Venezuela Has Nukes --- Futurist Headline

[jimmoyer]

Look ahead a decade.

Iran got its nukes. Iran likes Venezuela a lot.

Venezuela gets NUKES.

Anybody feel better about Mutual Deterrents ?

Does it work with this many nations ?

Edited to remove caps in thread title ... Upper and lower, please, Jimmoyer. Thanks, Cosmo

 

[darkbeaver]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES -

Seems to me like you're looking for justification for the attack on Iran. You obviously want to sell the conquest and subjugation of Iran as American benevolent salvation of mankind. You have no shame JimMoyer, none.

 

[jimmoyer]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Oy veh, darkbeaver.

I ain't selling nothing.

There's two questions in the first post at the top
of this thread.

 

[Sassylassie]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Now Jim you are a born sales man, I got your email regarding the new Tupper Ware line, and I'm still mulling over to buy-or not to buy.

The leader of Iran is a nut case, crazy. The mere thought of this head case having the power to hit a little red button that could launch Nukes is mind boggling.

 

[jimmoyer]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

You can use a scouring pad on this tupperware and
will show no scratches. Made by TeflonTufferTupper.

Pull back camera to show three people holding their hands up like a T.

Fade to black.

Subliminal image of a mushroom cloud.

 

[darkbeaver]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES -

If America stops Iran then you don't have to worry about Venezuelas ambitions for the future. And of course the future headline would read, Sept 11/2121 Venezuela Sings Unconditional Surrender.And what about China or Russia or Pakistan or India, all of them will have to be addressed similarly, that's a lot of futuristic headlines.

 

[Sassylassie]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

lol Jim thanks for the laugh.

 

[jimmoyer]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

You seem to be alot more sure of things than I am.

You think America can stop Iran or Venezuela from
seeking nuclear weapons ?

And if they get them, and more nations get them, like
say Nigeria, will you feel safer ?

Will this help Mutual Deterrence ?

Does it work with this many nations ?

 

[cortezzz]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

no it doesnt that is why

the US has to get rid of its nukes
and the Uk as well

opening 2 new positions for the good people of iran and venezuela

DUH!

 

[jimmoyer]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Cortezzz takes the ALL or NOTHING approach.

What say all of you ?

ALL or NOTHING ?

or

DRAW THE LINE ?

 

[pastafarian]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Anybody feel better about Mutual Deterrents ?

Does it work with this many nations ?

"Bout the same. It always scared me, even when it was the Russkies and the Yanks.

I don't know, but the more players there are, the more strategies we might see.

See jim, I suspect also that you're trying to paint us into a logical corner, particularly in the post on the other thread to mabudon about what practical results the "Let Iran have 'em " side is going to achieve.

If we ignore who's good and bad for a moment, who's interests are served by which actions, international law and national sovereignty and abstract out our little group of nuclear enthusiasts, then Id say we'd have to admit that that jimmoyer fella makes a lot of sense and you can't argue with his logic. No matter how you feel, every new country that gets a nuke makes the world less safe AND any country that can, should stop it for the sake of the global community.

The first part is true even if you toss in any other considerations: Iran having nukes makes the world less secure as a whole.

So, my question is then: does this potential increase in world safety, possibly obtainable by a US (and a coalition of the bribed, coerced and possibly Israelis this time) invasion of Iran outweigh the loss of world safety that such an invasion is sure to create through increased Arab militancy, probably antisemitism, increased recruiting of terrorists as is occurring in Iraq (effects being seen in Afghanistan) and who knows what other blowback from further de-stabilization of the region?

Same question about Venezuala.

 

[jimmoyer]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Good points, Pastafarian.

You'll find out from me, that my questions were real,
not some setup.

Carefully considering you having the best response I've seen, I'd have to conclude we can not be smug and sure
either way, can we ?

Especially your point of creating a vacuum, of creating
instability by going to war to stop nuclear proliferation is
extremely smart.

But, I'm not as confident in your your sanguine tone on
believing in "more strategies" as a deterrent rather than as
an additional unpredictable variable.

Another ball to juggle in the air ? It could be just another
ball we might miss catching. Add 20 more ? How good
a juggler are you ?


It would take war or a serious threat of war to stop
another nation from gaining nuclear weapon ability,
wouldn't it ?

As you can see diplomacy fails. And containment
is always quite legitimately debateable for many
reasons.

But once nuclear weaponry spreads to many nations,
what will deter them from slicing off another nation?

As you can see Saddam tried it without nuclear
weapons invading Kuwait and wished he had waited
until he had them after he saw all his calculations go
wrong.

The confidence shown by either side on this issue
absolutely amazes me.

But still when we contemplate a world that sees Venezuela
or Nigeria have them, I wonder how wise any approach can be.

 

[pastafarian]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Apologies for suspecting an ulterior motive.

