Another Tamil ship on its way to our shores

[Bcool]

Enough already

Yes, indeedy!

These people should be treated well, but at sea, and then turned over to the government they ran from.

Well, that should save us a bundle. All we need give 'em are shovels and shrouds before handing them over.

If we did that once or twice would they keep coming?

Not even twice, 'cos they'd be dead!

these people paid thousands of dollars each, paid in American funds

Know that for a fact do you? Accredited sources please?

so how poor were they in the first place. If they had that kind of money they were not the poverty crowd

Ah! So you don't know.

they are those running from the law and we should confront
them and send them home.

Whose law would that be? The Sri Lankan government's? Well, tut tut on those naughty Tamils, eh! Refusing to be exterminated! Shockin'!! Oh, and where's "home"? Sri Lanka says, between reloading, "Not here!". So where?

The United Nations and others is trying to turn us into
some kind of human SPCA, and I for one have had enough.

Not nearly enough as they have had. Faugh!
_____________________
"There are children standing here,
Arms outstretched into the sky,
Tears drying on their face.
He has been here.
Brothers lie in shallow graves.
Fathers lost without a trace.
A nation blind to their disgrace,
Since he's been here.

And I see no bravery,
No bravery in your eyes anymore...."
"No Bravery" from "back to bedlam" by James Blunt, Custard/Atlantic Records

 

[Ariadne]

So they've found a loophole that gets them into a safe country and out of danger quick as possible?

If they needed to be out of danger as quickly as possible, they didn't need to spent three months on a rusty boat traveling to the other end of the world. They could have gone to the US, Australia, or any number of places, to be quickly out of danger. This was about coming to Canada. Australia would have warehoused them on an island, like other boat people, for a long time before processing and admitting them to the country. In Canada, they are fast tracked, admitted, processed, given instant health care, food, shelter, invitations to people's homes, and integrated into the community ... before heading to Toronto. That loophole. They found a way to completely bypass the normal immigration process. As refugees, they would have no money to pay smugglers, and they would not be turned away using normal application procedures. The fact is they would most likely have been turned down as refugees, and would have had to wait their turn as immigrants (in addition to having a criminal record check, a skill, some language skills, plans, citizenship court).

 

[gerryh]

Australia turned them away.

 

[Ariadne]

Whose law would that be? The Sri Lankan government's? Well, tut tut on those naughty Tamils, eh! Refusing to be exterminated! Shockin'!! Oh, and where's "home"? Sri Lanka says, between reloading, "Not here!". So where?

No can deny that there was a war where atrocities were committed by both sides. What I would question is, at the end of the war, who has enough money and reason to sneak out of the country on a smuggler's boat rather than get on a plane and make a refugee claim? The war was over a year ago.

 

[CUBert]

If they needed to be out of danger as quickly as possible, they didn't need to spent three months on a rusty boat traveling to the other end of the world. They could have gone to the US, Australia, or any number of places, to be quickly out of danger. This was about coming to Canada. Australia would have warehoused them on an island, like other boat people, for a long time before processing and admitting them to the country. In Canada, they are fast tracked, admitted, processed, given instant health care, food, shelter, invitations to people's homes, and integrated into the community ... before heading to Toronto. That loophole. They found a way to completely bypass the normal immigration process. As refugees, they would have no money to pay smugglers, and they would not be turned away using normal application procedures. The fact is they would most likely have been turned down as refugees, and would have had to wait their turn as immigrants (in addition to having a criminal record check, a skill, some language skills, plans, citizenship court).

Ok, they wanted to get out of danger quickly as possible, AND, be treated kindly and humanely.

Please, Australia and the U.S aren't taking them, nevermind giving them fair treatment.

 

[Ariadne]

Australia turned them away.

I hadn't read that. I understood they were planning to sail to Australia, but that changed before they left. Did they already know that they would not be accepted as refugees or new immigrants in Australia?

I say ... put them on a plane and send them home. If they had enough money for a 3 month sailing trip, they have enough money for one more legitimate plane ticket and an immigration application.

Ok, they wanted to get out of danger quickly as possible, AND, be treated kindly and humanely.

Please, Australia and the U.S aren't taking them, nevermind giving them fair treatment.

Australia and the US are both humane countries. The Tamil found the loophole, and entered the country illegally twice, once with 76 and now with 475ish. Australia and the US have apparently fixed their loophole. There was talk about aligning with Thailand so the applicants could be detained there until their claims were legitimized. Sounds like a good idea. That way, if there's a problem, the applicants don't have to travel that far to get back home.

 

[Omicron]

I really don't know what to make of this...and I'm tamil myself.

Did you have to sneak across the border, or declare yourself a refuge?

 

[lone wolf]

Tamil asylum-seekers spark Canadian vitriol, anger - thestar.com

“When the government uses words like smuggling, Tamil Tigers and terrorists, most Canadians assume there is evidence,” said Siemiatycki. “But there isn’t … and making statements like that is irresponsible and does terrible injustice to the people on the boat.”

