If your credibility on the Ogallala Aquifer is as good as your credibility on refined product pipelines, then it must be high quality water.
U.S. to re-route Keystone XL due to environmental concerns
- Thread starter mentalfloss
- Start date
If your credibility on the Ogallala Aquifer is as good as your credibility on refined product pipelines, then it must be high quality water.
A nice political ploy. If they were concerned about their water they wouldn't use anhydrous on their corn fields. Apparently Iowa isn't being greedy and is happy with the right of lease fees negotiated?
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That is about right. The greenies have been sucked in again. This is an economic issue not an environmental one, Someone has a financial interest in making the pipeline go a different route.
Actually, it's a pretty huge blow for Transcanada, who was originally claiming that there is nothing wrong with going through the aquifer. Regardless of how many nitrates are in there (petros) or what economical conspiracy theory you believe (taxslave), the fact of the matter is that Transcanada caved, which is an admission that they don't have a leg to stand on for their earlier claims about the environmental safety of this pipeline.
That, in effect, has given more fuel to the environmental groups to push for more assessments (which they successfully have done) and further delay the pipeline (which they have also successfully accomplished). And in the context of convincing the U.S. to agree to Keystone, Obamers gave us a huge gut laugh last week and stated quite clearly that exports to Pacific Asia are a much higher priority than our dig-dug deal.
In the meantime, Harper has conceded to looking for the Canadian west to meet the Asian east, but he'll hit an even greater reluctance from the greenies in Vancouver.
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Piping west to the AsiaPacific Bill Gatesway has been part of the plan for ages already.
Now Action Plan Man has a great reason to blow more money.
Damn hippys trying to change the Blue Meanies.....
The Beatles - All You Need Is Love HQ - YouTube
Now Action Plan Man has a great reason to blow more money.
Damn hippys trying to change the Blue Meanies.....
The Beatles - All You Need Is Love HQ - YouTube
First nations opponents of Northern Gateway brace for a fight
Prime Minister Stephen Harper's vow to step up efforts to sell Canadian oil to Asia following the Obama administration's decision to delay the Keystone XL pipeline has placed British Columbia at ground zero in the battle over Alberta oil sands bitumen.
Enbridge's $5.5-billion Northern Gateway pipeline proposal across northern B.C. from Alberta to Kitimat is the next alternative for developing a market for the oil sands and for promoting a Canadian strategy of diversifying away from the U.S. marketplace.
But Northern Gateway is opposed by at least 50 first nations along the pipeline corridor and on the B.C. coast, and it is also the next target for the North American environmental movement that so successfully delayed the Keystone pipeline from Alberta to the U.S. Gulf Coast.
"We see it as a very highrisk and high-profile project," Susan Casey-Lefkowitz, of Washington, D.C.-based Natural Resources Defense Council, said in an interview.
She said NRDC, which was one of the lead environmental groups in the fight over the Keystone pipeline, has already decided to make Northern Gateway the focus of its next big campaign.
"We did an alert to our members just two weeks ago and almost 60,000 NRDC members and supporters sent 60,000 emails to Premier [Christy] Clark asking that she take a strong stand against the Northern Gateway pipeline."
Harper made the pledge to step up efforts to supply Asia with Canadian energy at the conclusion of the Asia-Pacific Economic Co-operation summit Sunday in Hawaii.
The pipeline poses a tough dilemma for British Columbia, said Central One credit union economist Helmut Pastrick.
The economic benefits are broad but the risks of a damaging spill are high.
"It's something that governments and our citizens are going to have to grapple with," he said in an interview.
"The markets and the Asian economies are quite attractive for now and well into the future," he said. "But obviously there is no such thing as a completely safe pipeline, or even port. Accidents do happen and will happen."
At stake for Alberta oilsands producers is a price differential between North American crude oil prices and world prices, which are higher. Keystone was to connect with the U.S. Gulf Coast, ending the insulation from international markets. The Northern Gateway is one of two Enbridge pipeline proposals - the other is in the U.S. - to end that insulation.
Hoberg said that benefits for B.C. of the Northern Gateway proposal would be "relatively minimal."
"There would be some construction jobs in the short term," he said. "There would be some long-term jobs at the facility in Kitimat, but there aren't that many of them.
"But the risks to British Columbia are enormous, given the rivers that the pipeline will have to cross that are cherished salmon streams, and the tanker risk once they leave the port of Kitimat."
