Trudeau’s abortion move guarantees renewed debate within Conservative party

[Cliffy]

What exactly have 'old men' decided on the abortion file here?.. That either decision goes and there's nothing anyone can do about it?

It's almost like you're acting all victimized

Oooo! Did she hit your old right wing man nerve?

 

[captain morgan]

Oooo! Did she hit your old right wing man nerve?

Don't see what political stripe has to do with it. Mind you, it's no surprise to see you chime in on this, you of course with the perpetual belief that 'da man' is always beating you down.

 

[Cliffy]

Don't see what political stripe has to do with it. Mind you, it's no surprise to see you chime in on this, you of course with the perpetual belief that 'da man' is always beating you down.

Who told that load of bullocks? Da man don't affect me one bit. Capitalist pigs, on the other hand, are pissing in my drinking water.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

It's interesting.. People put more thought into putting down their dog or cat more than it appears with abortion.

Kinda frightening really

The idea that a woman you've never met might abort a foetus you'd never meet if she kept it frightens you?

You never struck me as the easily frightened type before now.

 

[Colpy]

I excuse you for your brain fart.



So we're clear, you're ok with thought police, so long as it's a confidence vote or some other form of authoritarianism... You do know how the the Parliamentary system works, don't you? How many votes did Harper make confidence votes? Seems like even innocuous votes on minor bills then were grounds for treason in the Conservative party. So the comment about thought police still stands.

What did the riding association do that was against the rules, besides go against Harper's wishes? You do know how political parties in Canada work, right?

Other examples of extinguishing critical thought, Garth Turner. And the subsequent over-ruling of the Halton riding association, when the Conservative party hand picked a candidate to run against Turner...

Trying to paint one part as holier than thou compared to their arch rivals is stupid. They're politicians, don't swallow what they give you Colpy.

The budget is not a matter of conscience, which is what we are discussing. One can hardly say a simple matter of cash revenues requires one to snuff out their own moral foundation. AND when one runs for any party, you understand that you WILL be expected to vote the party line on confidence issues.

 

[gerryh]

Prolifers are speciesist.

Speciesism

Abortion supporters like Peter Singer classify a view that places a higher value on human life as opposed to animal life as "speciesist," because, he argues, that it unfairly discriminates against non-human persons.

He writes:

...those I would call ‘speciesists’ give greater weight to the interests of members of their own species when there is a clash between their interests and the interests of those of other species.

***

To give preference to the life of a being simply because it is a member of our species would put us in the same position as racists who give preference to those who are members of their race.1

Of course, the problem with racism is that it discriminates against one human compared to another based on skin colour, an arbitrary trait. But Singer’s point is that discriminating against non-humans is just as arbitrary.

Singer takes his argument further, however. He states that individuals should be valued not by their existence, but instead by their function. That is why he is willing to concede that the pre-born are biological human beings but not persons. He says,

The fetus, the grossly retarded ‘human vegetable’, even the newborn infant—all are indisputably members of the species homo sapiens, but none are self-aware, have a sense of future, or the capacity to relate to others.

Pro-lifers then, according to Singer, are speciesist because they fight for the right to life for human ‘non-persons’ but not for animals that ‘are’ persons.

Speciesism

animals aren't "persons".

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

animals aren't "persons".

But corporations are. Go figure.

 

[Cliffy]

animals aren't "persons".

Animals are not considered persons under law, but they are sentient beings and to some people, animals are more human than most humans. I have heard it argued that humans are animals, so if they can be considered persona, why not other animals.

This could get as messed up as the abortion debate.

 

[Colpy]

What's your beef? Abortion has a deep, personal, emotional, and life-changing impact on old right-wing men.

Our bodies, no choice!

lol...pretty much yes... speak to the younger male generation and they have a different perspective and understanding than many of the older men before them, not always right but it is different, and change will come as they see fit

little point in discussing it here, people just get pi ssed off and it gets personal

I do not have enough of an investment in it to take that kind of sh it that gets shoveled... not my calling, the younger generation will have to fight for whatever it is they believe is right

I wasn't kidding. The deep, personal, emotional, and life-changing effect abortion has on old right-wing men is called "getting elected."

Old guys. Can't live with 'em, and the law frowns on beating their heads in with a tire iron.

abortion and war...

old men decide both...sad but true

New poll shows most Canadians support abortion — with some restrictions | National Post

Please pay special attention to question two.

Do you support or oppose the introduction of a law in Canada that places limits on when a woman can have an abortion during her pregnancy, such as during the last trimester.

Support a law:

Men: 57%

Women: 62%

Old men my furry old ****.

 

[mentalfloss]

animals aren't "persons".

Not in the conventionally understood sense, no.

The more important point is that of autonomy and self awareness.

The point is that the decision should be made based on reducing pain and that is more difficult to accomplish for say, a fully fledged adult dolphin than it is for a fresh fetus.

 

[gerryh]

Oooo! Did she hit your old right wing man nerve?

calling pro-life as being a "right wing" thing is just showing your ignorance and bias.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

New poll shows most Canadians support abortion — with some restrictions | National Post

Please pay special attention to question two.

