Plutocratic populism. An oxymoron...

Tonington

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... that Tea Partiers are oblivious too. I remarked on this kind of thing once before, people are setting themselves up to be played like fools, by sweet talking politicians.

Scott Brown was elected as the first Tea Party Express endorsed candidate. One of his campaign proposals was to eliminate wasteful government pork. Once elected, he petitions for a back-up engine to be built for the new F-35 JSF that Canada will actually be buying. Now the Pentagon is against this, they already have an engine which won the contract through competition like the other contractors. It's a waste of defense dollars, billions of them. Scott Brown petitions for this because the jobs are going to be in his district.

So, that seems an awful lot like pork...

Anyways, onto the article which prompted this thread:

How billionaires bagged the tea party

The Tea Party movement, which staged an impressive gathering in Washington last week, has often been celebrated as an outpouring of spontaneous populist rage, with hundreds of thousands of ordinary Americans taking to the streets to protest against government meddling in the economy.

In a widely noted recent article in The New Yorker, reporter Jane Mayer calls this populist storyline into question by bringing to light the largely hidden role of Dave and Charles Koch, two brothers whose personal fortune, rooted in the oil industry and manufacturing, puts them in the same league as Bill Gates and Warren Buffett.


As hard-core libertarians who oppose most government social policy, the brothers Koch have given tens of millions of dollars over the years to right-wing think tanks and political-action groups. Their largesse has been instrumental in turning the Tea Party movement into a force in U.S. political life. An adviser to Barack Obama has described it as “a grassroots citizens' movement brought to you by a bunch of oil billionaires.”

The idea of populist billionaires seems, on its face, absurd. The original U.S. populist movement arose in the late 19th century in opposition to big business, especially banks and railways, to argue for greater communal control of key economic decisions. This is exactly the tradition the Kochs have spent a lifetime fighting, spending a king's ransom.

It's an oxymoron, to be sure. I'm still impressed by the irony in a political movement that decries politicians, but still attempts to have them elected. If Scott Brown is the best they have to offer, I fully expect pitch forks at the next rally.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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I read this article on Saturday. Some people feel so threatened by a govt-the US govt, which does all it can to support the corporate agenda. The culture in the US is very different in one way because there are so many rich people and their level of political education is not much higher than the average. But they are politically well organized and succeed in keeping most of their wealth.

Henry Ford made his wad, then he supported foundations. Cash is first and king. Once you make it you give baubles to the underlings, and people love you.
 

taxslave

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Henry Ford also had the good sense to realize that the only way for his cars to ever reach mass market was for workers to be paid enough to purchase them. Most of the tea baggers don't have good sense just lots of money that they don't wish to share.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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Henry Ford also had the good sense to realize that the only way for his cars to ever reach mass market was for workers to be paid enough to purchase them. Most of the tea baggers don't have good sense just lots of money that they don't wish to share.

Most of the tea baggers are ordinary people, they're not rich. It's just a lot of unfocused rage as far as I can tell. With the economy tanking, and Obama wasting time on the Middle East, they have some good reasons, even without financing from rich people.
 

Bcool

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Most of the tea baggers are ordinary people, they're not rich. It's just a lot of unfocused rage as far as I can tell. With the economy tanking, and Obama wasting time on the Middle East, they have some good reasons, even without financing from rich people.

Not unfocused IMO, too many signs with racist pic's & epithets & support of any racist Right Winger not so much of the Right Wing itself.

And the economy tanked because of and during the administration of Bush & his cohorts.

Evil hands steering all this, if you want to buy into conspiracies. Bush wasn't legally elected in 2000, ballot tampering and a co-opted Supreme Court gave him the job, scare and terror tactics plus tons of $$$'s gave it to him in 2004. Those with the ton's of $$$'s then gave him the orders to get the banking & investment rules made even weaker with no protection left for the average American, get as many oil rigs going as possible & d*** the pollution problems, stay in Iraq at all costs & lives - oil, oil!! - then run a pair thick as planks who don't stand a chance for the Rep's and stand back and let the Dem's get handed the fallout for the next four years and make d*** sure the lie is instilled by 2012 that the Dem's did it all, then roll out another Hollywood type like Reagan as the Republican saviour and voila!! Back in again, looking good ready to do baaad things again. :evil4: Beats me!! :canada:
 

dumpthemonarchy

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Well, Bcool, I couldnt argue with most of that, the USA is being very poorly run these days. The land of full tilt fun doesn't seem to be too fun these days. But I also mean that Americans are just so unaware of their political position in all this, which has been totally taken over by plutocratic interests and they can't seem to do much abot it.

In America, Making money is good, making huge amounts of money is best no matter what. There is no concept of the public here for them. The market needs to be restrained in the USA, but doing so seems un-American. Ordinary people struggle and if they lose they are called failures.
 

Bcool

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Well, Bcool, I couldnt argue with most of that, the USA is being very poorly run these days. The land of full tilt fun doesn't seem to be too fun these days. But I also mean that Americans are just so unaware of their political position in all this, which has been totally taken over by plutocratic interests and they can't seem to do much abot it.

In America, Making money is good, making huge amounts of money is best no matter what. There is no concept of the public here for them. The market needs to be restrained in the USA, but doing so seems un-American. Ordinary people struggle and if they lose they are called failures.

And I couldn't argue with most of that either. :lol: So what do you think? Is it the scary word "Socialism" - that came up a lot in that unbelievable fight to kill any health bill, did you notice? Yes, money the more the better and, as you say, if you're an average family/person, if you lose what you have its your fault.

