The Problem With Dubya

mrmom2

Senate Member
Mar 8, 2005
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I think that would make a good t shirt :wink: I've got one that says Bin laden CIA operative 79 to 89 .I was wearing it the other day and this women at the checkout stand pointed to it and said thats funny 8O I looked at her in disbelief and said its the truth and she just shook her head like I was nuts 8O It just goes to show you how brainwashed people really are :wink:
 

Ocean Breeze

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mrmom2 said:
I think that would make a good t shirt :wink: I've got one that says Bin laden CIA operative 79 to 89 .I was wearing it the other day and this women at the checkout stand pointed to it and said thats funny 8O I looked at her in disbelief and said its the truth and she just shook her head like I was nuts 8O It just goes to show you how brainwashed people really are :wink:

isn't that the truth???? :roll: Seems that many simply don't THINK.....or research the information, ......while simply following what the media "tells" them.

the other one for a good Tshirt is the Slime ( Time mag cover ) :wink:

Heck........ each quote from the current US "gov't". ( better described as gang or cabal) makes for T-Shirt/ bumper sticker material. :wink: (not to mention fodder for comedians ;-)
 

Jo Canadian

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Mar 15, 2005
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PEI...for now
 

Ocean Breeze

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Jo Canadian said:

Is georgie boy wearing cowboy boots in this "formal" family "portrait"??? (or are his pants too short??? :wink:

still rebelling and attention seeking. (Look at ME) :wink:
 

Ocean Breeze

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http://www.consortiumnews.com/2005/062305.html

the self centred prez, who believes the world revolves around him and he can do what he wants with it. A man , who never grew up and is still locked in that self centred developmental stage of "ME" and "I".

(sigh)

In a bizarre way he might be the "right" US leader in this time..... as he is portraying to the world in living color what the US has been like for many years now. He might be the man to seal the US fate and future.---in a declining society.

Interesting process.
 

jjw1965

Electoral Member
Jul 8, 2005
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Most Americans believe the lies spun by the mainsteam media, I for one never believed the crap they told, I know the government orchestrated the whole event.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State."
-- Joseph Goebbels, German Minister of Propaganda, 1933-1945
 

Ocean Breeze

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jjw1965 said:
Most Americans believe the lies spun by the mainsteam media, I for one never believed the crap they told, I know the government orchestrated the whole event.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State."
-- Joseph Goebbels, German Minister of Propaganda, 1933-1945


Goebbel.......is exactly the modality they followed and follow.

(good for you , for not buying into their crap. Gotta tell ya, it is so refreshing to hear from a THINKING American. Bravo and keep up the good work.postings.. :)
 

Ocean Breeze

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Is there no end to U.S. scandals?
6/30/2005 6:45:00 AM GMT




The U.S. bullied most countries into sharing whatever intelligence they had on ‘Islamic groups’


By: Muqtedar Khan

Washington DC is rapidly becoming the scandal capital of the world. The scandals seem to be unending.

Starting with the WMDs intelligence fiasco, the Halliburton story, Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo, The Qur’an desecration, Amnesty and the “gulag” episode and now the expose of CIA’s diversification into international kidnapping. What next, a revelation that the CIA’s kidnapping wing has merged with Abu Sayyaf’s gang to expand its kidnapping activities into the Far East?

The now unfolding crisis triggered by an Italian judge who has issued arrest orders for 13 individuals allegedly associated with the CIA highlights European anger at what they see as America’s disregard for European laws. The case involves a practice called “extraordinary rendition” – which basically means that Americans kidnap individuals allegedly linked with the so-called “terrorist groups” and take them to other countries where they are tortured.

Clearly there is more to the case. This is apparently not the first time that U.S. agencies have resorted to the practice of rendition. It has been done before with the collaboration of local officials. But the extraordinary press that this particular incident is getting, obviously due to a determination on the part of Italian officials to go public indicates that there is more to this than extra territorial kidnapping.

Italian officials seem to be determined to expose American practices in Italy as illegal, overbearing, arrogant and uncooperative.

Why would a judge issue warrants that have admittedly zero probability of being executed if not to recruit international public opinion to achieve what he obviously has failed to do through proper channels, whatever they may be. It is my guess that the Italian prosecutor frustrated by his inability to get answers from Americans or persuade the right wing government of Berlusconi to get some answers through higher channels has decided to take his case to the international media. The Italian investigators have gone to great lengths to document in detail the exorbitant expenditure patterns of the CIA agents. They are hoping that the U.S. Congress, which has given the Bush administration a lot of latitude to circumvent international laws in its ‘war on terror’, may at least hold some inquiries into CIA operations if only to review its expense allowances.

