U.S.: Did President Bush Order Torture?
- Thread starter moghrabi
- Start date
Mooseskin Johnny said:
Edited to say: Because you put "quote=..." at the beginning. That works in some places but not here. I don't know why except that these magic typewriters are finnicky about using the right magic incantation in the right place.
RE: U.S.: Did President B
Sorry, I went back and edited...the unedited version was just a test to see if my suspicions were right.
Sorry, I went back and edited...the unedited version was just a test to see if my suspicions were right.
RE: U.S.: Did President B
Just to head back to something close to the topic...There is a lot of evidence of the US backing countries that they are fully aware use torture. There is even evidence of them sending people to countries that torture to be interrogated. Torture techniques are taught, by most accounts, at the School of the Americas.
The Bush administration is worse than past administrations by several degrees, but this is really nothing new. It isn't just confined to the US either...other western countries, most notably Britain and France, have been implicated in similar actions to the export of prisoners and the training of torturers over the years.
Should there be some mechanism to automatically deal with transgressions like these? Something unvetoable?
Just to head back to something close to the topic...There is a lot of evidence of the US backing countries that they are fully aware use torture. There is even evidence of them sending people to countries that torture to be interrogated. Torture techniques are taught, by most accounts, at the School of the Americas.
The Bush administration is worse than past administrations by several degrees, but this is really nothing new. It isn't just confined to the US either...other western countries, most notably Britain and France, have been implicated in similar actions to the export of prisoners and the training of torturers over the years.
Should there be some mechanism to automatically deal with transgressions like these? Something unvetoable?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3834089.stm
I think the fact that the US did have a provision from the UN that granted their soldiers immunity from prosecution on war crimes, and that they were attempting to renew that agreement while the Abu Ghraib scandal was being investigated, speaks volumes about what has been going on for the past 4 years or so...
I think the fact that the US did have a provision from the UN that granted their soldiers immunity from prosecution on war crimes, and that they were attempting to renew that agreement while the Abu Ghraib scandal was being investigated, speaks volumes about what has been going on for the past 4 years or so...
This:
The Bush administration's continued attempt to undermine the authority of the ICC and the UN are part of a political endgame for world dominance.
is actually the most telling part of that article, Vanni. If the US prosecutes it's own criminals then they have no reason not to sign on to the ICC.
The Bush administration's continued attempt to undermine the authority of the ICC and the UN are part of a political endgame for world dominance.
Reverend Blair said:
Agreed. And it's not a new thing. The Yanks have been pulling these stunts ever since WWII.
RE: U.S.: Did President B
This is the big push though, Mooseskin. I think you indicated that you were familiar with PNAC someplace else on here.
The Bush regime is going for broke here. If Jeb wins in 2008 they can keep on trying, but that's pretty iffy so they need to get as much done as possible right now...Enough that the next guy is trapped in what policies can still be advanced.
This is the big push though, Mooseskin. I think you indicated that you were familiar with PNAC someplace else on here.
The Bush regime is going for broke here. If Jeb wins in 2008 they can keep on trying, but that's pretty iffy so they need to get as much done as possible right now...Enough that the next guy is trapped in what policies can still be advanced.
President Bush did not, but what if he did? These people we are dealing with rip the heads off innocent civilians, rape women, and beat their children every day. If you have any ounce of humanity in you you won't feel any compassion for these TERRORISTS. Canada better behave because when the shit gets ugly, who else are you going to run behind?
Re: RE: U.S.: Did President Bush Order Torture?
Nomoghrabi said:
You know this from one quote.
HAHAHHAHAHAHa
Sorry, but knee jerk patriotism is a disease. The US is going the way of all fascist regimes. We are going to have to defend ourselves against American fascists. The future does not look pretty.
Liberalism would have kept the US safe. Instead it will go down in a ball of fire of its own making.
Re: RE: U.S.: Did President Bush Order Torture?
Is this all you can say? Did you finish grade one before coming here to debate. No, HaHaHa. Wow, I am very impressed with your education level. Is this where Bush investing the millions and millions of dollars - Education.
Get a life. Canada will never kneel to you and your facist regime.
SewardSaint said:
Is this all you can say? Did you finish grade one before coming here to debate. No, HaHaHa. Wow, I am very impressed with your education level. Is this where Bush investing the millions and millions of dollars - Education.
Get a life. Canada will never kneel to you and your facist regime.
Documents released by the FBI make it pretty clear that did condone the use of torture. That would mean that he broke not just international law, but US domestic law. Your president is criminal, Seward.
You elected them.
Oh, I don't. I think they should all be rounded up and arrested. Georgie and Rummy and Cheney and Condie and, and, and....They should all be made to pay for their acts of terrorism.
The thing is that we don't have a history of running and hiding. A lot of that is because we don't piss people off by invading their countries and stealing their natural resources, so they aren't so prone to attacking us.
Those prisoners were hardly tortored.Reverend Blair said:
First of all, these terrorists aren't protected by any law. These terrorists don't fight using any morals or standards. These terrorists don't wear a uniform. These terrorists use suicide bombers and attack civilians. I will say again...these terrorists aren't protected by any law!!!!!!!!!
Not funny, in fact, pathetic.
This is why you live in *bad word edited*canada. Blame canada!!! Blame canada!!!
No, you have a history of needing the U.S. for protection. At least we got the balls to whats right in the world today. And personally, I can't wait until the U.S. gets out of the United Nations and away from those criminals.
Who ever talked about compassion? What we are talking about is that rationally, all people have certain rights, and these rights are violated. Few will doubt about the crimes some of them have committed (although I wonder how you know they beat their children, or even rape women, or even rip off the heads of innocent civilians - but we get the picture I guess), but again, that does not mean we can deny them from certain rights.SewardSaint said:
Well, everyone does have the right to join this forum and express their opinion; and it's also a rather fast conclusion that SewardSaint is more of a devil than a saint, I personally find that hard to say after just one post. I do agree though with your last statement, although I think SewardSaint's first post is more based on his/her own opinion - which I do not support, but I already said that.moghrabi said:
Is this abuse of the word fascist? Like to know your opinion about that. Can we talk about "the US" as a "fascist regime"? Is this not just easily said?Mooseskin Johnny said:
1) It's tortured, but that is just a small fact; 2) Have you ever written reports of HRW (LINK) and Amnesty International (LINK), what they have to say about - in this case - Guantanomo Bay? (in general, not specifically about torture) I don't feel the need to give links about what happened in the Abu Graib prison, I would say: the evidence is overwhelming.SewardSaint said:
But they're still humans right? With basic human rights not? Or is it more "eye for an eye"? What is your opinion about reports of innocent Iraqis who were treated horribly in the Abu Graib? What is moral about your approval of - in essence - doing with these detainees whatever you want, what I find barbaric an sich, even when it's not even sure whether they are guilty of any terrorist-whatsoever acts?StewardSaint said:
"At least we got the balls to whats right in the world today". Right :roll: Ehm how do you know "the" US is right, and "we" are wrong? Why is the UN just a bunch of "criminals"? I don't rely on one-liners in forming my personal opinion - they rather have a counter-effect.SewardSaint said:
SewardSaint said:
Can you kindly define what is right in the world today for you to have the balls to defend? Or do you have the balls to invade other nations as you wish without any regards to the UN or to internationl law?
And since when did Canada asked for your help? It is the other way around. On 9/11 to be exact. We welcomed your planes and civilians to our homes. Then just because we do not support an illegal war, we got the finger from your moron president who has a lot of blood on his hands.
Have a bloody day.
Time will come for the US of Abuse to kneel to its knees.