Do you support or oppose the introduction of a law in Canada that places limits on when a woman can have an abortion during her pregnancy, such as during the last trimester.

Support a law:

Men: 57%

Women: 62%

Old men my furry old ****.

But they never asked question 5: What business is it of yours?

 

[mentalfloss]

New poll shows most Canadians support abortion — with some restrictions | National Post

Please pay special attention to question two.

Do you support or oppose the introduction of a law in Canada that places limits on when a woman can have an abortion during her pregnancy, such as during the last trimester.

Support a law:

Men: 57%

Women: 62%

Old men my furry old ****.

Read the OP:

As for politics? The question is indeed settled. If it weren’t the federal Conservative party, which has a powerful social conservative wing and has – again, according to Ipsos data – drawn large numbers of conservative Roman Catholics away from the Liberals in the past decade, would be proposing to restrict late-term abortions, at the very least. That hasn’t happened because a) such procedures are already restricted; and b) the Tories know the ensuing debate would be wrenching, extend far beyond the partial measures being discussed now, because so many abortion opponents insist on a total ban, and would be catastrophic electorally. This, by the way, is the most important immediate consequence of Trudeau’s move: It guarantees the debate within the Conservative party on abortion will be renewed, which can’t help but cause Prime Minister Stephen Harper grief.

So, by all means Colpers.

Enforce that democracy.

I dares ya.

 

[Colpy]

Read the OP:

As for politics? The question is indeed settled. If it weren’t the federal Conservative party, which has a powerful social conservative wing and has – again, according to Ipsos data – drawn large numbers of conservative Roman Catholics away from the Liberals in the past decade, would be proposing to restrict late-term abortions, at the very least. That hasn’t happened because a) such procedures are already restricted; and b) the Tories know the ensuing debate would be wrenching, extend far beyond the partial measures being discussed now, because so many abortion opponents insist on a total ban, and would be catastrophic electorally. This, by the way, is the most important immediate consequence of Trudeau’s move: It guarantees the debate within the Conservative party on abortion will be renewed, which can’t help but cause Prime Minister Stephen Harper grief.

I love you "progressive" ****heads.

To you EVERYTHING is "settled".

Global warming, gun control, abortion, etc etc etc.

Here's a hint for your super-intellectual, smarter than homo sapiens buddies:

NOTHING IS EVER SETTLED.

That is the way life, history, and politics is........it is called reality.

**** you people are stupid.

 

[captain morgan]

Who told that load of bullocks? Da man don't affect me one bit. Capitalist pigs, on the other hand, are pissing in my drinking water.

How about the Communist pigs?.. They OK?

Memo to cliffy: Communist Pigs don't send welfare cheques... Everyone suffers equally in poverty

The idea that a woman you've never met might abort a foetus you'd never meet if she kept it frightens you?

You never struck me as the easily frightened type before now.

Have as many abortions as you like. I'm not the one that will have to live with the emotional trauma for years to come... So, fill yer boots bud.

I simply find the practice of using abortion as a form of retroactive contraception really nasty.

 

[mentalfloss]

I love you "progressive" ****heads.

To you EVERYTHING is "settled".

Global warming, gun control, abortion, etc etc etc.

Here's a hint for your super-intellectual buddies:

NOTHING IS EVER SETTLED.

That is the way life, history, and politics is........it is called reality.

**** you people are stupid.

Don't get upset Colpers, get even.

Or you can keep sending money to a party that doesn't actually represent your views.

It's your choice! Rofl

 

[Cliffy]

calling pro-life as being a "right wing" thing is just showing your ignorance and bias.

That is not what I said. I was commenting on the captain's knee jerk reaction to what she said.

 

[gerryh]

Read the OP:

As for politics? The question is indeed settled. If it weren’t the federal Conservative party, which has a powerful social conservative wing and has – again, according to Ipsos data – drawn large numbers of conservative Roman Catholics away from the Liberals in the past decade, would be proposing to restrict late-term abortions, at the very least. That hasn’t happened because a) such procedures are already restricted; and b) the Tories know the ensuing debate would be wrenching, extend far beyond the partial measures being discussed now, because so many abortion opponents insist on a total ban, and would be catastrophic electorally. This, by the way, is the most important immediate consequence of Trudeau’s move: It guarantees the debate within the Conservative party on abortion will be renewed, which can’t help but cause Prime Minister Stephen Harper grief.

No, they are not. There is no law, in Canada, restricting abortion in any way, shape, or form.

 

[Colpy]

Don't get upset Colpers, get even.

Or you can keep sending money to a party that doesn't actually represent your views.

It's your choice! Rofl

Read my posts.

So, I guess you like living in a stagnant society where the will of the majority does not, and can not change things.

I suggest you change THAT attitude.

And quit pretending the SCOC has restricted any law on abortion.............

T

 

[mentalfloss]

No, they are not. There is no law, in Canada, restricting abortion in any way, shape, or form.

What are you getting angry at me for?

Write to your Conservative MP right now!

Or you can continue to grit your teeth for the rest of your life.

It's your choice! :lol: