The Improbability of God
- Thread starter Scott Free
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Keep laughing boys and girls,
Just like in the times of Noah.
Oh, by the way:
Solomon Chapter 6
" 1: Hear therefore, O ye kings, and understand; learn, ye that be judges of the ends of the earth.
2: Give ear, ye that rule the people, and glory in the multitude of nations.
3: For power is given you of the Lord, and sovereignty from the Highest, who shall try your works, and search out your counsels.
4: Because, being ministers of his kingdom, ye have not judged aright, nor kept the law, nor walked after the counsel of God;
5: Horribly and speedily shall he come upon you: for a sharp judgment shall be to them that be in high places.
6: For mercy will soon pardon the meanest: but mighty men shall be mightily tormented.
7: For he which is Lord over all shall fear no man's person, neither shall he stand in awe of any man's greatness: for he hath made the small and great, and careth for all alike.
8: But a sore trial shall come upon the mighty.
9: Unto you therefore, O kings, do I speak, that ye may learn wisdom, and not fall away.
10: For they that keep holiness holily shall be judged holy: and they that have learned such things shall find what to answer.
11: Wherefore set your affection upon my words; desire them, and ye shall be instructed.
12: Wisdom is glorious, and never fadeth away: yea, she is easily seen of them that love her, and found of such as seek her.
13: She preventeth them that desire her, in making herself first known unto them.
14: Whoso seeketh her early shall have no great travail: for he shall find her sitting at his doors.
15: To think therefore upon her is perfection of wisdom: and whoso watcheth for her shall quickly be without care.
16: For she goeth about seeking such as are worthy of her, sheweth herself favourably unto them in the ways, and meeteth them in every thought.
17: For the very true beginning of her is the desire of discipline; and the care of discipline is love;
18: And love is the keeping of her laws; and the giving heed unto her laws is the assurance of incorruption;
19: And incorruption maketh us near unto God:
20: Therefore the desire of wisdom bringeth to a kingdom.
21: If your delight be then in thrones and sceptres, O ye kings of the people, honour wisdom, that ye may reign for evermore.
22: As for wisdom, what she is, and how she came up, I will tell you, and will not hide mysteries from you: but will seek her out from the beginning of her nativity, and bring the knowledge of her into light, and will not pass over the truth.
23: Neither will I go with consuming envy; for such a man shall have no fellowship with wisdom.
24: But the multitude of the wise is the welfare of the world: and a wise king is the upholding of the people.
25: Receive therefore instruction through my words, and it shall do you good."
Have another good laugh over Solomon's words.
Repentance, as described by most messengers, is a message for the "Kings and those in high places".
Just like in the times of Noah.
Oh, by the way:
Solomon Chapter 6
" 1: Hear therefore, O ye kings, and understand; learn, ye that be judges of the ends of the earth.
2: Give ear, ye that rule the people, and glory in the multitude of nations.
3: For power is given you of the Lord, and sovereignty from the Highest, who shall try your works, and search out your counsels.
4: Because, being ministers of his kingdom, ye have not judged aright, nor kept the law, nor walked after the counsel of God;
5: Horribly and speedily shall he come upon you: for a sharp judgment shall be to them that be in high places.
6: For mercy will soon pardon the meanest: but mighty men shall be mightily tormented.
7: For he which is Lord over all shall fear no man's person, neither shall he stand in awe of any man's greatness: for he hath made the small and great, and careth for all alike.
8: But a sore trial shall come upon the mighty.
9: Unto you therefore, O kings, do I speak, that ye may learn wisdom, and not fall away.
10: For they that keep holiness holily shall be judged holy: and they that have learned such things shall find what to answer.
11: Wherefore set your affection upon my words; desire them, and ye shall be instructed.
12: Wisdom is glorious, and never fadeth away: yea, she is easily seen of them that love her, and found of such as seek her.
13: She preventeth them that desire her, in making herself first known unto them.
14: Whoso seeketh her early shall have no great travail: for he shall find her sitting at his doors.
15: To think therefore upon her is perfection of wisdom: and whoso watcheth for her shall quickly be without care.
16: For she goeth about seeking such as are worthy of her, sheweth herself favourably unto them in the ways, and meeteth them in every thought.
17: For the very true beginning of her is the desire of discipline; and the care of discipline is love;
18: And love is the keeping of her laws; and the giving heed unto her laws is the assurance of incorruption;
19: And incorruption maketh us near unto God:
20: Therefore the desire of wisdom bringeth to a kingdom.
21: If your delight be then in thrones and sceptres, O ye kings of the people, honour wisdom, that ye may reign for evermore.
22: As for wisdom, what she is, and how she came up, I will tell you, and will not hide mysteries from you: but will seek her out from the beginning of her nativity, and bring the knowledge of her into light, and will not pass over the truth.
23: Neither will I go with consuming envy; for such a man shall have no fellowship with wisdom.
24: But the multitude of the wise is the welfare of the world: and a wise king is the upholding of the people.
25: Receive therefore instruction through my words, and it shall do you good."
Have another good laugh over Solomon's words.
Repentance, as described by most messengers, is a message for the "Kings and those in high places".
I forget which half of the brain is the one in charge of artistic things so I know that half works in you but what about the other half, the logical you. Remember those little avatars I used that were two pics in one. If you can see both sides clearly then both sides of your brain work, each half sees only one pic. Other than that this post has no real point. lol No nasty comebacks or I'll sic a verse on ya.
I would never laugh over Scripture but if you are saying that this applies to our time (or in our future) then it is after Christ's return and these verse are for who will rule over the ones who are standing after the Day of the Lord's wrath is finished. You don't just turn somebody lose with untold powers and let them learn on their own. First you give them teachers and then you set a period of time for 'classes' (in this instance it is a full 1,000 years of school, which means there is a lot to lean, then you turn them loose to be kings and priest) The 24 Elders in Revelation would be the best candidates to fulfill those verses.
Re:5:9:
And they sung a new song,
saying,
Thou art worthy to take the book,
and to open the seals thereof:
for thou wast slain,
and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred,
and tongue,
and people,
and nation;
Re:5:10:
And hast made us unto our God kings and priests:
and we shall reign on the earth.
What doesn't when you are a confused member?
I may be wrong but if it is a burden maybe you are supposed to keep it to yourself. Spreading the word is like a non-rewarding job.
I'm not taking you serious about the God connection or how this fits into prophecy.
On the part of a financial meltdown in America I totally agree, the way things are going it is just making it worse. Now if the world banks aren't hit the hardest (as in destroyed) then the meltdown is just a sham and this is their way of pulling the plug. If pictures of 3rd world countries are a bit depressing wait till America becomes the first 4th world country (no pictures allowed least the next victims of the banks see their fate somewhere down the line)
On the part of a financial meltdown in America I totally agree, the way things are going it is just making it worse. Now if the world banks aren't hit the hardest (as in destroyed) then the meltdown is just a sham and this is their way of pulling the plug. If pictures of 3rd world countries are a bit depressing wait till America becomes the first 4th world country (no pictures allowed least the next victims of the banks see their fate somewhere down the line)
Does it coincide with these words?
Isa:28:9:
Whom shall he teach knowledge?
and whom shall he make to understand doctrine?
them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
Isa:28:10:
For precept must be upon precept,
precept upon precept;
line upon line, line upon line;
here a little,
and there a little:
Isa:28:11:
For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
Isa:28:12:
To whom he said,
This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest;
and this is the refreshing:
yet they would not hear.
Isa:28:13:
But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept,
precept upon precept;
line upon line,
line upon line;
here a little,
and there a little;
that they might go,
and fall backward,
and be broken,
and snared,
and taken.
You already seem to be aware that if God has put scales over the eyes of some and as such it is only God who can remove them. That some have them is just another sign in a long list that says we are still on our own, which isn't hard to verify.
Opening Chapter of The Wisdom of Solomon:
Love righteousness, ye that be judges of the earth: think of the Lord with a good (heart,) and in simplicity of heart seek him.
[2] For he will be found of them that tempt him not; and sheweth himself unto such as do not distrust him.
[3] For froward thoughts separate from God: and his power, when it is tried, reproveth the unwise.
[4] For into a malicious soul wisdom shall not enter; nor dwell in the body that is subject unto sin.