Hoberg sees first nations opposition as the biggest obstacle to Northern Gateway.
"If the Coastal first nations continue to adamantly say no, how can the government of Canada accommodate that interest and still approve the pipeline? I think it's a very difficult issue. If first nations can't be brought onside, it's going to be very difficult for this pipeline to go forward."
First nations have already rejected an Enbridge offer of a 10-per-cent stake in the pipeline. Hoberg said the fact that first nations are supporting natural gas pipeline plans shows that the issue is not money; it's the difference between harmful effects of an accident involving gas and one involving oil.
"The difference is that when an LNG facility fails, it can be explosive, but it does not result in the watercourse damage that oil would."
http://www.vancouversun.com/busines...hern+Gateway/5711185/story.html#ixzz1dn4c5vrp
Prime Minister Stephen Harper's vow to step up efforts to sell Canadian oil to Asia following the Obama administration's decision to delay the Keystone XL pipeline has placed British Columbia at ground zero in the battle over Alberta oil sands bitumen.
Enbridge's $5.5-billion Northern Gateway pipeline proposal across northern B.C. from Alberta to Kitimat is the next alternative for developing a market for the oil sands and for promoting a Canadian strategy of diversifying away from the U.S. marketplace.
But Northern Gateway is opposed by at least 50 first nations along the pipeline corridor and on the B.C. coast, and it is also the next target for the North American environmental movement that so successfully delayed the Keystone pipeline from Alberta to the U.S. Gulf Coast.
"We see it as a very highrisk and high-profile project," Susan Casey-Lefkowitz, of Washington, D.C.-based Natural Resources Defense Council, said in an interview.
She said NRDC, which was one of the lead environmental groups in the fight over the Keystone pipeline, has already decided to make Northern Gateway the focus of its next big campaign.
"We did an alert to our members just two weeks ago and almost 60,000 NRDC members and supporters sent 60,000 emails to Premier [Christy] Clark asking that she take a strong stand against the Northern Gateway pipeline."
Harper made the pledge to step up efforts to supply Asia with Canadian energy at the conclusion of the Asia-Pacific Economic Co-operation summit Sunday in Hawaii.
The pipeline poses a tough dilemma for British Columbia, said Central One credit union economist Helmut Pastrick.
The economic benefits are broad but the risks of a damaging spill are high.
"It's something that governments and our citizens are going to have to grapple with," he said in an interview.
"The markets and the Asian economies are quite attractive for now and well into the future," he said. "But obviously there is no such thing as a completely safe pipeline, or even port. Accidents do happen and will happen."
At stake for Alberta oilsands producers is a price differential between North American crude oil prices and world prices, which are higher. Keystone was to connect with the U.S. Gulf Coast, ending the insulation from international markets. The Northern Gateway is one of two Enbridge pipeline proposals - the other is in the U.S. - to end that insulation.
Hoberg said that benefits for B.C. of the Northern Gateway proposal would be "relatively minimal."
"There would be some construction jobs in the short term," he said. "There would be some long-term jobs at the facility in Kitimat, but there aren't that many of them.
"But the risks to British Columbia are enormous, given the rivers that the pipeline will have to cross that are cherished salmon streams, and the tanker risk once they leave the port of Kitimat."
Hoberg sees first nations opposition as the biggest obstacle to Northern Gateway.
"If the Coastal first nations continue to adamantly say no, how can the government of Canada accommodate that interest and still approve the pipeline? I think it's a very difficult issue. If first nations can't be brought onside, it's going to be very difficult for this pipeline to go forward."
First nations have already rejected an Enbridge offer of a 10-per-cent stake in the pipeline. Hoberg said the fact that first nations are supporting natural gas pipeline plans shows that the issue is not money; it's the difference between harmful effects of an accident involving gas and one involving oil.
"The difference is that when an LNG facility fails, it can be explosive, but it does not result in the watercourse damage that oil would."
http://www.vancouversun.com/busines...hern+Gateway/5711185/story.html#ixzz1dn4c5vrp
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The country has roads and railways built across Canada because it is in the nations interest to do. This benifts all Canadians.
Everybody has heard the concerns, let's deal with it the best we can, but let's get on and build the N. Gateway P/L so that all Canadians can benifit.
Everybody has heard the concerns, let's deal with it the best we can, but let's get on and build the N. Gateway P/L so that all Canadians can benifit.
