How do you perceive 'tradition'?

[Machjo]

Sometimes when someone proposes we change something, many will stand up against it on 'traditional grounds', apparently forgetting that the very thing they're trying to preserve may have come about via change in the first place. This applies to all aspects of life. At one time, Canada, or even the UK, or even the Roman Empire, did not even exist. They came about through evolution. I can also guarantee that the first Jews, or the First Christians, or the First Muslims were by no means traditionalists, or they would never have adopted a new religion. Everything changes.

When I consider that everything is in a constant state of change, that even national anthems have a beginning and have often undergone constant evolution themselves, it would seem to me that change itself is traditional, that change itself is a part of tradition, and that looking at it that way, those who propose we 'freeze frame' are in fact non-traditional in that they're trying to introduce something that has never existed. By calling themselves traditional though, it's as if they're trying to rewrite history by pretending that all that is today has always been and that change has never occurred throughout history.

So what is your view of 'tradition'?

 

[Northboy]

Sometimes when someone proposes we change something, many will stand up against it on 'traditional grounds', apparently forgetting that the very thing they're trying to preserve may have come about via change in the first place. This applies to all aspects of life. At one time, Canada, or even the UK, or even the Roman Empire, did not even exist. They came about through evolution. I can also guarantee that the first Jews, or the First Christians, or the First Muslims were by no means traditionalists, or they would never have adopted a new religion. Everything changes.

When I consider that everything is in a constant state of change, that even national anthems have a beginning and have often undergone constant evolution themselves, it would seem to me that change itself is traditional, that change itself is a part of tradition, and that looking at it that way, those who propose we 'freeze frame' are in fact non-traditional in that they're trying to introduce something that has never existed. By calling themselves traditional though, it's as if they're trying to rewrite history by pretending that all that is today has always been and that change has never occurred throughout history.

So what is your view of 'tradition'?

I myself am a ten commandments guy.
I broke one and paid the price.
Everything after that is tradition. In my opinion.

 

[L Gilbert]

I think Merriam-Webster has a decent idea about tradition:

Main Entry: tra·di·tion
Pronunciation: \trə-ˈdi-shən\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English tradicioun, from Middle French & Latin; Middle French tradicion, from Latin tradition-, traditio action of handing over, tradition — more at treason
Date: 14th century
1 a : an inherited, established, or customary pattern of thought, action, or behavior (as a religious practice or a social custom) b : a belief or story or a body of beliefs or stories relating to the past that are commonly accepted as historical though not verifiable
2 : the handing down of information, beliefs, and customs by word of mouth or by example from one generation to another without written instruction
3 : cultural continuity in social attitudes, customs, and institutions
4 : characteristic manner, method, or style <in the best liberal tradition>

IOW, if it makes sense, it's applicable. If it doesn't make sense, it's irrelevant.

 

[Machjo]

I myself am a ten commandments guy.
I broke one and paid the price.
Everything after that is tradition. In my opinion.

Yet even the ten commandments can be viewed as traditional or not. After all, adultery is just as 'traditional', likewise with murder. I believe in following the ten commandments too, but not out of blind tradition but because they make sense.

 

[Northboy]

I think Merriam-Webster has a decent idea about tradition:

IOW, if it makes sense, it's applicable. If it doesn't make sense, it's irrelevant.

Remember my Kingdom Code poem?

That was mine.

 

[Machjo]

I think Merriam-Webster has a decent idea about tradition:

IOW, if it makes sense, it's applicable. If it doesn't make sense, it's irrelevant.

Good definitions there. However, this would also suggest that we should not preserve a tradition for tradition's sake, but rather because that particular tradition continues to make sense. This would also imply that as society changes, as some traditions become no longer applicable, they ought to be dropped. Even Christians should be able to understand this when we consider how many Jewish traditions Jesus scrapped, such as the Sabbath and the Law of Divorce.

 

[L Gilbert]

Good definitions there. However, this would also suggest that we should not preserve a tradition for tradition's sake, but rather because that particular tradition continues to make sense. This would also imply that as society changes, as some traditions become no longer applicable, they ought to be dropped. Even Christians should be able to understand this when we consider how many Jewish traditions Jesus scrapped, such as the Sabbath and the Law of Divorce.

It would be the progressive thing to do. Leave the outmoded traditions to the historians.

 

[Spade]

I myself am a ten commandments guy.
I broke one and paid the price.
Everything after that is tradition. In my opinion.

If you haven't admitted to have broken at least five, you are being less than honest.

 

[Machjo]

It's funny too that one should equate religion with tradition. I can guarantee that the first Jews were anything but traditional. Same with the first Christians and the First Muslims, etc. After all, a traditionalist would blindly adhere to his traditional religion, not adopt a new faith. Looking at it that way, true religion is anything but traditional.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Many traditions started for very good reasons. I have nothing but respect for those who start traditions; usually they are astute observers of human nature.

However, it is important to ask the question, is the reason why the tradition started also valid today? Does the tradition make sense today? If it doesn’t, then away with it. In that respect, I am very much a non traditionalist or even an anti-traditionalist.

If a tradition doesn’t make sense, I don’t see any point in keeping it.

 

[Machjo]

Many traditions started for very good reasons. I have nothing but respect for those who start traditions; usually they are astute observers of human nature.

However, it is important to ask the question, is the reason why the tradition started also valid today? Does the tradition make sense today? If it doesn’t, then away with it. In that respect, I am very much a non traditionalist or even an anti-traditionalist.

If a tradition doesn’t make sense, I don’t see any point in keeping it.

