Is penal labour acceptable?

[GreenFish66]

Good paying work that allows people to Live a Long and Rewarding Lifestyle is all most are looking for ..Hard to find ...More so every year ..

Good payin work will keep most out of Poverty/Prison ... Most just aren't given the chance..Get's harder and Harder every year to find Good work that pays a living wage..( Without a Top Notch Education and Families of Priveledge)

Perhaps it's time to give those who have more $$$ than they could possibly spend in 15 lifetimes, a chance to Spread the wealth a little more..( a lot more )

More Philanthropists needed..

http://giving.wordpress.com/2011/02...sts-give-smallest-amount-in-2010-news-2-7-11/ - Top Philanthropists Gave less in past 2 years..

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/02/08/the-top-philanthropists-o_n_454215.html - 50 Top Philanthropists ..

Live Long and Prosper...

 

[JLM]

I do not believe in forced labour in the 19th century or communist way, but I DO believe that honest work by inmates would help them to rehabilitate and earn self-respect and so, smaller chance of re-offending after being released.

I don't believe in forced labour either, but if you are of sound mind and able body and have no other income it should be a prerequisite for eating! :lol:

 

[YukonJack]

As long as they get payed for the work they do...So when they are released back into the public, they can afford rent and food... Some help to get back on their feet ...Or.. they will more than likely, just Cycle back into the lifestyle they know best..

Democratic Socialism works best, for people with nothing .Give them the chance to " Step Up " to Financial Freedom( If there is still such a thing)( If the Controling Capitalists will allow it.. )

They DO get paid for work, although the pay rate is rather meager, by outsider standards. However, if a convict has a computer (with no internet access allowed) or a TV, or a stereo or anything else, it is because that item was purchased by the convict with the funds he earned.

Some medium and minimum security prisons provide and encourage inmates to budget, buy their own groceries, cleaning supplies, do their own laundry, cook their own meals, grow their own vegetables in the summer on allotted garden areas and get prepared for the eventual release to society.

The inmates who choose to apply themselves will probably not re-offend. So, giving a chance to inmates to work will pay off in the long run, while FORCED labour would probably have a negative impact.

I don't believe in forced labour either, but if you are of sound mind and able body and have no other income it should be a prerequisite for eating! :lol:

I hope you mean that not only for convicts but also for everybody 'outside'.

 

[Unforgiven]

Any forced labour is slavery. No we don't need to have slavery in this country.

 

[petros]

I hate to say it but jail has never "helped" a single person. EVER. We have to do something about those who are wired wrong but what?

 

[GreenFish66]

I've heard of inmates working Yukon Jack ..Never heard of anyone getting payed..Or walking outta prison with ...Computer's ...Tv's..etc..Besides ...Where would they keep them ? ...Probably have to sell it all for food and 1 night in a hotel ...

There's no pay for inmates in Ontario ...Maybe in the Yukon ..Jack ...
Last I heard, Inmates got a canteen..All are required to do some sort of work ...( jammery/Cutin grass at park/Kitchen duty/Cleaning with No pay ( should be hourly)
...All inmates ( with exception of Dangerous offenders/Inmates in protective Custody) are treated Equal( for good reason ) ...

Loose/Gain priveledges depending on behaviour..

 

[petros]

They don't get paid cash they get paid in canteen credits to buy Mr. Noodles.

 

[GreenFish66]

They don't get paid cash they get paid in canteen credits to buy Mr. Noodles.

About $10 - $20 .. For chips...Mints...( cigarettes, once upon a time )...etc...All get the same ..

 

[captain morgan]

I hate to say it but jail has never "helped" a single person. EVER. We have to do something about those who are wired wrong but what?

It's helped those people that were victimized by an individual/group... But getting to the point of the OP, prison is supposed to represent a punishment, not just a place to kill time and learn more tricks of the trade from co-villains.

 

[petros]

About $10 - $20 .. For chips...Mints...( cigarettes, once upon a time )...etc...All get the same ..

$3 a day if you are lucky enough to be the guy who pushes brrom. Other than that it takes friends and family to put money in your canteen acct.

It's helped those people that were victimized by an individual/group... But getting to the point of the OP, prison is supposed to represent a punishment, not just a place to kill time and learn more tricks of the trade from co-villains.