Smuggling isn't too hard to figure out. The rest are guesses at best.

 

[Ariadne]

Did you have to sneak across the border, or declare yourself a refuge?

Or ... have a particular skill? Alberta has 5000 openings for new immigrants with certain skills. Needing an education is another reason that doors are wide open for legitimate refugee claims and immigration requests.

 

[CUBert]

I hadn't read that. I understood they were planning to sail to Australia, but that changed before they left. Did they already know that they would not be accepted as refugees or new immigrants in Australia?

I say ... put them on a plane and send them home. If they had enough money for a 3 month sailing trip, they have enough money for one more legitimate plane ticket and an immigration application.



Australia and the US are both humane countries. The Tamil found the loophole, and entered the country illegally twice, once with 76 and now with 475ish. Australia and the US have apparently fixed their loophole. There was talk about aligning with Thailand so the applicants could be detained there until their claims were legitimized. Sounds like a good idea. That way, if there's a problem, the applicants don't have to travel that far to get back home.

Check Australia's & U.S.A's history on the treatment of refugees in comparison to Canada's , then you tell me what country you want to come to as a refugee.

And this legality babble is inane when you're talking about lives that are endangered.

 

[Bcool]

If they needed to be out of danger as quickly as possible, they didn't need to spent three months on a rusty boat traveling to the other end of the world. They could have gone to the US, Australia, or any number of places, to be quickly out of danger. This was about coming to Canada.QUOTE]
Tamil asylum-seekers spark Canadian vitriol, anger

Mass hysteria common with large groups of refugees: Expert

“Send them back.” “These boat people are abusing the system, taking us for a ride.”
“So they’ve come from a very bad situation. So what? So do a lot of other people … why should we have to take everyone in?”
Since the MV Sun Sea — the boat carrying 490 Tamil refugees — docked near Victoria on Friday, news websites and call-in radio shows have been inundated with vitriolic comments, media coverage has been sensational and there’s even been a protest against letting the boat into Canadian waters.
Angry people from across the country have accused the asylum-seekers of jumping the immigration queue, being associated with Tamil Tigers — an organization banned by many countries, including Canada — and of being a burden on Canadian taxpayers.
This level of backlash and mass hysteria is unexpected but not unprecedented, say experts.
“It’s is not the first time that the Canadian government has whipped up public anxiety at the arrival of asylum-seekers,” said Myer Siemiatycki, a professor in immigration settlement studies at Ryerson University.
It has happened numerous times but most recently in 1987 when 174 Sikhs landed by boat in Charlesville, N.S., and again in 1999 when some 600 Chinese migrants arrived at the shores of British Columbia.
There was mass hysteria then, just like it is now.
“When the government uses words like smuggling, Tamil Tigers and terrorists, most Canadians assume there is evidence,” said Siemiatycki. “But there isn’t … and making statements like that is irresponsible and does terrible injustice to the people on the boat.”
The Canadian government is partially responsible for stoking this mass hysteria, he added.
What’s playing out “is the sixth or the seventh sequel of some Grade B horror movie called Here Come the Boat People,” said Siemiatycki. “It’s the same thing every time … it’s tiresome, unworthy of Canada.” . . . "


Tamil asylum-seekers spark Canadian vitriol, anger - thestar.com

Tamil asylum-seekers spark Canadian vitriol, anger - thestar.com

__________________________

 

[CUBert]

Smuggling isn't too hard to figure out. The rest are guesses at best.

Canadians, including many people on these forums, have made assumptions already. No proof to back their assumptions of course. "Oh no, terrorists are coming!". Please get your facts straight before forming your opinion, that's all I am saying.

 

[JLM]

are you sure you wanted to admit that in here? Especially since it appears the majority in here seem to feel that if you're Tamil that makes you a terrorist or at the very least a terrorist sympathizer.

Gerry - Since you seem to have a lot to say about how this ship load of refugees and/or terrorists/smugglers are being treated perhaps you can fill us in on exactly what you would do when the next boat load hits our beach. Maybe your ideas are better than the rest of us so we should hear them. :smile:

 

[Ariadne]

Check Australia's & U.S.A's history on the treatment of refugees in comparison to Canada's , then you tell me what country you want to come to as a refugee.

And this legality babble is inane when you're talking about lives that are endangered.

I see ... refugees with a preference, like a 5 star, rather than a 3 star, country?

Are you suggesting that these wealthy Tamil immigrants were in danger a year after the war ended, that they had the luxury of deciding which country would be nicer? Do the Australians and Americans put them on a plane and send them home?

“Send them back.” “These boat people are abusing the system, taking us for a ride.”

Yes, put them on a plane and send them home. Smuggling is illegal, and that illegal transportation is what these people chose (paid for). People that choose illegal means to enter the country should be deterred immediately. They should not be rewarded with Canadian citizenship.

 

[CUBert]

I see ... refugees with a preference, like a 5 star, rather than a 3 star, country?