But then here's the oxymoron: is it possible to start a tradition? I'd say that a tradition doesn't really start but merely appears once its original reason for being is forgotten.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Let me give you example of a very interesting tradition. A few years ago I was having idle chat with an Indian over a beer and he told me of a tradition in India. When a woman is undergoing her menstrual cycle, she is shunned by everybody. Menstruation is supposed to be unclean, and the woman is supposed to be unclean while she is menstruating. So nobody is supposed to touch her, she is not supposed to touch anything; she must live separately from others. Her meals are brought to her.

I thought about it for a bit and told him my opinion, that the man (and of course it had to be a man) who started the tradition was probably a Feminist, an advocate of women’s rights. He seems astounded by my assertion.

So I told him, forget about menstruation being unclean, just look at the results. The woman gets a complete rest for three days; she gets her meals handed to her. In the old days, women’s lives were hard, they worked practically non stop from sun up to sundown. This tradition guaranteed every woman three days of total rest, total relaxation every month.

But if he had told the society to give women three days of vacation every month, nobody would have agreed to it. He played into societal prejudice against women, and came up with a tradition beneficial to women.

I asked him if it is still observed today, and he replied in the negative.

 

[Bar Sinister]

But then here's the oxymoron: is it possible to start a tradition? I'd say that a tradition doesn't really start but merely appears once its original reason for being is forgotten.

Of course traditions can be started. They all had to begin somewhere. A good example of this are the numerous Christmas traditions now practiced in Canada. Many of them began as customs among certain ethnic groups, but have been taken over by the mainstream population and become part of Canadian tradition. Canada is riddled with traditions of this sort due to its great ethnic diversity.

 

[Johnnny]

Tradition in my opinion, is non material cultural that cant be seen but experienced, it changes with the time or gets left behind in time

 

[JLM]

Sometimes when someone proposes we change something, many will stand up against it on 'traditional grounds', apparently forgetting that the very thing they're trying to preserve may have come about via change in the first place. This applies to all aspects of life. At one time, Canada, or even the UK, or even the Roman Empire, did not even exist. They came about through evolution. I can also guarantee that the first Jews, or the First Christians, or the First Muslims were by no means traditionalists, or they would never have adopted a new religion. Everything changes.

When I consider that everything is in a constant state of change, that even national anthems have a beginning and have often undergone constant evolution themselves, it would seem to me that change itself is traditional, that change itself is a part of tradition, and that looking at it that way, those who propose we 'freeze frame' are in fact non-traditional in that they're trying to introduce something that has never existed. By calling themselves traditional though, it's as if they're trying to rewrite history by pretending that all that is today has always been and that change has never occurred throughout history.

So what is your view of 'tradition'?

I guess typical tradition would be gettng drunk on New Years Eve.

 

[Machjo]

Of course traditions can be started. They all had to begin somewhere. A good example of this are the numerous Christmas traditions now practiced in Canada. Many of them began as customs among certain ethnic groups, but have been taken over by the mainstream population and become part of Canadian tradition. Canada is riddled with traditions of this sort due to its great ethnic diversity.

Ok, you're right. All traditions have a beginning. But they're not traditions initially. They simply become traditions over time. So all traditions start, but not as traditions. Tradition develops over continued use.

 

[talloola]

many traditions wear out with time, and are only applicable
to the century or particular time period they were decided
upon.

eg. the right to bear arms in the u.s., has caused that
country today to be close to a war with it's own border,
from drugs and gangs and all of those who choose to carry
a gun, 'just because', or those 'who are scared' and carry
a gun for protection, the law is just a joke, they can't
possibly keep up with the gun slinging population.

when the law was established, it was a totally different time and country, and guns were needed for everyday living,
killing for food, and of course it has evolved to what
they have today, a country bursting at the seams with guns.

 

[VanIsle]

Of course traditions can be started. They all had to begin somewhere. A good example of this are the numerous Christmas traditions now practiced in Canada. Many of them began as customs among certain ethnic groups, but have been taken over by the mainstream population and become part of Canadian tradition. Canada is riddled with traditions of this sort due to its great ethnic diversity.

Do you really believe that is still true? Christmas is not the tradition it once was. Instead of looking forward to it as a happy family time (and in our life time that was what it always used to be) no one seems to know how to handle this "tradition" anymore. Tradition to me is - celebrating all the holidays that I grew up with as a born in Canada Canadian. I don't want to say things like "Happy Holidays" because someone deceided it was the PC thing to do. Tradition to me is also the foods we serve during those certain holidays in each of our homes. Stores prepare for those by having turkey, cranberry's, yams, stuffing etc. etc. in abundance to sell because those are the traditional foods for times like Christmas and Thanksgiving. Some people have turkey again at Easter but most eat Ham. Those are traditions. The ten commandments are a way of life. Not a tradition. I get up, shower, dress and have my coffee everyday. That's a way of life - not tradition.
Christmas may be celebrated many ways but - how? If you are going to celebrate Christmas you either celebrate it via being very religious about it along with the tree, gifts and family & friends and the big meal or you leave out the religion and do all the rest. It is our traditional Christmas. What other way would be or could be a traditional Canadian Christmas? (or even a traditional USA Christmas). The only thing different would be the foods that some people equate with Christmas. We seem to add in things that may be of German descent more frequently than other nations. I don't know why other than it may seem to some people as being close to what we ourselves are used to or have become used to.

 

[Liberalman]

Tradition is a mindless repetition of an event

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Tradition is a mindless repetition of an event

Quite so. But that doesn't man that traditions are always meaningless. Sometimes they can serve useful purpose.