What would Jesus think ?

[Ludlow]

If I were a Christian and believed in their religion I would be catholic. But I am not and do not

You are, do I need to requote you?

Go ahead on moron keep on with your idiocy

The apocalypse is both literal and symbolic, LL. Dogmatism here can lead us astray. In Revelation 17, the apostate church is a global system. She may literally be headquartered in Rome or Rome may symbolize her or both.

The writer was clearly identifying Rome in a figurative sense in verse 9 Motar.

Not some futuristic symbolic Rome but the current power of those times . " the seven heads are seven hills upon which the woman sits".

<waits for the yankee hater to conjure up more bullshyt to save face.

Not referring to you Motar.

You know, the subject of this thread was what would the person of Jesus think if he knew that people were prostituting his name for money. I for one do not think jesus had any intention of starting a new religion. He was a Jew. But aside from that, no one has given any answer to that question. A few good statements from Petros and Motar and accusatory hate filled crap from Mr. Know it none Gerry.

 

[Motar]

If I were a Christian and believed in their religion I would be catholic. But I am not and do not


Go ahead on moron keep on with your idiocy


The writer was clearly identifying Rome in a figurative sense in verse 9 Motar.

Not some futuristic symbolic Rome but the current power of those times . " the seven heads are seven hills upon which the woman sits".

<waits for the yankee hater to conjure up more bullshyt to save face.

Not referring to you Motar.

You know, the subject of this thread was what would the person of Jesus think if he knew that people were prostituting his name for money. I for one do not think jesus had any intention of starting a new religion. He was a Jew. But aside from that, no one has given any answer to that question. A few good statements from Petros and Motar and accusatory hate filled crap from Mr. Know it none Gerry.

Mecca also sits on seven hills in a desert next to many waters, LL.

 

[Ludlow]

Mecca also sits on seven hills in a desert next to many waters, LL.

Mecca was not persecuting the new Christians Motar.

 

[gopher]

I'll never forget my niece who is no longer with us, wanting to find a good church to go to because she wanted some sort of spirituality in her and her daughters life. We were very close and I miss her a great deal. At any rate she called me and told me she had went to a big church ...


Jesus ...

... a house of prayer, but you have made it into a den of thieves.

... Can anyone say, "Marjoe"

First, so very sorry that you lost your niece.

Yes, it is sad that churches have become profit palaces rather than havens of rest. But when anyone says what you did, they start screaming that Christianity is under attack. This comes from the same people who applauded the persecution of Catholic Workers, the Berrigan brothers, the Jehovah's Witnesses, and others who protested the use of tax dollars to finance wars.


I have always said that the solution is to tax the churches when they profit from business ventures and when they own lands used by profit making organizations. Case in point: Trinity church which owns so much of Wall Street in downtown NYC.



It's been a while since I've heard of Marjoe and will try to get a copy of it. Hopefully, some day these churches will learn the errors of their ways.

 

[Ludlow]

First, so very sorry that you lost your niece.

Yes, it is sad that churches have become profit palaces rather than havens of rest. But when anyone says what you did, they start screaming that Christianity is under attack. This comes from the same people who applauded the persecution of Catholic Workers, the Berrigan brothers, the Jehovah's Witnesses, and others who protested the use of tax dollars to finance wars.


I have always said that the solution is to tax the churches when they profit from business ventures and when they own lands used by profit making organizations. Case in point: Trinity church which owns so much of Wall Street in downtown NYC.



It's been a while since I've heard of Marjoe and will try to get a copy of it. Hopefully, some day these churches will learn the errors of their ways.

We were very close. She was a beauty who cared deeply for others.

 

[Motar]

Mecca was not persecuting the new Christians Motar.

How is Mecca (Saudi Arabia) treating Christians today, LL?

 

[Ludlow]

Motar Mecca is not Rome. The writer of Revelation was clearly indicating Rome at the time of this writing. Not Saudi Arabia.

Saudi Arabia is not feeding Christians to the lions.

 

[Motar]

Motar Mecca is not Rome. The writer of Revelation was clearly indicating Rome at the time of this writing. Not Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia is not feeding Christians to the lions.

Circling back, LL, all false religion will be dealt with. (You will note future tense in my statement and in statements made in Revelation 17 as well.)

 

[Ludlow]

What is false religion Motar?