No, just a country that doesn't turn them away, and actually treats them, like... they're human!
As well, about 400,000 Tamils live in the Greater Toronto Area, (perhaps the largest Sri Lankan diaspora in the world) the refugees could easily have friends and relatives living there.

Are you suggesting that these wealthy Tamil immigrants were in danger a year after the war ended, that they had the luxury of deciding which country would be nicer? Do the Australians and Americans put them on a plane and send them home?

Wow, wealthy immigrants. Really? :lol:

 

[Ariadne]

Canadians, including many people on these forums, have made assumptions already. No proof to back their assumptions of course. "Oh no, terrorists are coming!". Please get your facts straight before forming your opinion, that's all I am saying.

There's no question that this was a smuggling boat that illegally entered Canada. I don't see this a situation of "terrorist fearmongering". I see this more as an illegal act by people that had enough money for a 3 month comfortable, clean, healthy, well cared for sailing trip. After years of living in a war torn country, where atrocities were committed by both sides, this group chose to pay far more than the cost of airfare in an attempt to sneak into the country.

Doesn't it seem like there's something wrong with this picture?

No, just a country that doesn't turn them away, and actually treats them, like... they're human!
As well, about 400,000 Tamils live in the Greater Toronto Area, (perhaps the largest Sri Lankan diaspora in the world) the refugees could easily have friends and relatives living there.



Wow, wealthy immigrants. Really? :lol:

I'm eagerly awaiting the cost of this smuggling excursion. What's the going per person rate for 3 months at sea to a nice place like Canada? If the rate is cheap, then we should expect Ceylon to empty into Canada in no time.

Landed immigrants in Canada usually sponsor extended family without too many difficulties. If these Tamil boat people have family in Toronto, why can't that family legitimately sponsor extended family? Wouldn't that be faster, cheaper, and better?

 

[gerryh]

Gerry - Since you seem to have a lot to say about how this ship load of refugees and/or terrorists/smugglers are being treated perhaps you can fill us in on exactly what you would do when the next boat load hits our beach. Maybe your ideas are better than the rest of us so we should hear them. :smile:

What the government is doing right now is fine with me. Detention untill we know the disposition of the individuals and then integration for the legitimate refuges, charges laid and trial for those that are determined to be smugglers and/or terrorists.

 

[Bcool]

I see ... refugees with a preference, like a 5 star, rather than a 3 star, country?

Are you suggesting that these wealthy Tamil immigrants were in danger a year after the war ended, that they had the luxury of deciding which country would be nicer? Do the Australians and Americans put them on a plane and send them home?

Yes, put them on a plane and send them home. Smuggling is illegal, and that illegal transportation is what these people chose (paid for). People that choose illegal means to enter the country should be deterred immediately. They should not be rewarded with Canadian citizenship.

Why would "wealthy" "5 star" people choose to travel on an unsafe, overcrowded, rusty boat?

Why don't you surf to the US & Australia's gov web sites and get the official policies regarding refugees yourself and post them here? Bet you won't. :?

Canadian Citizenship takes five years to earn, passing a test and requires a judge's approval.

<sigh>
______________________

 

[Ariadne]

Why would "wealthy" "5 star" people choose to travel on an unsafe, overcrowded, rusty boat?

Why don't you surf to the US & Australia's gov web sites and get the official policies regarding refugees yourself and post them here? Bet you won't. :?

Canadian Citizenship takes five years to earn, passing a test and requires a judge's approval.

<sigh>
______________________

No, I won't search out and post official policies that interest you.

These are not refugees. These are people that chose, and paid for, an illegal method to enter the country.

People that are quickly escaping danger jump into the water, they don't pay to sail to the opposite end of the earth. These people seem to have experienced what is normally expected on a crowded transport ship. The duration of the trip does not seem to have effected anyone's good health.

"Despite the dearth of room, Johnston described a well-organized, relatively clean ship with separate sleeping spaces for men and women and children, an eating area and a waste-disposal system. The boat was stocked with dried fish, bags of rice, water and juice, he said, and those on board appeared well-fed and dressed.

...

Of those already counted, more than 350 were men, more than 50 were women and about as many were minors ... health officials have found no indication of communicable diseases ... Of those, only six — four women and two children — were admitted to hospital, including two pregnant women, but none have serious conditions and they are expected to be released soon."

Migrants healthy; boat was well-organized, if cramped

Citizenship court is a very good thing. New citizens have to know something about the country, they cannot have a criminal record in the previous five years, and then they get coffee and treats. What's wrong with that?
​

What the government is doing right now is fine with me. Detention untill we know the disposition of the individuals and then integration for the legitimate refuges, charges laid and trial for those that are determined to be smugglers and/or terrorists.

Who is going to pay for all that? Why should Canada do this?

Should we house, feed, provide health care and educational opportunities to these individuals and then pay for trials to prove that they entered the country illegally, or should we excuse all the people that entered the country illegally and only focus on the smugglers and terrorists ... and for what purpose should someone pay for this trial?

 

[CUBert]

Someone on the ship had died, looks like you have some erroneous information my friend.