It really is a puzzlement because the vast majority of average Americans are decent, nice, friendly, reasonable people. What happens? :dontknow: :::listening to Eva Cassidy's "God Bless the Child" right now.... Oh my!:::
 

dumpthemonarchy

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And I couldn't argue with most of that either. :lol: So what do you think? Is it the scary word "Socialism" - that came up a lot in that unbelievable fight to kill any health bill, did you notice? Yes, money the more the better and, as you say, if you're an average family/person, if you lose what you have its your fault.

It really is a puzzlement because the vast majority of average Americans are decent, nice, friendly, reasonable people. What happens? :dontknow: :::listening to Eva Cassidy's "God Bless the Child" right now.... Oh my!:::

Americans are nice, but they're kind of thick when it comes to topics like politics. It's all bad they say. Life used to be relatively simple, and suddenly, it's very complicated and their fortress has crumbled. But it takes time to realize what has happened. There's no such thing as socialism for the rich, but that could be what we've got.

They tend to punish losers a little too harshly, but now, with millions of losers and peak oil coming, they may embrace socialistic ideas in order to survive. I wouldn't eat the rich, they're too skinny, but the rich can't just keep on grabbing everything in sight, pushing ordinary people away and saying, "I'm doing it all to protect it from the govt."
 

Bar Sinister

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The so called Tea Party reminds me very much of the early Reform Party. What happened in Canada was that the Reform Party split the right wing vote and allowed three consecutive terms of Liberal government. I can see that happening in the US with moderate republican voters refusing to support Tea Party candidates.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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But the TPs are a much lamer version of the Reform party. At least the Reform party won some seat, the TPs aren't going to win anything. Our system permits a third party to get some power and make some changes, in the USA, third parties wither on the vine.

Reform in Canada was instrumental in reducing the federal deficit, the TPs don't appear to have a constructive platform.
 

Bcool

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The so called Tea Party reminds me very much of the early Reform Party. What happened in Canada was that the Reform Party split the right wing vote and allowed three consecutive terms of Liberal government. I can see that happening in the US with moderate republican voters refusing to support Tea Party candidates.
So what do you envision happening in the Republican Party? I mean, who is going to be the Republican Party, the TP's or the moderates? (I have difficulty in using the word 'moderate' when talking of Republicans - been that way since Goldwater. :iconbiggrin: )

As DTM said, neither of them are going to create a third party. Hmmm.... If they did though, maybe we could sell them on the concept of what great vote getters Can jet ski's are. Tee hee!
___________
 

Bar Sinister

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So what do you envision happening in the Republican Party? I mean, who is going to be the Republican Party, the TP's or the moderates? (I have difficulty in using the word 'moderate' when talking of Republicans - been that way since Goldwater. :iconbiggrin: )

As DTM said, neither of them are going to create a third party. Hmmm.... If they did though, maybe we could sell them on the concept of what great vote getters Can jet ski's are. Tee hee!
___________


I believe it was David Frum who said that if the Republican Party becomes the party of extremism then it is doomed. He did point out that the Republicans might have some success in the short term, but over time adopting the policies of the far right will result in the GOP becoming a fringe party.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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I believe it was David Frum who said that if the Republican Party becomes the party of extremism then it is doomed. He did point out that the Republicans might have some success in the short term, but over time adopting the policies of the far right will result in the GOP becoming a fringe party.

Considering that today, the GOP is set to gain seats from the Dems in the upcoming elections, the short term looks good for them. They were pretty extreme in invading Iraq for no good reason and they are still around. They say there is a lot of ruin in a country, and the GOP are doing their part, and they will do it for a long while.

For the GOP to become a fringe party, that means a third party will have to emerge. And that is very unlikely to happen. Third parties get no traction in the USA because it is seen as wasting your vote.
 

Bar Sinister

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Considering that today, the GOP is set to gain seats from the Dems in the upcoming elections, the short term looks good for them. They were pretty extreme in invading Iraq for no good reason and they are still around. They say there is a lot of ruin in a country, and the GOP are doing their part, and they will do it for a long while.

For the GOP to become a fringe party, that means a third party will have to emerge. And that is very unlikely to happen. Third parties get no traction in the USA because it is seen as wasting your vote.


Frum was aware of the possibility of a GOP comeback in November, but he claimed the passage of the Obama health care bill was the biggest legislative defeat for the Republicans in decades. He further commented that the US is now more liberal than it has ever been and in spite of occasional GOP successes the party is doomed to second place in the long term without a change in policies. You can read what Frum said here.

The Richmonder: David Frum: Republican "Waterloo"

It will be interesting to see if he is right. If he is the Republicans will spend a lot of time in second place.

The Richmonder: David Frum: Republican "Waterloo"
 

dumpthemonarchy

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However, with the USA economy still tanking, Dems are taking on water. But perhaps this is bad news in the short term and the Dems will recover when the economy improves, that day could be long in coming as the USA economy has been overheated for far too long. He's going to have a harder time getting legislative victories with a GOP congress. No sitting prez wins with a slow economy.
 

Bar Sinister

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However, with the USA economy still tanking, Dems are taking on water. But perhaps this is bad news in the short term and the Dems will recover when the economy improves, that day could be long in coming as the USA economy has been overheated for far too long. He's going to have a harder time getting legislative victories with a GOP congress. No sitting prez wins with a slow economy.


Actually both Reagan and G.W. Bush were reelected in during less than impressive economic times. However, Obama does face an uphill fight if the economy does not turn around. It is worth noting though that many of the initiatives the US government has taken will take awhile to work their way through the economy. I mentioned in a previous thread some months ago that Obama's predecessors had spent years creating the problems the current US economy faces and that any fix was going to take a good deal more than one presidential term. We will just have to wait and see what the situation is in two years.