 

[MHz]

If you look deep enough at any institution there is corruption involved and usually before it is very old. The rise and fall of the kings in the OT would be able to provide some examples of some rules that worked out and others that had a flaw or two and they crashed because of it. That 'list' could probably be applied to the various Governments that have ruled in the recent past and today.

The odds are high that the idea of being able to purchase favor with God and that would have been part of the sins in the OT that resulted in the exile to Babylon. The odds are pretty high that there was a form of it before the flood as that era is said to return just before Christ takes over as King and the 'money-changers' (prior to the flood version) are thrown out for the 3rd and last time.

The Bible's version of the mark of the beast is equal to being a Merchant and you make money by buying at wholesale and selling at retail. The part that sets the Bible apart id in who the 'best' is as the head that is healed is the one that received the wound during the flood and all ' fallen sons of God' were put into the Pit by 'holy sons of God'. The release of the beast from the Pit is for the sentence to the lake to be carried out rather than the revival of the old ways was the important part of that prophecy.

The Church you describe depends on membership being an advantage and being a member means buying the crap they sell. The Bible's version of salvation comes to you if you were conceived doesn't support a 'business model' as you only need 1 book and 'x' number of hours in study and then you don't need the book as that version never changes. All you end up with is people who agree on what the book promotes and what it doesn't. Your relatives all found salvation, salvation will find you if you don't find it first. Marriages for people alive for the 1,000 years are dissolved as these people never have any children. The people that come alive at the start of the new earth verses all have marriages and children as part of their future, each couple has 100 children by the time they are 120 years old so coming in 'last' has certain things that might appeal to people, like 'pets' as they only are for the same people who make their homes outside of New Jerusalem. The Church you describe is designed to get bigger than that does not always mean better. You can tell a Christian by the way they interact with other people.

Jas:2:15:
If a brother or sister be naked,
and destitute of daily food,
Jas:2:16:
And one of you say unto them,
Depart in peace,
be ye warmed and filled;
notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body;
what doth it profit?
Jas:2:17:
Even so faith,
if it hath not works,
is dead,
being alone.

 

[Ludlow]

First, so very sorry that you lost your niece.

Yes, it is sad that churches have become profit palaces rather than havens of rest. But when anyone says what you did, they start screaming that Christianity is under attack. This comes from the same people who applauded the persecution of Catholic Workers, the Berrigan brothers, the Jehovah's Witnesses, and others who protested the use of tax dollars to finance wars.


I have always said that the solution is to tax the churches when they profit from business ventures and when they own lands used by profit making organizations. Case in point: Trinity church which owns so much of Wall Street in downtown NYC.



It's been a while since I've heard of Marjoe and will try to get a copy of it. Hopefully, some day these churches will learn the errors of their ways.

Gopher I'm sure you remember the Sinclaire Lewis novel Elmer Gantry. The movie that followed with Burt Lancaster in the lead role was a good view of these early tent revivalists which evolved into the Oral Roberts and Paul Crouch's of our times.

 

[MHz]

What is false religion Motar?

Anything that alters this 'fact'

1Co:15:32:
If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus,
what advantageth it me,
if the dead rise not?
let us eat and drink;
for to morrow we die.

1Co:15:15:
Yea,
and we are found false witnesses of God;
because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ:
whom he raised not up,
if so be that the dead rise not.
1Co:15:16:
For if the dead rise not,
then is not Christ raised:
1Co:15:17:
And if Christ be not raised,
your faith is vain;
ye are yet in your sins.

 

[Ludlow]

If you look deep enough at any institution there is corruption involved and usually before it is very old. The rise and fall of the kings in the OT would be able to provide some examples of some rules that worked out and others that had a flaw or two and they crashed because of it. That 'list' could probably be applied to the various Governments that have ruled in the recent past and today.

The odds are high that the idea of being able to purchase favor with God and that would have been part of the sins in the OT that resulted in the exile to Babylon. The odds are pretty high that there was a form of it before the flood as that era is said to return just before Christ takes over as King and the 'money-changers' (prior to the flood version) are thrown out for the 3rd and last time.

The Bible's version of the mark of the beast is equal to being a Merchant and you make money by buying at wholesale and selling at retail. The part that sets the Bible apart id in who the 'best' is as the head that is healed is the one that received the wound during the flood and all ' fallen sons of God' were put into the Pit by 'holy sons of God'. The release of the beast from the Pit is for the sentence to the lake to be carried out rather than the revival of the old ways was the important part of that prophecy.

