
rather than a standard case. Consider the court time and if the daughter stands up for
her mother and requests nothing be done, and we prosecute her and send her to prison,
we will punish the daughter twice.
was abduction, yes she deprived the other parent and yes she should face some kind
of penalty. The fact is the child is an adult. As an adult we should here from her first.
She is the one most effected by the actions of her mother. Does she feel her mother
should be punished? If so by what means? The child now an adult was the most
impacted here and she should play a prominent role in the decisions.
It is still possible to establish a relationship with her father, and if so does she want to?
As I point out this is not a normal case. There may have been other considerations,
for example what is the mental stability of the mother? What was the home situation
that the child was removed from, by her mother and what was the motivating factor
that led to her actions? All we have heard so far is the point of view of the defence and
the position of the crown.
No I am not taking sides but we can find a suitable punishment without jail time in this
case it might be best for all concerned. In my opinion, the fact that the child is an adult
and is not dead or worse leads me to believe we have to treat this as an exception
rather than a standard case. Consider the court time and if the daughter stands up for
her mother and requests nothing be done, and we prosecute her and send her to prison,
we will punish the daughter twice.
Couldn't have said it as good myself, D.G. The mother's worst crime was disobedience/contempt. Half the country feels that way about our sad justice system, that Mr. Harper seems Hell bent on making worse.
JLM as far as Mr. Harper is concerned I think he has peeked in popularity.
The sad fact is he will implement his program at our expenses and someone
else will be left to clean up the mess. in justice, the current direction is
motivated by ideology instead of common sense. It is a position the Reform
Party took over a decade ago and even if it no longer applies the faithful
must be satisfied. Putting pop people in prison for possession or a small
number of plants is expensive, crazy and ineffective because those who are
committed to a lifestyle are not going to change their ways.
In addition I predict the economic circumstances will dictate that the governments
will change direction and end the prohibition of pot counter productive within a
decade and all the fuss and money spent will be wasted.
This woman is going to be supported by communities before long because she
is not in keeping with the courts. The governments of the day are becoming as
unpopular as bankers and multi national companies. Too bad these institutions
once had the confidence and respect of the public but no more.
The sad fact is he will implement his program at our expenses and someone
else will be left to clean up the mess. in justice, the current direction is
motivated by ideology instead of common sense. It is a position the Reform
Party took over a decade ago and even if it no longer applies the faithful
must be satisfied. Putting pop people in prison for possession or a small
number of plants is expensive, crazy and ineffective because those who are
committed to a lifestyle are not going to change their ways.
In addition I predict the economic circumstances will dictate that the governments
will change direction and end the prohibition of pot counter productive within a
decade and all the fuss and money spent will be wasted.
This woman is going to be supported by communities before long because she
is not in keeping with the courts. The governments of the day are becoming as
unpopular as bankers and multi national companies. Too bad these institutions
once had the confidence and respect of the public but no more.
Yeah, I was 100% behind him while he was attempting to get dangerous and vicious criminals off the street, but now he's going to the other extreme possibly ensuring that the dangerous and vicious criminals remain on the street. We only have so many crime fighting resources and money.
Why shouldn't she be kept in prison? She is being denied bail because she's a flight risk, and not because she is considered "dangerous". She deserves to be in prison, as the father was denied having his daughter in his life for 18 years. She can live without her freedom for however long the trial takes.
Harper would be good as a politician if he could just separate his sense of right/wrong with what he can expect from the masses at large. As individuals most of us have certain things we can be fairly adamant about as far as our own deportment is concerned but at the same time being tolerant of a lower scale in others. I don't think Harper is good at that. He's a man of "all of himself".
I couldn't agree more, Mark.
A guy does this and there's a lynch mob waiting for him, but if a woman does this it's not her fault. I cry bull**** on that!
How is making the criminal actually culpable for his crimes making things worse? The justice system was ****ed up way before Harper ever got in. The justice system here in Canada is pathetic and if he wants to actually give it some teeth, then I am all for that.
People convicted of sexual offences against children can no longer be eligible for pardons. Harper and his Conservatives were responsible for that. That means that pieces of garbage like Graham James will no longer be getting pardons. A small step, but a step in the right direction.
Sure we don't. She was just hiding in the closet for 18 years.
That's what I was talking about when I was 100% behind, not incarcerating people who are found with 7 marijuana plants. Punish criminals, don't manufacture criminals! :smile:
She perhaps should be in prison however the daughters views should be heard.
We don't know the circumstances of the case either, from her point of view and
from the father's point of view as well. I suppose that will come out in a trial. It
could be should be in a mental institution, it could be there were other circumstances.
The fact is we don't know. I think in view of the fact that her daughter is close by
and has been the main attachment in her life I doubt she is a flight risk now. After
all she would be without any support system emotionally. In addition if the daughter
supports her and she might. why punish the daughter? Oh I know the law and the
father and so on , but isn't the child always given first consideration? Besides if
the father wants the mother in jail, and the daughter supports her mother, the father
would lose contact with the girl forever, that is how life works.
This is a tangled mess and we leave these issues to the medical and justice system
for direction. This is a case where a lot of peoples feelings have to be considered.
Its not cut and dried as it were, both parties have to consider their daughter and her
feelings.
Years ago in our family we had a situation where the father was painted to be a nasty
person and the kids didn't like him and so on. In later life my cousins kids found out
there was a hell of a lot of lies told about their dad. For the past few years now the
children and in some cases their children now spend Christmas with their father instead.
These things work themselves out in the long run, and the daughter will play a major
role in any final decision.
We don't know the circumstances of the case either, from her point of view and
from the father's point of view as well. I suppose that will come out in a trial. It
could be should be in a mental institution, it could be there were other circumstances.
The fact is we don't know. I think in view of the fact that her daughter is close by
and has been the main attachment in her life I doubt she is a flight risk now. After
all she would be without any support system emotionally. In addition if the daughter
supports her and she might. why punish the daughter? Oh I know the law and the
father and so on , but isn't the child always given first consideration? Besides if
the father wants the mother in jail, and the daughter supports her mother, the father
would lose contact with the girl forever, that is how life works.
This is a tangled mess and we leave these issues to the medical and justice system
for direction. This is a case where a lot of peoples feelings have to be considered.
Its not cut and dried as it were, both parties have to consider their daughter and her
feelings.
Years ago in our family we had a situation where the father was painted to be a nasty
person and the kids didn't like him and so on. In later life my cousins kids found out
there was a hell of a lot of lies told about their dad. For the past few years now the
children and in some cases their children now spend Christmas with their father instead.
These things work themselves out in the long run, and the daughter will play a major
role in any final decision.
The father has not been in her life for 18 years. How can the daughter's view be anything but skewed? I'm not saying her view is invalid, just that it should be taken with a grain of salt.
Abducting a child IS a crime. It's called kidnapping, or child abduction.