[5] For the holy spirit of discipline will flee deceit, and remove from thoughts that are without understanding, and will not abide when unrighteousness cometh in.
[6] For wisdom is a loving spirit; and will not acquit a blasphemer of his words: for God is witness of his reins, and a true beholder of his heart, and a hearer of his tongue.
[7] For the Spirit of the Lord filleth the world: and that which containeth all things hath knowledge of the voice.
[8] Therefore he that speaketh unrighteous things cannot be hid: neither shall vengeance, when it punisheth, pass by him.
[9] For inquisition shall be made into the counsels of the ungodly: and the sound of his words shall come unto the Lord for the manifestation of his wicked deeds.
[10] For the ear of jealousy heareth all things: and the noise of murmurings is not hid.
[11] Therefore beware of murmuring, which is unprofitable; and refrain your tongue from backbiting: for there is no word so secret, that shall go for nought: and the mouth that belieth slayeth the soul.
[12] Seek not death in the error of your life: and pull not upon yourselves destruction with the works of your hands.
[13] For God made not death: neither hath he pleasure in the destruction of the living.
[14] For he created all things, that they might have their being: and the generations of the world were healthful; and there is no poison of destruction in them, nor the kingdom of death upon the earth:
[15] (For righteousness is immortal
[16] But ungodly men with their works and words called it to them: for when they thought to have it their friend, they consumed to nought, and made a covenant with it, because they are worthy to take part with it.
This book is based on the observations of a King and his reflections on his relationship with God. It encourages us to seek wisdom and should wisdom be sought, the prayer will be answered.
I'm finished pouting, so I'll try to explain what I know.
The Law of Cause and Effect exists in the world and it is articulated as one of God's Laws. There are others, but this one is crucial to understand. A review of the first chapters of the Teachings of Bhudda allude to the same thing. We live in a world governed by Cause and Effect.
The question becomes how do we live a balanced life, in harmony with creation for our own benefit and the benefit of future generations. We have to do so by the use of a code. Without a code, which people can count on you can't build trust.
Christ's teachings provide such a code, I am talking about his teachings, not religious dogma and doctrine.
Consider if, at the end of this millenium, the second of Christ, we applied His code to commerce and trade for example, we would end up with an economy based on reciprocity, goodwill and collaboration.
Would it be wise?
We are told Wisdom is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.
There is truth in scripture certainly, but there is also truth in answers to prayer and that where three agree, things are written in Heaven. We are supposed to be discerning these things in the present. There are more covenants and answered prayers, which were the causes of our yesterday, in effect in the world than we have acknowledged. Two millenium of causes and effects not accounted for in our understanding of our relationship with God.
Today greed and self interest has brought the world to a place of stalemate.
We have to pick a new way forward.
Reciprocity , goodwill and collaboration, if heartfelt, would provide one option.
We could call this singing the Song of Christ, a new song.
Competition and self interest will provide another option.
This option will lead to scarcity, division and ultimately mass death.
We could call this the Song of Cain as it bears to ask the question, "Am I my brother's keeper?"
Two paths, one that can provide self grandisement and that leads ultimately to ruin, even if it might take a little time.
The other does not lead to quick riches, but to prosperity and certainty in the long run. I would suggest to you this is in line with God's promise.
I really like the fact you brought up Isaiah. A book that speaks of God's covenant and what happens to those that wish to enjoy the fruits of prosperity that comes with His covenant, but don't wish to walk the walk.
The simple fact is that when a nation under covenant doesn't walk the walk, as Isaiah points out, God can remove his protection, turn his back,etc. That is, leave the nation to its own devices without the benefit of Divine guidance or wisdom, an Ark without a rudder.
These are the circumstances in which we live.
I'm inspired to suggest you consider Isaiah 65 and on to the end of the book.
This is my concern for the present.
I view Christ as the writer of Hebrews articultaed, High Priest in the line of Melchizedek, our Priest King.
I have no idea when Christ will return, but I know I'd better be about the master's work if it is time for Him to come.
