Would Canada allow 12 million illegal Americans to stay?
- Thread starter thomaska
- Start date
But it affects all producers. So those scraping by on just meeting costs will now have the ability to raise prices so they can make a profit and there will be no one there to keep prices artificially low.
Why are there so many illegals? Is there any doubt in anyones mind that whether its Mexicans or Indonesians or Orientals or anyone other that "white" faced with the situations of corrupt governments, little opportunity and poor eduction combining in a world of global warming...that there aren't going to be gargantuan shifts in where people "choose" to live?
Is it true that the opportunity to make a decent life and send money home (in the case of Mexico) while illegally performing work for American interests is the cause of this burgeoning problem?
If our Free Trade Agreements and our Foreign Policies have had the effects we were told they would have...where have these problems come from?
Are the natural resouces of Mexico (or Canada for that matter) worthy of invasion and effort to spread neo-Americanism across the planet to rectify imbalances and injustices that have people flocking to the promise of a chance...?
Can the impetus the "cause" behind the problem be traced to some other source than the termerity and willing illegality of the folk involved?
Where does the responsibility actually lie?
Is it true that the opportunity to make a decent life and send money home (in the case of Mexico) while illegally performing work for American interests is the cause of this burgeoning problem?
If our Free Trade Agreements and our Foreign Policies have had the effects we were told they would have...where have these problems come from?
Are the natural resouces of Mexico (or Canada for that matter) worthy of invasion and effort to spread neo-Americanism across the planet to rectify imbalances and injustices that have people flocking to the promise of a chance...?
Can the impetus the "cause" behind the problem be traced to some other source than the termerity and willing illegality of the folk involved?
Where does the responsibility actually lie?
I see part of the problem being lazy Americans/Canadians etc who are not willing to take a job that doesnt pay more than minimum wage. So long as the locals won't work, illegals have a job. With the welfare system, it is generally better to live off welfare than to work these low paying jobs. So long as that is an option a person would be nuts to work all day in a hot field or a construction project just to come home to a dump shanty and eat macaroni all day.
We have to make these jobs accessible and desireable for locals if we ever hope to combat this economic immigration issue. At the same time, we have to find ways to make immigration legal and accessible so that we will have more locals to do these jobs.
Once an immigrant becomes legal, are they going to want these jobs? Or are these always going to go those who would cheat to get a penny instead of those who would work to get one?
Where I am from, it used to be that the local teenagers picked the tomatoes for a summer job. Then two things happened. First, McDonalds and other fast food and retail came to the area and the kids could work in better conditions for more pay so the labor pool dried up considerably. Then the labor started coming in seasonally from Mexico and filled those jobs. Now, since other labor has slipped so badly in WV, adults are taking the lower skilled jobs at McDonalds and WalMart leaving the kids totally out of the loop--thier old jobs are now filled with immigrant labor.
So it seems to me that two things have to happen. First, we have to fill those jobs with locals. This is going to mean additional cost because nobody is going to pick tomatoes for $2 an hour when they can work at McDonalds for $7. AND we have to crack down on the illegal people.
We have to make these jobs accessible and desireable for locals if we ever hope to combat this economic immigration issue. At the same time, we have to find ways to make immigration legal and accessible so that we will have more locals to do these jobs.
Once an immigrant becomes legal, are they going to want these jobs? Or are these always going to go those who would cheat to get a penny instead of those who would work to get one?
Where I am from, it used to be that the local teenagers picked the tomatoes for a summer job. Then two things happened. First, McDonalds and other fast food and retail came to the area and the kids could work in better conditions for more pay so the labor pool dried up considerably. Then the labor started coming in seasonally from Mexico and filled those jobs. Now, since other labor has slipped so badly in WV, adults are taking the lower skilled jobs at McDonalds and WalMart leaving the kids totally out of the loop--thier old jobs are now filled with immigrant labor.
So it seems to me that two things have to happen. First, we have to fill those jobs with locals. This is going to mean additional cost because nobody is going to pick tomatoes for $2 an hour when they can work at McDonalds for $7. AND we have to crack down on the illegal people.
Actually I am just as divided as the US Congress on this issue of Immigration.
I'm not sure that the Left or the Right has proven a net economic benefit to all the Mexicans coming illegally accross the border. Nor has either side proven a net economic loss. I have not seen a good analysis on that point yet. All you see are both sides demaguoging the issue, claiming half of them are criminal or claiming they all have even better "familia" values than we do. What white American kid do you know saves enough to send money home to his or her parents ?
Should there be a quote on this massive migration ?
I don't like the idea of 12 million (how'd they figure out that number ?) illegals living afraid of their shadow, afraid somebody is going to narc them out.
Of course maybe half of them are not afraid ? Maybe they are because who wants to go through the bureaucratic crap once somebody has fingered you.
12 million people shouldn't have to live that way.
Oh yeah, you hear the retort that they didn't have to come over here.
Hmmm...
No international outcry on how corrupt and hypocritical Mexico is about all of this.