Actually, jimmoyer, I wasn't clear. I meant to be ironic and failed: When I wrote "more strategies", I was considering the strategy of actually using the thing, rather than just having the deterrent effect. This is why I have to agree with you that with each country (benign or not and I'd put the current leadership of Iran firmly in the "not" category ) that acquires a nuke, we make the possibility of a catastrophe more likely.

I don't like the idea of any more countries getting nukes, I don't like the status quo and I don't like the idea that international law is effectively run along the lines of "might makes right", so I honestly don't know that there is a solution for this particular problem. Maybe there's something not too unreasonable that Iran wants that can be offered as a diplomatic gesture to buy their cessation of a nuclear weapons program, I don't know if it's even been explored with any seriousness...

And although I piss and moan (and will continue to do so) when the US throws its weight around, if we can't get some international laws back in place, things may be particularly unpleasant for us when China becomes the dominant world power just as I'm about to launch the latter half of my retirement or thereabouts.

 

[scott malcolm]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Yes the proliferation of nukes is unacceptable though you cannot solve problems with the same logic that created the problem in the first place.

I believe it was Einstien who had a quote like that.

America should try a novel approach in Iran by extrending an apology for the 1953 coup d'etat that instilled the brutal Shah of Iran. America's collective memory of Iran seems to start in 1979 when the poplulace took to the streets in revolt to the kidnappingand state terror inflicted on the people of Iran.

Into that power vaccuum stepped the equally brutal and repressive religious zealots who use American emonification to further their ruthless grip on the Iranian people. America obliges by being unrepenting.

Repent America and ask for an apology from the Iranian people. Under the Koran they have to give it fi you seek peace.

Then it is left up to the Iranian people onoce again to throw off the yoke of oppression.

And this time without the obvious Great Satan being used to rationalize the need.

 

[scott malcolm]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

Yes the proliferation of nukes is unacceptable though you cannot solve problems with the same logic that created the problem in the first place.

I believe it was Einstien who had a quote like that.

America should try a novel approach in Iran by extrending an apology for the 1953 coup d'etat that instilled the brutal Shah of Iran. America's collective memory of Iran seems to start in 1979 when the poplulace took to the streets in revolt to the kidnappingand state terror inflicted on the people of Iran.

Into that power vaccuum stepped the equally brutal and repressive religious zealots who use American emonification to further their ruthless grip on the Iranian people. America obliges by being unrepenting.

Repent America and ask for an apology from the Iranian people. Under the Koran they have to give it fi you seek peace.

Then it is left up to the Iranian people onoce again to throw off the yoke of oppression.

And this time without the obvious Great Satan being used to rationalize the need.

 

[Finder]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

I don't trust any nation with nukes but if there is a nation which I think which would actually disarm these nukes or at least never think of using them it would be Venezuela. The only nation in the world to ever use nukes in any ways to harm people has been the USA and they used it twice. So yeah...

Now I do agree Iran shouldn't have nukes... I think they may actually use them like the USA had.

 

[missile]

Re: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES --- FUTURIST HEADLINE

I can see the very last headline ever published: it reads "Iran/Israel Nuclear War"

 

[mabudon]

RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES -

Hmmm....

just reading through this thread, one thing kinda strikes me- WHY would Venezuala even need nukes??? what would ever prompt them to get them???

That is something that was left out of the futuristic scenario, what possible reason could the country have for pursuing such a reckless course???

I think it is ironic that you could look into the future and see THIS possibility while having NO real thoughts as to why this may come about- I'm not being facetious, either, WHY would Venezuela get nukes?? not to nuke Israel, and almost certainly not to use against their neighbors (who are mostly protected by infantry with machine guns and a few jeeps, hardly nuclear-worthy targets) so that takes the two main fears from the Iran situation off of the table...

WHY would Venezuela even consider nuclear weapons in this future??? I think the question needs to be addressed

 

[aeon]

Re: RE: VENEZUELA HAS NUKES -

Hmmm....

just reading through this thread, one thing kinda strikes me- WHY would Venezuala even need nukes??? what would ever prompt them to get them???

That is something that was left out of the futuristic scenario, what possible reason could the country have for pursuing such a reckless course???

I think it is ironic that you could look into the future and see THIS possibility while having NO real thoughts as to why this may come about- I'm not being facetious, either, WHY would Venezuela get nukes?? not to nuke Israel, and almost certainly not to use against their neighbors (who are mostly protected by infantry with machine guns and a few jeeps, hardly nuclear-worthy targets) so that takes the two main fears from the Iran situation off of the table...

WHY would Venezuela even consider nuclear weapons in this future??? I think the question needs to be addressed

The only reason i see why venezuela would consider to have nukes, is to avoid an invasion from us-uk coalition based on lies.

If the west wanna play the moral card on iran, for not having nukes , then all of them must disarm also.

 

[jimmoyer]

You guys are all pretty sure of yourselves.

And really trusting.

The combination of cynicism, confidence and gullibility
will never cease to amaze.