That would have to be in combination with the written word. Consulting outside book may not be the best approach you can take with Scripture. True it may appear to speed up understanding but if there is any error you will end up having to backtrack and there are quite a few who do not have a reverse, pride will not allow them to admit they can be in error, especially when confronted by somebody they see as their inferior. ie a rejector of Scripture feels they are above somebody who reads and believes. So while going just with the Holy Bible it may not be the fastest way to understand things but at least that understanding will be correct and since you don't have to backtrack. Not knowing something is just that, so is assuming things and proving things, one has at least 3 verses and the other has less than 3.
It would seem to be a matter of Law period. Without Law there is no sin. Once Law is introduced you have created two possibilities, obedience vs dis-obedience. Each has it's rewards and punishments well known. At the present no one can be classified as obeying, there are just various degrees of being in breach of God's Laws.
For a Christian it would be mostly based on how you treat others. I would curse a friend or somebody on here before I would do it to a stranger. There are enough verses to deal with that Law in quite a bit of detail.
Thats sure sounds like a multi-page subject. Best leave it for another thread, maybe in the Faith forum.
How about we start a lot sooner than that. Financial crisis means an overhaul ASAP. Study how God set up banks in the OT, apply that to now with Gentiles being equal to God's OT people, that just by itself would solve(some) problems right now and they would never return because the system is self-correcting. Course the un-Christian part is that it will not be willingly changed so some higher-ups today may have to be empaled along with their whole family. Apparently if done slow enough the next on the list are quite open to negotiations that incude a cut in their wages and postition in society as a whole. I doubt if threat alone would bring in a lasting change of heart. That may have to be applied to politics and religion as well.
After all the Romans aren't in trouble with God for sacking Jerusalem in 70AD and the governments of the Nations are the ones God will reward or punish depending on performance. Punishment is across the board some less than others but everyone will be paying up.
Many times in the past I have prayed for some help with the wording in the Book, I find those always result in some progress on that particular subject. The answer for the question about why it was so difficult in the first place was that it was in point form (by our standards because with God you only need one draft) It only matters that it can be understood, that it is totally understood means.......nothing as far as God is concerned, the show goes on just like He promised.
Sentence #1 has been in effect for 1,000's of years already, #3 is not yet obtainable.
By the time the US implodes nobody will want to lift even one finger to help. Unfortunately the really bad ones all escape and leave the tax-payers holding the bag.
Then sometimes it bends so much and then it totally snaps in a mere fraction of a second. For the bankers to shut Ameruica down it would take nothing more thanb putting all ATM's off-line. That was what they first protected on 911, the money.
When something is working right it doesn't need periodic 'improvements'. Henry ford started with a 4-banger, now we are right back there. If we had stayed there they would be improved even more than they have. Fix-it-yourself for everybody and a new one cost less than 1,000 before options. (armor plating means an extra engine just un case you wonder why that is 10,000 just by itself)
I'm not sure if wish is the right word. Why bring everybody (gathered an no condemned) alive for the 1,000 years, Satan is not finished until he had one more kick at the can. If God has a remnant of man there to greet him then it is enough to fulfill prophecy. Just like the 8 in the Ark, it was enough to rebuild mankind.
No Nation is under God's control, there are no Prophets sent by God, there are no Apostles to Christ operating at the moment. When things do start it is a whole total of two that preach the Gospel of Christ from inside the borders of Jerusalem, why mess around eh, go straight for what you came for. That should turn afew heads and start the tongues to wagging and teeth to gnashing (for some)LOL
The servents who are taken care of are those who are alive for the 1,000 years, the ones in torment are there for the 1,000 years before vthey are given permission to move to the new Earth.
It's on a need to know basis, as a child of light when it's time for you to know, you'll know and it won't be subtle in the least.
Later
No, I would actually prefer that Satan remain unknown to me in this life, except for the tiny part that wants to see what it takes to put him under the earth, that in itself is worth the price of admission from what i have read on the subject.
I haven't quite wrapped my head around that eternity without any boredom at all thing, that's a wait and see as it goes.
I haven't quite wrapped my head around that eternity without any boredom at all thing, that's a wait and see as it goes.
I doubt anyone will ever meet this Satan character, or ever has. The probability of it existing is likely about the same as that of gods, leprachauns, and the old woman who lived in the shoe who had so many children she didn't know what to do.