The devotion to God alone

[eanassir]

There are a lot of persons who think they are God but how do you tell which is the real one? :lol::lol::lol: I have yet to meet one who fits the criteria.:lol::lol::lol:

Some psychiatric patients said this. And Pharaoh said he is their god on earth, while God is the god of heavens.

But God is the Creator, Who is Unique and cannot be seen by the sight. Neither is He any man or like man; He is greater than the heavens and the earth.

The thing said about meeting with God: it means to go to the next spiritual afterlife and to meet the reward.

 

[Niflmir]

On the other hand, not every public act is hypocrisy: if man for example expends for God's sake but that act was in public, then it is not hypocrisy: if his intention within himself is to seek God's good pleasure;

but if he intends only to show people, then it is the hypocrisy. It means: he is not a believer in fact, he only shows to people , and not for God's sake.

Maintaining this dichotomy requires the belief that the god is not a person. Which you have unequivocably stated otherwise. Ergo, to maintain your belief system, either

a. You do not believe there to be a real god.
b. You believe yourself to be a hypocrite.
c. You never do good deeds.
d. You do not believe the things you say.

 

[eanassir]

Maintaining this dichotomy requires the belief that the god is not a person. Which you have unequivocably stated otherwise. Ergo, to maintain your belief system, either

a. You do not believe there to be a real god.
b. You believe yourself to be a hypocrite.
c. You never do good deeds.
d. You do not believe the things you say.

The answer to this MCQ is:
All the above are wrong. :smile:

 

[Cliffy]

The answer to this MCQ is:
All the above are wrong. :smile:

Anybody who needs to publicly declare their religious beliefs is a hypocrite. Your relationship to your god is a personal matter. By speaking out in public tells me that your faith is built on quicksand.

 

[Niflmir]

Anybody who needs to publicly declare their religious beliefs is a hypocrite. Your relationship to your god is a personal matter. By speaking out in public tells me that your faith is built on quicksand.

His statements are mere words, put into his mouth by other people. When confronted with actual thoughts he merely runs and hides.

 

[Niflmir]

The answer to this MCQ is:
All the above are wrong. :smile:

Well, since you did not take the time to actually defend yourself against the logical conclusions of your own beliefs, I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and label you a hypocrite.

Welcome to the club of hypocrites, at least you do good deeds.

 

[eanassir]

We see what we believe we'll see. If we believe in angels, we see angels; aliens, we see aliens; animal spirits, we see animal spirits; demons, we see demons, nothing, we see nothing; etc, etc. You believe in gods, you will find all kinds of "evidence" for their existence, if you don't, you will find no evidence for them. That is about as simple as it gets. Belief determines reality.

This is not always true.
E.g. the sun is there; will you not believe in its existence? This is up to you :roll:

 

[eanassir]

His statements are mere words, put into his mouth by other people. When confronted with actual thoughts he merely runs and hides.

The hypocrite is the one who says: I believe in God and His apostle; while in fact he does not believe; he is a disbeliever in reality, but a believer only before people: to cheat people.

In other words: he pretends to be a believer, while in fact he is a disbeliever.

Therefore, his righteous work is only to show others; he is not doing that for God's sake; but to live in this way: really he is a disbeliever, while apparently he is a believer; this is the definition.

 

[eanassir]

Well, since you did not take the time to actually defend yourself against the logical conclusions of your own beliefs, I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and label you a hypocrite.

Welcome to the club of hypocrites, at least you do good deeds.

This is not up to you or anyone else to decide this one is a hypocrite or that one is a believer or a disbeliever; it is up to God alone Who knows the hearts of men.

I think there is some misunderstanding of the word "hypocrite": the hypocrite by definition is the one that pretends he is a believer in God and His apostle while in fact he is not any believer: in other words: he is a disbeliever in reality, but before people he is a believer.

Therefore, his work is not for God's sake, but for the sake of showing to people only; so he will not be rewarded for his apparent righteous work, but will be punished.