Colbert lampoons Keystone XL Pipeline delay
An American political satirist and comedian dedicated an entire segment of his show to the pipeline that will boost Alberta oilsands shipments to the United States.
Stephen Colbert likened Canada and its oil to "a hot neighbour you would like to tap."
Colbert also took a shot at U.S. President Barrack Obama for delaying approval of the pipeline for killing billions of jobs, suggesting he is kowtowing to environmental lung-Nazis who protested in front of the White House last week.
He added those who are celebrating the loss of jobs are driving hybrid vehicles that run on broken dreams.
Colbert's guest for the Keystone segment was well-known environmentalist Bill McKibben who founded www.Tree50.org
McKibben tells 660News while it might sound strange, Colbert does a better job explaining Keystone than most American politicians and broadcasters have.
He says it's always nerve-wracking to appear on the Comedy Central show because you never know what is going to happen.
McKibben says real jobs come when we get off big oil, adding the best thing to do with the oilsands is leave them alone.
Colbert lampoons Keystone XL Pipeline delay - 660News
An American political satirist and comedian dedicated an entire segment of his show to the pipeline that will boost Alberta oilsands shipments to the United States.
Stephen Colbert likened Canada and its oil to "a hot neighbour you would like to tap."
Colbert also took a shot at U.S. President Barrack Obama for delaying approval of the pipeline for killing billions of jobs, suggesting he is kowtowing to environmental lung-Nazis who protested in front of the White House last week.
He added those who are celebrating the loss of jobs are driving hybrid vehicles that run on broken dreams.
Colbert's guest for the Keystone segment was well-known environmentalist Bill McKibben who founded www.Tree50.org
McKibben tells 660News while it might sound strange, Colbert does a better job explaining Keystone than most American politicians and broadcasters have.
He says it's always nerve-wracking to appear on the Comedy Central show because you never know what is going to happen.
McKibben says real jobs come when we get off big oil, adding the best thing to do with the oilsands is leave them alone.
Colbert lampoons Keystone XL Pipeline delay - 660News
Wrong again Durry.
Quote from source below.
"The oil sands mineral rights, in approximately 97% of Alberta's oil sands area, are owned by the Crown and managed by the Alberta Department of Energy. The remaining 3% of the oil sands mineral rights in the province are held by the Federal Government within Aboriginal reserves, by successors in title to the Hudson's Bay Company, by the railway companies and by the descendents of original homesteaders through rights granted by the Federal Government before 1887. These rights are referred to as "freehold rights".
With the Alberta government just collecting a measly $3 billion in royalties from oil sands projects in the fiscal year 2009/10 it seems the Alberta Department of Energy is doing a terrible job of collecting revenue from this natural resource that belongs to all Canadians. With the huge amount of revenue that is generated from our natural resources in the oil sands, mostly by US companies, it is very obvious that the Alberta Department of Energy is giving away our natural resources at pennies on the dollar.
In my last post I asked the question "What would you call that?" Now I'll answer it. It's called treason. And that refers to the Harper government giving Canadian refinery and trucking jobs away too.
None of the immigrants from Germany and Eastern Europe that were handed the free 180 acres in the west on a platter for doing nothing, for only a $10 registration fee have "freehold rights" cause the major part of that immigration was between 1891-1921. And the Canadian tax payer have been subsidizing them ever since. For what in return, genetically modified crops.
Source
Alberta Energy: Facts and Statistics
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If it was such 'a huge blow' to TransCanada...........why, only a couple of days after the announcement from Obama, did TransCanada come right back and state that they have a new route for the line through Nebraska - and Nebraska's legislature accepted it. Pretty fast on their feet those TransCanada people.
"TransCanada Corp. said Monday it has reached an agreement with the Nebraska government to change the route of its proposed Keystone XL oil pipeline in order to avoid the ecologically sensitive Sandhills region.
The Calgary-based pipeline giant said it supports legislation Nebraska has introduced to ensure the pipeline doesn't cross the expanse of grass-strewn, loose-soil hills, and part of the Ogallala aquifer, which supplies water to Nebraska and seven other states."
TransCanada will reroute Keystone XL pipeline - CityNews
that's a stretch.
It's an admission by TransCanada that it will be more likely to go forward if they change the route, there is no possible way to make this have any relevance to safety.
Because enacting that legislature means they have to delay the project for more environmental assessments, nevermind the more pertinent fact that they've admitted there is actually a legitimate environmental concern.
This is only going to fuel the critics even further..
