Lethal Atlantic salmon virus found on the West Coast

bill barilko

Senate Member
Mar 4, 2009
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Ton: You are arguing with a pair of morons from the city that know nothing about fish farms but have swallowed the ecoterrorists BS hook line and sinker.
In fact I spend more time in the outdoors outside of work than anyone here-the Salish Sea is a 2 minute bike ride away from my home.

That's why I reject the slavish mentality of those who have money as their god and endlessly pollute this forum with their transparent lies, prevarications and worse.

Over two decades as an activist in the conservation movement here in BC have taught me that some people just don't get it-as evidenced by the endlessly repetitive garbage posted here by the usual compromised suspects.
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
39,817
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Question for you Tonn.. I was watching a documentary the other day: "End of the Line", which goes into depleting fish resources, and they claimed that one of the solutions (fish farming) is in fact counterproductive to rebounding a lost culture. The reasoning is that there is more fish meal being devoured which inevitably causes problems in the food chain.

Is there a real basis for this claim?

Is farming the wrong way to rebound a culture that is bordering on extinction?
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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In fact I spend more time in the outdoors outside of work than anyone here-the Salish Sea is a 2 minute bike ride away from my home.

That's why I reject the slavish mentality of those who have money as their god and endlessly pollute this forum with their transparent lies, prevarications and worse.

Over two decades as an activist in the conservation movement here in BC have taught me that some people just don't get it-as evidenced by the endlessly repetitive garbage posted here by the usual compromised suspects.

You just described yourself. A know nothing city slicker mouthpiece for the anti work rich and famous.
Lets see if you can find ONE farmed fish that has sea lice when it hit the salt water.
Even easier- find one logging site on the coast that looks like a moonscape other than the concrete jungle you live in that is supported by resource industry workers around the province. Good luck.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
117,690
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Low Earth Orbit
Over two decades as an activist in the conservation movement here in BC have taught me that some people just don't get it-as evidenced by the endlessly repetitive garbage posted here by the usual compromised suspects.
What have you conserved so far?
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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Question for you Tonn.. I was watching a documentary the other day: "End of the Line", which goes into depleting fish resources, and they claimed that one of the solutions (fish farming) is in fact counterproductive to rebounding a lost culture. The reasoning is that there is more fish meal being devoured which inevitably causes problems in the food chain.

Is there a real basis for this claim?

Is farming the wrong way to rebound a culture that is bordering on extinction?

That sort of depends on how you look at it. Fish is an important food source for the entire world therefore growing fish as food helps ease the preasure on wild stocks. Along with that is the need to enhance habitat for wild stocks to reproduce which has been sadly destroyed by building cities. There are also many small hatcheries that are helping the native stocks reproduce. One of our biggest problems is that our salmon tend to wonder around the world so no matter what we do here they are fair game for other countries. Add in the overfishing here by the commercial sport fishery where the rich pay $500+/day to catch a big fish, Often smaller ones are tossed back dead when a larger one is caught to keep within the limit. Also catch and release kills many fish.
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
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Question for you Tonn.. I was watching a documentary the other day: "End of the Line", which goes into depleting fish resources, and they claimed that one of the solutions (fish farming) is in fact counterproductive to rebounding a lost culture.

The reasoning is that there is more fish meal being devoured which inevitably causes problems in the food chain.

That's wrong for a number of reasons. The first and most obvious is that the majority of fish farming is not of carnivorous species. Here's some aquaculture stats for 2010 production data, from the FAO. Roughly 16 million tonnes of production was aquatic plants. Over 20 million tonnes is carp production. A little over 13 million tonnes is mollusc production. Tilapia was about 3.2 million tonnes. Atlantic salmon is 1.5 million tonnes...and there are plenty of other species in there as well.

To lump salmon aquaculture in with all other aquaculture is foolish; the vast majority is herbivorous or autotrophs. What's more, as I've told Barilko, the percentage of fish meal in aquaculture diets is actually dropping, without compromising the growth of the Atlantic salmon. It will continue to drop, as more research is done on alternative proteins. A fellow graduate of my program is doing her Masters in Saskatchewan right now, and has been in Norway learning about marine proteins from phytoplankton. It's conceivable that in the future, the omega fatty acids and amino acids will be sourced entirely from marine algae. Fish meal is in high demand, and not just from aquaculture. I've long thought that this presents an opportunity for savvy entrepreneurs (Phytoplankton need carbon dioxide...carbon credits for start-up capital?)

Also, farmed salmon are actually more efficient at converting the fish meal in their diets into biomass. You'll frequently see figures thrown around like 4 kilograms of fish meal for 1 kg of farmed Atlantic salmon. But consider that for wild salmon, the it takes 4.5 kilograms of prey to make 0.45 kilograms of salmon. So, in actuality, your net fish consumption is lower when you eat farmed Atlantic salmon. Anyone who denies this is denying basic physiology of fishes. Though this is also part of the source of the difference in taste. Farmed Atlantic salmon are lazy couch potatoes compared to the marathon swimming wild salmon.