This is in the Quran 2: 8-16 about the hypocrites:​

وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يَقُولُ آمَنَّا بِاللّهِ وَبِالْيَوْمِ الآخِرِ وَمَا هُم بِمُؤْمِنِينَ . يُخَادِعُونَ اللّهَ وَالَّذِينَ آمَنُوا وَمَا يَخْدَعُونَ إِلاَّ أَنفُسَهُم وَمَا يَشْعُرُونَ . فِي قُلُوبِهِم مَّرَضٌ فَزَادَهُمُ اللّهُ مَرَضاً وَلَهُم عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ بِمَا كَانُوا يَكْذِبُونَ . وَإِذَا قِيلَ لَهُمْ لاَ تُفْسِدُواْ فِي الأَرْضِ قَالُواْ إِنَّمَا نَحْنُ مُصْلِحُونَ . أَلا إِنَّهُمْ هُمُ الْمُفْسِدُونَ وَلَـكِن لاَّ يَشْعُرُونَ . وَإِذَا قِيلَ لَهُمْ آمِنُواْ كَمَا آمَنَ النَّاسُ قَالُواْ أَنُؤْمِنُ كَمَا آمَنَ السُّفَهَاء أَلا إِنَّهُمْ هُمُ السُّفَهَاء وَلَـكِن لاَّ يَعْلَمُونَ . وَإِذَا لَقُواْ الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ قَالُواْ آمَنَّا وَإِذَا خَلَوْاْ إِلَى شَيَاطِينِهِمْ قَالُواْ إِنَّا مَعَكْمْ إِنَّمَا نَحْنُ مُسْتَهْزِؤُونَ . اللّهُ يَسْتَهْزِىءُ بِهِمْ وَيَمُدُّهُمْ فِي طُغْيَانِهِمْ يَعْمَهُونَ . أُوْلَـئِكَ الَّذِينَ اشْتَرُوُاْ الضَّلاَلَةَ بِالْهُدَى فَمَا رَبِحَت تِّجَارَتُهُمْ وَمَا كَانُواْ مُهْتَدِينَ

The explanation:
(And of people there are some who say: 'We believe in God and the Last Day', when [really] they believe not.

They think to deceive God and those who believe, and they deceive none save themselves; but they perceive not.

There is a disease [of hypocrisy] in their hearts, and God has increased their disease, and they will have a painful doom because they lie.

And when it is said to them, 'Make not mischief on earth', they say, 'We [actually] are reformers.'

Are not they indeed the mischief-makers? But they perceive not [the truth.]

And when it is said to them: 'Believe as the people believe', they say: 'Shall we believe as the foolish believe?' It is they, indeed, who are the foolish, but they know not.

And when they meet those who believe, they say: 'We believe; but when they are alone with their devils, they say: 'Surely, we are with you; we are –merely – mocking.'

God [Himself] does mock them, offering them [wealth] to let them wander on blindly with their arrogance.

Such are they who exchange error instead of guidance, so their commerce does not prosper, neither are they guided.)


http://quran-ayat.com/​

 

[AnnaG]

Niflmir said that "God isn't a person. Your god is imaginary"; so I said: God is a person, which I mean He is an identity and a real being: a True Being, not a man or to the image of man, as is it written in the Torah of Ezra (the present available Torah) neither is He imaginary or only an idea in the minds as do some allege.

God is the Creator of the Arab and the non-Arab.

lol It's part of human nature to anthropomorphize stuff. That means we project our human characteristics onto things that aren't human.
We also just like to make stuff up.

 

[AnnaG]

Darkbeaver, what most of them repeat and regurgitate other than some ideas of Hitchins and Dawkins; and these latter adopted from others.

And all you do is regurgitate nonsense from Al Hilly and Mohammad. So they do the same thing with the works of people they respect.

 

[AnnaG]

By extension of this hypothesis, since man is created in god's image and god is a person, then god is a hypocrite. The logical flaws in the Quran Or perhaps, eanassir's version of it, are blatantly obvious.

Books are man's invention. Although they are useful objects, they are, non the less, subject to the bias and prejudice of the author and therefore inaccurate and incomplete by definition and subject to interpretation by the reader. If there is a god then it would not rely on such flawed documents or understanding to disseminate it's word. I would think that direct contact with the source would be much more accurate and therefore this god would leave the channels open for communication. Therefore I would conclude that books would not be the prefered method of communication for any god with half an intelligence. The Quran, like the bible, is just a bunch of ink on paper. If you want to know the truth, go to the source.