Keystone XL's troubles likely bode more to come for oilsands
Critics' win likely to embolden them against other pipeline projects
Prime Minister Stephen Harper concedes, he's "disappointed" that the fate of TransCanada's proposed $7-billion pipeline from Alberta to the U.S. Gulf Coast has been deep-sixed ... er, delayed ... until at least 2013.
But fear not, says the boss, who once called approval of the pipeline a "no brainer." He's still "optimistic" that the project will eventually proceed, since it's "obviously what's in the best interests of not just the Canadian economy, but the American economy."
Uh huh.
Bill McKibben is on record as arguing that the oilsands - currently the source of less than two-tenths of one per cent of global carbon emissions - constitute "the single greatest carbon bomb on the planet."
How could that be? Well, McKibben contends, if we used all the crude contained in the oilsands tomorrow, carbon dioxide levels in the Earth's atmosphere would soar by more than 50 per cent.
But there's no point crying over spilled milk. The bigger question now is, has Obama's 11th-hour knee-capping of Keystone XL effectively killed the project and permanently damaged the growth prospects for Canada's export-dependent oilsands industry?
It's a little early to offer a definitive answer, but it seems clear that the environmental movement's victory over Keystone XL will only embolden it to fight any further pipeline expansion projects, including Enbridge's proposed Northern Gateway pipe-line to the West Coast. Which means the fight over Keystone XL will be just as incendiary next time.
This time, activists exploited the perceived threat of oil spills in Nebraska's Ogallala Aquifer to delay the project. If TransCanada agrees to change the pipeline route, it will only mean that activists have to manufacture a different threat next time. Their end-game remains the same: halt oilsands expansion in its tracks.
Robert Johnston, commodity politics and strategy director at New York-based Eurasia Group, a consulting firm that specializes in global political risk, also sees tough sledding ahead for the oilsands.
"I'm really concerned about the collective impact of these environmental decisions on the industry, including the (proposed) fuel-quality standards in Europe, the low-carbon fuel standard in California, and now, the (U.S. State Department's) recommendation not to go ahead with Keystone XL until some undefined time in the future," he says.
Although Johnston still believes the oilsands are regarded as a "strategic" energy resource in Washington, he says the delays over Keystone will only stiffen the resolve of well-funded U.S. environmental groups that already have Northern Gateway in their gunsights.
"I think there will be more industry support for market diversification to Asia (in Canada), but ... it's hard for me to see what policy levers the federal government can pull to move it forward. There may be a couple of things at the provincial level (in B.C.), but even that's pretty modest.
"It has to work its way through the process, and it's pretty clear to me that environmental groups will now turn their fire now on Gateway, having already won effectively on Keystone XL."
Keystone XL's troubles likely bode more to come for oilsands - The Edmonton Journal
This is an admission by TransCanada that they don't have faith in the original project as it was planned. Without any validation as to why they couldn't stick to their guns, the public will assume that they don't have any confidence in the original plans as being environmentally safe. Remember, this move just delayed the project by at least a year.
If TransCanada had routed the pipeline around Nebraska to begin with, we wouldn't be in this mess. But the environmentalists have jumped on that mistake and greater exposure to it helps frame the discussion in their favour.
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Yeah the way petros is trying to dominate this thread with rubbish you would think he was a shill for TransCanada Corp. or the refinery in the US that would get the job if the pipeline goes threw. He is spending so much time on this thread you would think it was his job, you know like a shill. Actually with his arrogance you would think he is from the US.
So what is it petro?
For all the time you spend on this thread do you not have a real Job?
Or is your real job a shill for TransCanada Corp. or a US refinery?
Are you posting from Canada or the US?
No, it's called business, it's called doing what makes economic sense, its called economic development.
If you want to build a refinery, your free to do so. Have at er !!!
No, he posts from his nursing home in Regina. He's a lonely old man!!
That's a bit of a stretch, mf. If such was the case, why were they able to come up with a different route so quickly??? I imagine if we were flies on the wall of TransCanada offices, we might see that they had many alternatives ready to go should the first route not work. That is not an admission of anything let alone lack of faith. It is called being prepared to go with Plan B when Plan A doesn't work.
Here's the list of the major refineries in Canada you shill.