More than that, there is another opportunity that regulators are avoiding. Anyone who eats sea food should know about the two nasty words joined by a hyphen...by-catch. By changing the regulations to include by-catch in the quotas for all fisheries, regulators could simultaneously make ocean eco-systems stronger, while using that "undesirable" portion of the catch for producing fish oil and fish meal, which is a high value product. By-catch is not accurately reported at all, but I can tell you as someone who has been an at-sea Observer, it's not a small percentage of the catch. So, on top of the large withdrawals of the target species biomass, fishers are also removing much of the biodiversity in the by-catch that is discarded, and for the most part, dies.

I've harped on a number of times about the ridiculousness of the models that most natural resources managers use, for max sustainable yield. There's nothing sustainable about it. It's a failure. Smarter policy will go a long way towards making capture fisheries, and aquaculture more sustainable.

But really, anyone who says aquaculture is counter-productive....they're either very ignorant, or very ideological.

There are also many small hatcheries that are helping the native stocks reproduce.

Good point. I didn't even mention the rejuvenation projects.
 

bill barilko

Senate Member
Mar 4, 2009
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One of our biggest problems is that our salmon tend to wonder around the world so no matter what we do here they are fair game for other countries.
WTH?

What stocks are those?

Add in the overfishing here by the commercial sport fishery where the rich pay $500+/day to catch a big fish, Often smaller ones are tossed back dead when a larger one is caught to keep within the limit.

The practice as bolded I have never seen in 35+years of sportfishing in BC.


FYI $500/day is enough for a small skiff but not a real charter boat-typical know nothing garbage from someone who has never fished.

This Grady White is usually $1,200/day just for the boat & guide-sorry to interject some real life blood & guts to this girlie fest.



 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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Ontario
The practice as bolded I have never seen in 35+years of sportfishing in BC.
I've seen it on the Vedder. The Bow in Alberta. The Ganny in Ontario and so on.

It happens everywhere.

Anyone that says it doesn't, is lying, or seriously deluded.

FYI $500/day is enough for a small skiff but not a real charter boat-typical know nothing garbage from someone who has never fished.
Adam's fishing Charters out of Victoria, can put you in a sweet big ass boat, for around $700 a day, $500 for a half day.

This is Grady White is usually $1,200/day just for the boat & guide-sorry to interject some real life blood & guts to this girlie fest.
The one having a girlie fest, is you.

I've never seen a more whiny, bitter biatch on this board.
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
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FYI $500/day is enough for a small skiff but not a real charter boat-typical know nothing garbage from someone who has never fished.

This Grady White is usually $1,200/day just for the boat & guide-sorry to interject some real life blood & guts to this girlie fest.

He said $500+ a day, do you know what $500+ a day means.

+

That symbol means....plus, addition, so he's saying $500 at least...dumbass
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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WTH?

What stocks are those?



The practice as bolded I have never seen in 35+years of sportfishing in BC.


FYI $500/day is enough for a small skiff but not a real charter boat-typical know nothing garbage from someone who has never fished.

This Grady White is usually $1,200/day just for the boat & guide-sorry to interject some real life blood & guts to this girlie fest.




Never been out on the ocean have you? Since I spent most of my life working the North Island and Mid Coast I have been in many sport fishing camps and if you looked at their add $500 is kind of a starting point. .That gets you two people to a boat, no guide and a stay in the camp.Take your little boat, put 3 people on board and that works out to less than $500. $1200 with 3 people on board is $400 each. Even cheaper. You can probably even add that up on your fingers. Also I bet I have caught and gutted more tons of salmon than you have ever seen. And yes it is common practice for a guide to throw a 20 lb salmon back so his tourist can keep a larger one.Most American tourists will do it on their own.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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Ontario
Never been out on the ocean have you?
I have, and I prefer my river fishing.

The use of 20+lbs test, pool cues for rods and just floating around waiting for the boat to find fish, isn't sporting IMHO.

I run 6lbs tippets for Salmon, on a 13' noodle rod. 4lbs tippets, on my 15', for Steelies. I don't need a guide, I know how to read the river, and walk Kms of bush to find good cuts, runs and holes.
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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I have, and I prefer my river fishing.

The use of 20+lbs test, pool cues for rods and just floating around waiting for the boat to find fish, isn't sporting IMHO.

I run 6lbs tippets for Salmon, on a 13' noodle rod. 4lbs tippets, on my 15', for Steelies. I don't need a guide, I know how to read the river, and walk Kms of bush to find good cuts, runs and holes.

I kind of like seine boats myself. Mostly because I don't enjoy fishing all that much as a hobby. I just view it as food collection. Also big boats have big engines and I am kind of partial to pistons.
 

bill barilko

Senate Member
Mar 4, 2009
6,038
582
113
Vancouver-by-the-Sea
Attended a lecture slideshow about Herring last night-looks like net pen feedlots dumps are infecting not just Wild Salmon but Herring as well.

Herring from around Powell River-which migrate north through through the same waters polluted by net pens as collapsed Wild Salmon stocks have..........wait for it......been found to have abnormal sea lice levels; Herring that migrate south around the bottom of Vancouver Island and through the Straight of Juan de Fuca have started to rebound Thanks to efforts by volunteers to rebuild spawning areas and thus strengthen stocks-their sea lice levels are normal.

The story of the gross environmental destruction wreaked by aquaculture feedlots is only starting to be told but one only has to look @ the Chilean story to see where we're headed unless these vermin parking lots are deep sixed.