Pretty much. If there was actually a god with any sense, they'd manufacture a universe where the creatures living in it would automatically know what it wanted them to know.

 

[AnnaG]

Everyone is a hypocrite at some point in time. Even gods are hypocrites. Some more than others.

 

[talloola]

The hypocrite is the one who says: I believe in God and His apostle; while in fact he does not believe; he is a disbeliever in reality, but a believer only before people: to cheat people.

In other words: he pretends to be a believer, while in fact he is a disbeliever.

Therefore, his righteous work is only to show others; he is not doing that for God's sake; but to live in this way: really he is a disbeliever, while apparently he is a believer; this is the definition.

In my opinion no one should do 'good deeds' to impress anyone, even their so called god, good deeds feel good,
and make others feel good, and the doer of the deed, shouldn't
be doing it for anything else, it is no different to do
good things to impress people, than it is to impress any
god you might believe in, it is still doing it for your
own gain.

 

[Downhome_Woman]

In my opinion no one should do 'good deeds' to impress anyone, even their so called god, good deeds feel good,
and make others feel good, and the doer of the deed, shouldn't
be doing it for anything else, it is no different to do
good things to impress people, than it is to impress any
god you might believe in, it is still doing it for your
own gain.

Well said.

 

[eanassir]

More about the hypocrites:
This is in the Quran 63: 1-8​

إِذَا جَاءكَ الْمُنَافِقُونَ قَالُوا نَشْهَدُ إِنَّكَ لَرَسُولُ اللَّهِ وَاللَّهُ يَعْلَمُ إِنَّكَ لَرَسُولُهُ وَاللَّهُ يَشْهَدُ إِنَّ الْمُنَافِقِينَ لَكَاذِبُونَ . اتَّخَذُوا أَيْمَانَهُمْ جُنَّةً فَصَدُّوا عَن سَبِيلِ اللَّهِ إِنَّهُمْ سَاء مَا كَانُوا يَعْمَلُونَ . ذَلِكَ بِأَنَّهُمْ آمَنُوا ثُمَّ كَفَرُوا فَطُبِعَ عَلَى قُلُوبِهِمْ فَهُمْ لَا يَفْقَهُونَ . وَإِذَا رَأَيْتَهُمْ تُعْجِبُكَ أَجْسَامُهُمْ وَإِن يَقُولُوا تَسْمَعْ لِقَوْلِهِمْ كَأَنَّهُمْ خُشُبٌ مُّسَنَّدَةٌ يَحْسَبُونَ كُلَّ صَيْحَةٍ عَلَيْهِمْ هُمُ الْعَدُوُّ فَاحْذَرْهُمْ قَاتَلَهُمُ اللَّهُ أَنَّى يُؤْفَكُونَ . وَإِذَا قِيلَ لَهُمْ تَعَالَوْا يَسْتَغْفِرْ لَكُمْ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ لَوَّوْا رُؤُوسَهُمْ وَرَأَيْتَهُمْ يَصُدُّونَ وَهُم مُّسْتَكْبِرُونَ . سَوَاء عَلَيْهِمْ أَسْتَغْفَرْتَ لَهُمْ أَمْ لَمْ تَسْتَغْفِرْ لَهُمْ لَن يَغْفِرَ اللَّهُ لَهُمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الْفَاسِقِينَ , هُمُ الَّذِينَ يَقُولُونَ لَا تُنفِقُوا عَلَى مَنْ عِندَ رَسُولِ اللَّهِ حَتَّى يَنفَضُّوا وَلِلَّهِ خَزَائِنُ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالْأَرْضِ وَلَكِنَّ الْمُنَافِقِينَ لَا يَفْقَهُونَ . يَقُولُونَ لَئِن رَّجَعْنَا إِلَى الْمَدِينَةِ لَيُخْرِجَنَّ الْأَعَزُّ مِنْهَا الْأَذَلَّ وَلِلَّهِ الْعِزَّةُ وَلِرَسُولِهِ وَلِلْمُؤْمِنِينَ وَلَكِنَّ الْمُنَافِقِينَ لَا يَعْلَمُونَ​

The explanation:
(When the hypocrites come to you [Mohammed] they say: "We bear witness that you are indeed the messenger [: the apostle] of God."
And God knows that you are indeed His messenger, and God bears witness that the hypocrites are truly liars [in their words.]