The case is exacerbated by European displeasure at the manner in which U.S. intelligence interacts with them. U.S. agencies are eager to get information from all sources but are reluctant to share what they know forcing European agencies – which unlike the American have to operate in environments with much higher levels of democratic protections and oversight mechanisms – to work in the dark.

Since 9/11, the U.S. has bullied most countries into sharing whatever intelligence they had on ‘Islamic groups’ and other armed groups, but has in return shared information only when it became necessary for specific operational purposes. This one-way traffic of information not only rankles officials in other countries but also raises the issue of what use the U.S. is to their own efforts.

The transatlantic divide on this issue is sure to widen. While the U.S. is treating its ‘counter terrorism’ efforts as a war, hence the sobriquet – ‘war on terror’, the Europeans continue to rely on the old paradigm of treating terrorism as a criminal issue. Because the two allies are operating under entirely different paradigms their tactics are also at variance. The problem with this situation is that all the violations are taking place in Europe and the perpetrator is the U.S.

The Guardian reported on June 26, 2005 that several nations had similar problems with the U.S. and were beginning to take action. Canada is holding hearings into the deportation of a Canadian to Syria for questioning about alleged ties to Al Qaeda. German prosecutors are conducting a criminal investigation into the suspected kidnapping of a German man who was flown to Afghanistan. In Stockholm, a parliamentary investigator has already concluded that CIA agents violated Swedish law by subjecting two Egyptian nationals to 'degrading and inhuman treatment' during a rendition in 2001.

Anger and frustration with American tactics will have a severe toll on intelligence cooperation. Already European law enforcement agencies are spending time and resources investigating Americans. Soon they all may have two separate divisions, one to investigate “Al Qaeda” and the other to investigate illegal U.S activities. Several recent intelligence commissions have exposed the vast limitations of U.S. intelligence system. Clearly it is woeful. If it loses the faith, support and cooperation of several allied nations then the U.S. intelligence gathering and covert operations will have to face more severe challenges with lesser resources.

The key to all such problems is the gross inability of the Bush administration to understand and appreciate the importance and vital significance of multilateralism. Diplomacy is key to international cooperation. Diplomacy is not something that the State Departments alone should pursue; it is a style of management that all American agencies must adopt both overseas and at home. Until the Bush administration develops a more sophisticated understanding of diplomacy it will continue to have periodic scandals in myriad areas.
 

Curiosity

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Jul 30, 2005
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Re: RE: The Problem With Dubya

moghrabi said:
there is a 9/11 almost daily in different countries. How come we don't hear about the impact on their people. Or is America too special to inflict on others what it does not want to be inflicted on it.

Have to disagree Moghrabi

Americans are devastated by what is happening around the world.
You forget it has been happening for decades and nobody has paid attention to it.

You are upset because the U.S. decided to retaliate?
 

Ocean Breeze

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Ignorance Is Bliss; Sometimes It's Policy

By Eugene Robinson

Friday, August 5, 2005; Page A15

The ranch at Crawford hardly compares with the Forbidden City, but George W. Bush has something in common with the Ming emperors of China: He seems determined to make his great nation less ambitious and more ignorant.

He wouldn't see it that way, of course, but the emperors didn't see it that way either. And I don't know how else to explain policies and pronouncements that make the quest for knowledge conditional on politics. That is a prescription for decline.


In the early 1400s the Ming emperor Zhu Di made China into the world's leading maritime nation, sending huge fleets on missions of trade and exploration as far as the Swahili coast of Africa. It should have been just a matter of a few years before Chinese sailors discovered the Americas. But Zhu Di's successors, influenced by court politics, called home the fleets and forbade them to sail again, forfeiting the riches of the New World -- and five centuries of global domination -- to an underdeveloped backwater called Europe.

I guess it's a general rule of political dynasties, in China as well as in Texas, that the blood thins with successive generations.

Examples? Well, there's the way Bush insists on hamstringing American scientists who are trying to explore the potential medical benefits of therapies involving embryonic stem cells.

You are excused if your eyes glaze over at the mention of the words "stem cells," but it's enough to know that Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, in a rare display of backbone, has challenged the president over his suffocating restrictions on federal funding for stem cell research -- and also that the fight is akin to arguing over what kind of lock to put on the barn door while the horse frolics in the next county.

While our leaders disagree, stem cell technology is being developed and advanced in laboratories all around the world, especially in Asia. South Korean researchers have arguably pushed farther than anyone else. At the moment it's still a long shot that embryonic stem cells will prove to be a panacea, but if they do it's increasingly likely that the key discoveries will be made elsewhere -- not in the United States.