The Church you describe depends on membership being an advantage and being a member means buying the crap they sell. The Bible's version of salvation comes to you if you were conceived doesn't support a 'business model' as you only need 1 book and 'x' number of hours in study and then you don't need the book as that version never changes. All you end up with is people who agree on what the book promotes and what it doesn't. Your relatives all found salvation, salvation will find you if you don't find it first. Marriages for people alive for the 1,000 years are dissolved as these people never have any children. The people that come alive at the start of the new earth verses all have marriages and children as part of their future, each couple has 100 children by the time they are 120 years old so coming in 'last' has certain things that might appeal to people, like 'pets' as they only are for the same people who make their homes outside of New Jerusalem. The Church you describe is designed to get bigger than that does not always mean better. You can tell a Christian by the way they interact with other people.

Jas:2:15:
If a brother or sister be naked,
and destitute of daily food,
Jas:2:16:
And one of you say unto them,
Depart in peace,
be ye warmed and filled;
notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body;
what doth it profit?
Jas:2:17:
Even so faith,
if it hath not works,
is dead,
being alone.

I am a fan of Jame's words MHz. I'm thinking he may have been Jesus brother.

But we know that James was a jew, speaking to the jews.

 

[MHz]

This James is the brother of John the Apostle. They would be the authors of 'Mark' and 'Luke' as they both cover 2 events that they alone (and Peter) witnessed. Their version of the cross and the tomb would have been from their mother who was at both events.

The scattering James mentions in 1:1 is the scattering mentioned in Da:4:30 and at the end of Luke:21:12-44 prophecy about them being in Jerusalem after Stephen was killed and the Roman armies of 70AD came along (Luke:21:24)

 

[Ludlow]

I'm sorry but you are wrong. This James is the brother of Jesus.

 

[MHz]

Going by what? Why would a brother be given a writing task rather than an Apostle when this is meant for them as well as the staying in Jerusalem. The Book of Jude was by His brother.

Joh:14:26:
But the Comforter,
which is the Holy Ghost,
whom the Father will send in my name,
he shall teach you all things,
and bring all things to your remembrance,
whatsoever I have said unto you.

Joh:15:26:
But when the Comforter is come,
whom I will send unto you from the Father,
even the Spirit of truth,
which proceedeth from the Father,
he shall testify of me:

Does it stand to reason that James and John wrote the Gospels I mentions as they were the eyewitnesses to those events. Does it stand to reason that the scattering mentioned would put the date at sometime after 70AD??

 

[Ludlow]

Going by what? Why would a brother be given a writing task rather than an Apostle when this is meant for them as well as the staying in Jerusalem. The Book of Jude was by His brother.

Joh:14:26:
But the Comforter,
which is the Holy Ghost,
whom the Father will send in my name,
he shall teach you all things,
and bring all things to your remembrance,
whatsoever I have said unto you.

Joh:15:26:
But when the Comforter is come,
whom I will send unto you from the Father,
even the Spirit of truth,
which proceedeth from the Father,
he shall testify of me:

Does it stand to reason that James and John wrote the Gospels I mentions as they were the eyewitnesses to those events. Does it stand to reason that the scattering mentioned would put the date at sometime after 70AD??

do a little more research apart from your authority.

 

[MHz]

I don't see that happening really. I'm quite comfortable with the opinion I arrived at after doing the research you suggested. I could go as far as it was the other Apostle James based on not knowing when the verse below took place.

Ac:12:2:
And he killed James the brother of John with the sword.

M't:10:2:
Now the names of the twelve apostles are these;
The first, Simon,
who is called Peter,
and Andrew his brother;
James the son of Zebedee,
and John his brother;
M't:10:3:
Philip,
and Bartholomew;
Thomas,
and Matthew the publican;
James the son of Alphaeus,
and Lebbaeus,
whose surname was Thaddaeus;

Ga:1:18:
Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter,
and abode with him fifteen days.
Ga:1:19:
But other of the apostles saw I none,
save James the Lord's brother.

 

[Motar]

What is false religion Motar?

Babylon, LL. (Revelation 17)

Babylon, LL. (Revelation 17)

Worship of created things (Romans 1).

 

[Ludlow]

I can see your point in Rev . Motar. I don't recognize the other as anything other than an opinion of someone.