Two choices. Fund mental health properly or pay for psych staff in the correction system. Take your pick.

 

[captain morgan]

Although everyone will blame a psyc condition for their crime, the majority are not subject to such.

On that note, if those that are mentally unstable enough to run amok and commit crimes, then what's the solution to that?.. Lock them in an asylum and assume they can not function in society?

 

[petros]

Really? Got stats?

Although everyone will blame a psyc condition for their crime, the majority are not subject to such.

On that note, if those that are mentally unstable enough to run amok and commit crimes, then what's the solution to that?.. Lock them in an asylum and assume they can not function in society?

Check the crime stats for Vancouver after they shut down the big looney bin in Coquitlam

 

[captain morgan]

Considering that the psyc community and labeled damn near everything as a 'condition', perhaps we ought to define what isn't considered a mental health issue before we investigate this.

 

[YukonJack]

I hate to say it but jail has never "helped" a single person. EVER. We have to do something about those who are wired wrong but what?

There were, have been and always will be people who either met the wrong crowd, did a sudden regrettable crime, got convicted and ended up in jail. Should they be written off forever as a lost cause? Or should they be given a chance for redemption?

Not surprisingly, I disagree with petros, that jail never, EVER 'helped' anyone. In almost every human being, there is the possibility of being wired right, and those who are in jail are not necessarily 'wired wrong'. And, so jails can help if they are the instruments of not only punishment, but also correction.

Let us face it: Harsh and conclusive opinions would not be so harsh and conclusive if the convict was one of our loved ones.

It has been said that idle hands are the devil's best friend. So, keep those hands busy, but pay an honest wage for honest work. That is the way towards redemption.

 

[petros]

Considering that the psyc community and labeled damn near everything as a 'condition', perhaps we ought to define what isn't considered a mental health issue before we investigate this.

mAybe we should treat them all and then figure out who doesn't need it after?

 

[captain morgan]

mAybe we should treat them all and then figure out who doesn't need it after?

There's a cost effective solution.

 

[petros]

There were, have been and always will be people who either met the wrong crowd, did a sudden regrettable crime, got convicted and ended up in jail. Should they be written off forever as a lost cause? Or should they be given a chance for redemption?

Not surprisingly, I disagree with petros, that jail never, EVER 'helped' anyone. In almost every human being, there is the possibility of being wired right, and those who are in jail are not necessarily 'wired wrong'. And, so jails can help if they are the instruments of not only punishment, but also correction.

Let us face it: Harsh and conclusive opinions would not be so harsh and conclusive if the convict was one of our loved ones.

It has been said that idle hands are the devil's best friend. So, keep those hands busy, but pay an honest wage for honest work. That is the way towards redemption.

It wouldn't be jail that helped them. It would be their conscience that turns them around. The human brain is where every single crime on the planet has originated from.

Some brains know how to say no, others don't.

It's all 100% in the wiring.

 

[YukonJack]

I've heard of inmates working Yukon Jack ..Never heard of anyone getting payed..Or walking outta prison with ...Computer's ...Tv's..etc..Besides ...Where would they keep them ? ...Probably have to sell it all for food and 1 night in a hotel ...

There's no pay for inmates in Ontario ...Maybe in the Yukon ..Jack ...
Last I heard, Inmates got a canteen..All are required to do some sort of work ...( jammery/Cutin grass at park/Kitchen duty/Cleaning with No pay ( should be hourly)
...All inmates ( with exception of Dangerous offenders/Inmates in protective Custody) are treated Equal( for good reason ) ...

Loose/Gain priveledges depending on behaviour..

Greenfish, I don't know where to start to refute your astonishing ignorance, so I am not going to start. Let me just say that you you don't know what you are talking about, and leave it at that.

 

[captain morgan]

It wouldn't be jail that helped them. It would be their conscience that turns them around. The human brain is where every single crime on the planet has originated from.

That conscience is founded on societal norms/morals and if the societal norm is to apply a punitive solution, then this whole discussion is moot.

Some brains know how to say no, others don't.

Don't forget that there are those that do it for greed and/or material gain.... Everyone knows how to say 'No', it is a matter of priorities.

 

[petros]

What is the societal norm? Theft is a brain disorder. Look it up. Normal people don't steal do they?