Newfoundland and Labrador
North Atlantic Refinery, located in Come by Chance, (North Atlantic Refining), 115,000 bbl/d (18,300 m3/d)
Nova Scotia
Imperial Oil Refinery - Dartmouth, (Imperial Oil), 89,000 bbl/d (14,100 m3/d)
New Brunswick
Saint John, (Irving Oil), 300,000 bbl/d (48,000 m3/d)
Quebec
Montreal-East, (Shell Canada), 161,000 bbl/d (25,600 m3/d). Montreal East Refinery (Shell Canada). On June 4, 2010, Shell Canada officially announced the commencement to downgrade the refinery into a terminal, following the unsuccessful attempt to find a buyer to take over the plant.[6]
Montreal, (Suncor Energy), 160,000 bbl/d (25,000 m3/d). Formerly Petro-Canada (before Aug 2009) and historically a Petrofina refinery. Montreal Refinery
Montreal, Gulf Canada Oil, 70,000 bbl/d (11,000 m3/d) Closed in 1985 and restarted in 2003. Montreal East Refinery (Gulf Oil Canada)
Lévis, (Ultramar(Valero)), 215,000 bbl/d (34,200 m3/d)
Ontario
Nanticoke Refinery, Nanticoke - (Imperial Oil), 112,000 bbl/d (17,800 m3/d)
Sarnia, (Imperial Oil), 115,000 bbl/d (18,300 m3/d)
Sarnia, (Suncor Energy), 85,000 bbl/d (13,500 m3/d)
Corunna, (Shell Canada), 72,000 bbl/d (11,400 m3/d)
Lubricant Refinery
Mississauga, (Suncor Energy), 15,600 bbl/d (2,480 m3/d) - aka Clarkson Refinery - base oil production is 13,600 bpd of API Group II capacity and 2,000 bpd of API Group III capacity. Formerly Petro-Canada (before Aug 2009) and historically a Gulf refinery.
Saskatchewan
CCRL Refinery Complex, Regina (Consumers' Co-operative Refineries Limited (CCRL)), 100,000 bbl/d (16,000 m3/d)
Upgraders (improve the quality of crude for sale at a higher price)
Husky Lloydminster Refinery, Lloydminster, (Husky Energy), 25,000 bbl/d (4,000 m3/d)
Husky Lloydminster Upgrader Lloydminster, (Husky Energy), 75,000 bbl/d (11,900 m3/d)
Alberta
Strathcona Refinery, Edmonton, (Imperial Oil), 187,000 bbl/d (29,700 m3/d)
Scotford Refinery, Scotford, (Shell Canada), 100,000 bbl/d (16,000 m3/d)
Edmonton, (Suncor Energy), 135,000 bbl/d (21,500 m3/d). Formerly Petro-Canada (before Aug 2009).
Bitumen Upgraders (turn bitumen into synthetic crude, which then must be further refined)
Scotford Upgrader, Scotford, (AOSP - Shell Canada 60%, Chevron Corporation 20%, Marathon Oil 20%), 250,000 bpd (located next to Shell Refinery) raw bitumen
Horizon Oil Sands, Fort McMurray, (Canadian Natural Resources Limited), 110,000 bbl/d (17,000 m3/d) raw bitumen
Long Lake[disambiguation needed ], Fort McMurray, (OPTI Canada Inc. 35% and Nexen Inc. 65%), 70,000 bbl/d (11,000 m3/d) raw bitumen
Syncrude, Fort McMurray, (Canadian Oil Sands Trust, Imperial Oil, Suncor, Nexen, Conoco Phillips, Mocal Energy and Murphy Oil), 350,000 bbl/d (56,000 m3/d) raw bitumen
Suncor, Fort McMurray, (Suncor), 350,000 bbl/d (56,000 m3/d) raw bitumen
British Columbia
Burnaby Refinery, Burnaby, (Chevron Corporation), 52,000 bbl/d (8,300 m3/d)
Prince George Refinery, Prince George, (Husky Energy), 12,000 bbl/d (1,900 m3/d)
Source
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_oil_refineries#Canada
Plan B delayed the project by one year.
In the meantime, Harper applies for a free-trade pact that Asia and the other commonwealth were already part of for a while now and Obama proclaims his #1 priority is exports.
This is a pretty big shift from the cavalier attitude both TransCanada and the CPC had just a few months ago. We're no longer in "no brainer" territory.
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Obama delayed the project..............and we still don't know how long the delay will be.
You don't know much about the Oil business, do you?
A refinery is just not another refinery, a refinery is different than an Upgrader, sweet crude is different than Bitumen..
Better stick to the trucking business..... You shill !!!