And there's no real reason for Bush's position except politics. All that Frist and other reasonable people want is to be able to experiment on surplus embryos from fertility clinics, embryos that otherwise will be destroyed. But the radical pro-life lobby won't be reasonable, so Bush does his best to keep the United States on the sidelines of what is, at the moment, the most exciting field of medical research.

Then there's this administration's almost comical insistence that the firm scientific consensus on global climate change is some kind of mass hallucination. "What global warming?" they ask, as mean temperatures rise, Arctic ice melts, tropical diseases march north and hurricanes rake poor Florida in swarms.

The much-maligned Kyoto treaty isn't the point. Treaty or no treaty, it looks as if sooner or later the world is going to have to find a way to prosper without spewing so much heat-trapping carbon dioxide into the atmosphere. Other nations are busy trying to develop technology and coping mechanisms to prepare for that day. When it comes, we'll be at or near the back of the line.

Maybe we'll line up all our obsolete SUVs along the coast to try to hold back the rising sea.

To round out the trifecta, the other day Bush reiterated his support for teaching "intelligent design" in America's schools along with evolution, as a way of exposing students to different points of view. This really borders on madness.

Intelligent design isn't a scientific theory at all; it's a matter of faith -- Creationism 2.0. Faith is a different kind of truth. Charles Darwin's landmark discovery of evolution, with a few minor modifications and additions over the years, has proved to be one of the sturdiest and most unassailable scientific theories of all time. To the extent that science can say anything is true, evolution is scientifically true. Done. Settled. As Walter Cronkite used to say, "That's the way it is."

To teach American children in science class that intelligent design is an alternative explanation of how birds, anteaters and people came to be birds, anteaters and people is simply to make American children less well educated than children elsewhere.

By all rights, we ought to remember the Ming dynasty for discovering America; instead, we think of gorgeous pottery but not much else. China's current leaders seem determined not to make the same mistake.
 

GL Schmitt

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Mar 12, 2005
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I believe the chances are quite good, provided you are willing to donate $100,000.00 dollars toward his still-to-be-ghostwritten presidential memoirs, and promise not to serve any Canadian delicacies like poutine. :wink:
 

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: The Problem With Duby

Sy said:
Does anyone think Mr. Bush would accept a personal invitation to dinner at my house?

the operative question is this, WHY in heck would you want to invite him to your house anyhow??? :wink:

You would have to fumigate your home after he left. Remember the MESS he and his contingency left in England when he "visited" the QUEEN??? Gardens were destroyed... :(
 

Reverend Blair

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Apr 3, 2004
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RE: The Problem With Duby

He'll drink all of your booze and spend the entire night running to the bathroom to snort white powders anyway, Sy. You're better off inviting the twins. Rumour is they like to party naked.
 

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: The Problem With Duby

Reverend Blair said:
He'll drink all of your booze and spend the entire night running to the bathroom to snort white powders anyway, Sy. You're better off inviting the twins. Rumour is they like to party naked.
:wink:

all the while on his mobile phone pretending to run HIS country. :wink:

(Sy, IF you do invite him and he actually shows up.....RECORD every moment on video... :wink: --and then post it here. :wink:
 

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: The Problem With Duby

Reverend Blair said:
...and if the twins show up to party naked, please do the same.
:wink:

And /or , install webcams in every room of your place and provide us with some live feed. ( meanwhile recording this "event" for our replaying pleasure :wink:

oh! and don't forget to do an invasive/intrusive complete body (security) check on him. We all know how dishonest he is.

and count the silver/nic naks when he leaves :wink:
 

GL Schmitt

Electoral Member
Mar 12, 2005
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Incurious George has begun his 49th trip to his Crawford ranch, being the 319th day spent, entirely or partially, cowboying about in his trusty golf cart. That's nearly 20 percent of his presidency to date.

Weekends and holidays at Camp David or at his parents' compound in Kennebunkport, Maine, bump up the proportion of the War President’s time away from Washington even further.

My problem with this information is that I am uncertain if this represents The Problem With Dubya or one of the few blessings.


Washington Post story here: Bush poised to set new vacation record
 

Ocean Breeze

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http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0809-04.htm


Dubya's problems seem to be compounding on themselves. Venezuela warns the US ......should the war mongering/loving :evil: Bush decide to invade them.

a pattern is building and a whole new geo political scenario is taking shape. With each shift.......the USG loses influence and "power". (whether it realizes it yet or not).

gosh, hope bushie enjoys his holiday. Should be no real problem for him with the layers of "security " that surrounds him. The same layers that prevent him from seeing the entire picture of what he has created so far. The US(G) is getting more "isolated " all the time.. but in a very subtle way ....to date. (both by its choices and from the outside) Sad really.