Is the phrase "In God We Trust" and the pledge a endorsement of religion?

ironsides

ironsides

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This is the 1st amendment as written.

U.S. Bill of Rights

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
 
Niflmir

Niflmir

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captain morgan said:
We may just have to agree to disagree on this. Here's a link that offers an interesting discussion of this very issue. It's kind f a Q&A style page, but offers a decent and objective (relatively) commentary on the topic:

U.S. History: U.S. Constitution, god of the old testament, god in the pledge

A couple of short quotes:

Q: Was the Constitution based on Judeo-Christian values? When they put one nation under God in the pledge of allegiance,did they mean the God of the old testament /What about In God We Trust on our money? I was debating with a friend on wether or not our nation is a Christian nation and wether the founding fathers used Christian heritage and back ground as influence when they drafted that document.

A: The founders had a range of views, but generally most of them considered themselves Deists.....

There is more of a focus on science, logic, and reason.....

God is not mentioned in any of them (perhaps a very oblique reference in the phrase "blessings of liberty")......

That said, the founders were almost uniformly Christian, and regular church-goers.
There are many statements from founders that the citizenry's voluntary acceptance of Christian principles was important to maintaining a just and ordered society.
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In what way do we disagree? Yes, they were mostly Christian, but from very diverse sects. They saw fit to use language which did mention any god and the first thing they saw fit to clarify was to point out that their government should be forced to be secular.

A secularist is not necessarily an atheist, but merely someone who sees the benefit of the seperation of church and state.
 
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Cliffy

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Cliffy

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Walter said:
Which history is that?
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What don't you understand? From killing off aboriginals to wars on Muslim states, the history of America is a bloodbath. Teddy Roosevelt led a campaign that killed off 3 million Philippino Muslims with his Rough Riders in the early part of the twentieth century. How about Vietnam? How about supporting brutal dictatorships and training their death squads on US soil? What part of history did you miss?
 
captain morgan

captain morgan

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All of the cultures that you've identified as 'victims' have track records that are as violent and bloody (if not more so) as any other. You are simply playing your own game of favorites and looking to attach labels without looking at the whole picture.

It's a self-fulfilling prophecy, isn't it?
 
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Cliffy

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captain morgan said:
All of the cultures that you've identified as 'victims' have track records that are as violent and bloody (if not more so) as any other. You are simply playing your own game of favorites and looking to attach labels without looking at the whole picture.

It's a self-fulfilling prophecy, isn't it?
Click to expand...
I suppose you want to get into body counts now. I was answering his question. The answer did not include other cultures because the topic was the United States of Aggression. You want to talk about other cultures and do comparative statistics based on the last hundred years, start a new thread.
 
Spade

Spade

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ironsides said:
Thor would be like naming a the rocket Jesus. Thor is the son of Odin. Odin is the name of the Norse God. Happy Thor'sday to you.
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Weren't the early American rockets that exploded on the launching pads in the late '50s named "Jesus!"?
Look Wodin (Odin) is a wuss! Thor is the real McCoy!
Do you think the following portrait of Odin would is of a god that would inspire the American Mint?
File:Georg von Rosen - Oden som vandringsman, 1886 (Odin, the Wanderer).jpg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
ironsides

ironsides

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Cliffy said:
What don't you understand? From killing off aboriginals to wars on Muslim states, the history of America is a bloodbath. Teddy Roosevelt led a campaign that killed off 3 million Philippino Muslims with his Rough Riders in the early part of the twentieth century. How about Vietnam? How about supporting brutal dictatorships and training their death squads on US soil? What part of history did you miss?
Click to expand...


I would get your facts of your history stories straight, the Rough Riders fought in Cuba and "The Rough Riders were shipped to Montauk, at the end of Long Island, and there the much-publicized and celebrated regiment was mustered out on September 16, 1898, after 137 days of service in the Army."

The Rough Riders and Colonel Roosevelt by The Theodore Roosevelt Association
 
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