Atheists Outscore Believers
- Thread starter Bar Sinister
- Start date
Not nit picking, it's a crucial distinction that has to be understood in reasoned argument, and it's a common source of error. Your faith that your vehicle will stop is an inductive conclusion based on evidence. I assume you understand at least to some degree how brakes work and that you maintain the vehicle properly, and that every other time you've attempted to stop by stepping on the brake pedal, it's worked. It's therefore reasonable to conclude, based on the evidence you have, that it'll stop the next time too. You cannot, I agree, be 100% certain of that, that's just the nature of inductive reasoning, and sometimes machinery fails. In other words, you've tested the proposition a huge number of times that stepping on the brake pedal will stop your vehicle, and it's always worked, so you're justified in concluding there's a very high probability it'll continue to work. Similar logic cannot be applied to religious faith, that kind of evidence just isn't available. The distinction is between an evidence-based and an evidence-free belief, and it's not logically valid to equate the truth content of the former to the latter.
Religion isn't quite as cut & dried as that. From experience I'm pretty sure that "someone" is looking after me. I haven't always had things my way and I have had a fair share of adversity (but I don't have to look far at all to find people who've had worse), but I've very seldom been a victim of the worst case scenario either, so I guess I've been given about the number of challenges that I can handle. That pretty well is my feeling of religion in a nutshell.
I agree religion isn't that cut and dried, though it often claims to be. For instance: Jesus Christ was the son of god, born of virgin, took all the sins of the world onto himself to free humanity from original sin and provide the path to eternal redemption and salvation, died horribly and painfully in that cause, was buried, rose from the dead after three days, promised he'd return, and ascended bodily into heaven. That's the central message of Christianity, and quite apart from the moral revulsion I feel at the claim that my failings can be redeemed by punishing somebody else for them, it strains credulity to the breaking point. It may be true that "someone" is looking after you, though I strongly doubt it, but it raises an impossibly difficult question no religion has ever satisfactorily answered: why doesn't that "someone" take care of everybody as well as it does you?
Having been a part time ambulance attendant at one time, I've seen it once....and the guy survived and couldn't realy look me in the eye afterwards...so I call bullsh*t to those who say it never happens..... To me atheists are just as hypocrites as those "mangeux de ballustre".
Why would anyone believe in God just because they survived a near death experience? And more importantly, what does God have to do with death? It's not the death itself that matters - it's the pain and suffering that comes with it. And regardless if you believe in God or not, you will be suffering the same.
Man....you can think what you will if it makes you feel superior and above it all, ....I realy couldn't care....I'm just relating what I saw first hand!
And so it should be. It's not just the scientific mind, it's any skeptical, critically thinking mind. Subjective personal impressions don't cut it as evidence of god's reality, neuroscience offers too many other possible explanations to justify that conclusion.
And assuming your interpretation of it is correct.
Spade my Friend then you would ave to look at the countries where these religions dominate or are substantial in numbers. That would give a fair idea of my point. I can only go on what i see and news reports from other countries where religious minorities are actively murdered or persecuted and treated as 2nd or low class citizens of that country all because of their beliefs are in the minority- And those are generally but not always Muslim or Hindu nations.
I call bull**** to anyone who uses the terms 'never' or 'always' in anything relating to human behaviour. Liberalman said they always turn to God. As if.
And as i have stated - To follow logic you must also accept the unexplainable. the mystery - Otherwise you are not being logical as my friend Spock would say
In that I think you are in error - a study I recall showed pain reduction in those that had a religious belief system.
That was my point. I didn't say it never happens, I just happen to doubt it always happens.
I happen to not be religious, but I can understand the belief system that others
follow in organized religion. If it gives them comfort, and they're not harming
others in & with their beliefs, then all the power to them. There is more than
enough beauty in this world to amaze anyone, if they'll allow it to happen.
A sunrise on a summer day, or the laughter of a child. The vastness of the
Universe, as opposed to the tiny piece of it that we might consider vast
in itself. The emotions of Love and Wonder. The emptiness in the
passing of a loved one.
In my current occupation, I'm in and out of an institution (helping resolve Plumbing
issues) on a regular basis where I see the genetic misfires imposed on those
folks before birth involving mental & physical hurtles, through no fault of their
own.....and that gives me doubt in any omnipotent and benevolent being.
My doubts are just that though. They're my doubts. I'm not recruiting anyone to my
belief system based on any personal beliefs, or lack there of.
follow in organized religion. If it gives them comfort, and they're not harming
others in & with their beliefs, then all the power to them. There is more than
enough beauty in this world to amaze anyone, if they'll allow it to happen.
A sunrise on a summer day, or the laughter of a child. The vastness of the
Universe, as opposed to the tiny piece of it that we might consider vast
in itself. The emotions of Love and Wonder. The emptiness in the
passing of a loved one.
In my current occupation, I'm in and out of an institution (helping resolve Plumbing
issues) on a regular basis where I see the genetic misfires imposed on those
folks before birth involving mental & physical hurtles, through no fault of their
own.....and that gives me doubt in any omnipotent and benevolent being.
My doubts are just that though. They're my doubts. I'm not recruiting anyone to my
belief system based on any personal beliefs, or lack there of.