They have taken their oaths as a shield [to protect themselves from being killed], so they have barred [men] from the way of God. Surely they [will be punished in the afterlife –– and] evil are their deeds [in the life of the World.]

That [punishment] is because they have believed, then they have disbelieved; therefore a seal [of unbelief] has been set on their hearts, so they do not realize [the truth.]

And when you see them, their [tidy] bodies please you; and when they speak, you listen to their [embellished] words. They are [as worthless] as propped up reeds. They deem that every cry is against them. Truly, they are the enemy, so beware of them. The curse of God be on them; how they are turned away [from the truth!]

And when it is said to them: "Come [now and apologize] to the messenger of God, and he will ask forgiveness [of God] for you", they twist their heads and you see them turning away [from the truth], waxing proud [rather than submitting to the messenger of God.]

It is all the same, concerning them, whether you [Mohammed] ask forgiveness [of God] for them, or not; God will never forgive them [because they are hypocrites]; truly God guides not the evil-doing people [to the way of the truth, because of their bad conduct.]

It is they who say [to their brothers: the hypocrites among the people of Medina]: "Do not expend on the [poor emigrants] that are with God's messenger so that they may leave [him alone]; yet to God belong the treasuries of the heavens and the earth [and He will offer, in the near future, to the poor believers out of His grace]; but the hypocrites do not understand [about the future.]

They say: "If we return [from the expedition against Banul Mustaliq] to [the city of] Medina, [we] the mightier ones will expel, out of it, the more abased [: the messenger and the believers]"; yet the might belongs [exclusively] to God, His messenger and the believers, but the hypocrites do not know [the final consequences because of their ignorance and their pride with their money.])


http://quran-ayat.com/​

 

[Spade]

Pretty much. If there was actually a god with any sense, they'd manufacture a universe where the creatures living in it would automatically know what it wanted them to know.

The gods try their level best to erase all they do not want mankind to know. A babe is born without hate, without a lust for revenge; and , the dark oppressive thought that others are lesser beings and must be forced back in their place is absent. But the child's elders erase that absence, filling the silence with the sound of jackboots and screams. Often the most skilled at this erasure are the prelates, generals, and politicians. Surprisingly, even those who experienced this horror firsthand participate, at the same time mouthing "Never again!"

 

[AnnaG]

The gods try their level best to erase all they do not want mankind to know. A babe is born without hate, without a lust for revenge; and , the dark oppressive thought that others are lesser beings and must be forced back in their place is absent. But the child's elders erase that absence, filling the silence with the sound of jackboots and screams. Often the most skilled at this erasure are the prelates, generals, and politicians. Surprisingly, even those who experienced this horror firsthand participate, at the same time mouthing "Never again!"

Yup. Politics and religion are the two biggest banes of the world and maybe even the universe.

 

[eanassir]

In my opinion no one should do 'good deeds' to impress anyone, even their so called god, good deeds feel good,
and make others feel good, and the doer of the deed, shouldn't
be doing it for anything else, it is no different to do
good things to impress people, than it is to impress any
god you might believe in, it is still doing it for your
own gain.

This poetry will not avail you anything, talloola, neither will the television; so hurry to rescue your soul by believing in God alone without associate and in Mohammed His noble apostle; no time remained for you and for all of us; hurry up. Although I don't think you will believe, but God is All-Knowing.

This is in the Quran 16: 37

إِن تَحْرِصْ عَلَى هُدَاهُمْ فَإِنَّ اللّهَ لاَ يَهْدِي مَن يُضِلُّ وَمَا لَهُم مِّن نَّاصِرِينَ​

The explanation:
([O Mohammed] even if you try your best to guide them aright, surely God never guides those whom He misleads [because they deserve the misguidance], and you will not find for them any helpers [to save them from God's punishment].)


http://quran-ayat.com/​

 

[talloola]

This poetry will not avail you anything, talloola, neither will the television; so hurry to rescue your soul; no time remained for you and for all of us; hurry up.

hurry up and wait?
life is now, to do good on 'our' earth, not to do good
to get brownie points for the next life, which isn't.