But then I'm not going to turn any of them into the authorities. I'm enjoying teaching chess to over 100 latinos in the 2 elementary schools here.
And I'm enjoying learning the "idioma."
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I'm not sure that the Left or the Right has proven a net economic benefit to all the Mexicans coming illegally accross the border. Nor has either side proven a net economic loss. I have not seen a good analysis on that point yet. All you see are both sides demaguoging the issue, claiming half of them are criminal or claiming they all have even better "familia" values than we do. What white American kid do you know saves enough to send money home to his or her parents ?
Should there be a quote on this massive migration ?
I don't like the idea of 12 million (how'd they figure out that number ?) illegals living afraid of their shadow, afraid somebody is going to narc them out.
Of course maybe half of them are not afraid ? Maybe they are because who wants to go through the bureaucratic crap once somebody has fingered you.
12 million people shouldn't have to live that way.
Oh yeah, you hear the retort that they didn't have to come over here.
Hmmm...
No international outcry on how corrupt and hypocritical Mexico is about all of this.
But then I'm not going to turn any of them into the authorities. I'm enjoying teaching chess to over 100 latinos in the 2 elementary schools here.
And I'm enjoying learning the "idioma."
__________________
Jim
Once again the United States is paying the price for its failure to keep its government and the wealthy powerful elite from usurping the law of the land and re-engineering civil criminal and constitutional law to appease particular appetites...
Shameful how America has been hijacked...and how Americans have allowed themselves to be hijacked....
Once again the United States is paying the price for its failure to keep its government and the wealthy powerful elite from usurping the law of the land and re-engineering civil criminal and constitutional law to appease particular appetites...
Shameful how America has been hijacked...and how Americans have allowed themselves to be hijacked....
There is not a heck of a lot we can do. Every fresh face we send to Washington eventually succombs to the beltway mentality. We had a man from my state go to Congress with the campaign promise
"I am not one of those guys. I am going to serve one term, stand up to the beltway mentality and I am out."
Of course he stayed for about 4 terms. Things were just SO GOOD. Lots of perks, great lifestyle, legal junketts galor. The only people that have his ear is big money, both libs and conservatives.
Edit. This is the skinny on Marty
Meehan successfully ran for the House in 1992 on a platform of reform, including a commitment to pushing through term limits for members of the House. As part of that platform, Meehan made a pledge not to serve more than four terms. On the House floor in 1995 he scolded members who might go back on their promise to limit their tenure in office. "The best test of any politicians' credibility on term limits," he said, "is whether they are willing to put their careers where their mouths are and limit their own service." Despite his pledge, Meehan again ran for Congress in the year 2000, exceeding four terms.
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So at what point do you agree that you've lost the war and look at ideas to fix the problems instead of continuing with the practice that doesn't work?
Ahem. The war on illegal immirgation.
You know, war on drugs, war on Illegals, war on terror, cold war, price wars, star wars, war on communism, all that good stuff you do.
We deal with Al Qeada by police investigation, public trial and corrections.
We deal with Al Qeada by running them down in their training camps and disrupting their ability to quietly prepare people to attack civilians over here.
And if you haven't lost the war on illegals entering your country, you sure have a funny way of winning it.
My bad... I was mixed up in threads for a moment.
First off, as much as you want Americans to just plain old surrender to everyone for everything, well we just aren't going to.
Here is how you fix illegal immigration. You punish everyone that hires them and the ones you catch you send home. Simple. If they want to come in the US do it the right way like millions of others have done. It isn't that difficult.
I gotta agree on that. Mostly. I think we should punish those who KNOWINGLY hire illegals. Im sure some have fake green cards.
As an immigrant myself, I can honestly say I hold resentment for illegals. There are processes. Rules to be followed.
As an immigrant myself, I can honestly say I hold resentment for illegals. There are processes. Rules to be followed.
The thing is that we already have laws on the books that people are supposed to follow. But when judges make it illegal to deport illegal aliens things get tough. Follow the law... that is all we have to do. If a cop pulls over someone for speeding and finds out they are here illegally... call the INS and send him/her home.
You got me all wrong man. I don't want Americans to just plain surrender to everyone. It would be good if you just stopped waging war on anything and everything as a response. Come on, you have to as a people, mature sometime and try something other than blowing the ****e out of what you see as a problem.
It doesn't work. It hasn't worked is all the times you've tried to do that. Other things work but for some reason, you guys don't like the idea of trying something other than making as much of a mess as possible, hurting as many people as you can and then laying the blame for it on them. And I might add that when someone tells you about this problem, you tend to get mad, yell "I'm taking my foreign aid and going home", though you really only do that when the GOP control the country, and then continue on with the methods that just don't work.
We could actually do with 1.2 million hard working young people to help support CPP and healthcare when the baby boomers retire. Plus I hope we don't have the racist attitude "Learn to speak English" crap. Multiculturalism rocks.
To be fair, blowing the crap out of things has always worked, its when they try to stay and make things better that things go downhill.