The danger of Hugo Chavez's successful Socialism

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
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RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
The Danger of Hugo Chávez's Successful Socialism
by Ted Rall

April 12, 2006

When the hated despots of nations like Saudi Arabia and Kazakhstan loot their countries' treasuries, transfer their oil wealth to personal Swiss bank accounts and use the rest to finance (in the House of Saud's case) terrorist extremists, American politicians praise them as trusted friends and allies. But when a democratically elected populist president uses Venezuela's oil profits to lift poor people out of poverty, they accuse him of pandering.

As the United States and Europe continue their shift toward a Darwinomic model where rapacious corporations accrue bigger and bigger profits while workers become poorer and poorer, the socialist economic model espoused by President Hugo Chávez has become wildly popular among Latin Americans tired of watching corrupt right-wing leaders enrich themselves at their expense. Left-of-center governments have recently won power in Argentina, Brazil, Colombia, Ecuador, Paraguay, Peru and Uruguay. Chávez's uncompromising rhetoric matches his politics, but what's really driving the American government and its corporate masters crazy is that he has the cash to back it up.

In their desperate frenzy to destroy Chávez, state-controlled media is resorting to some of the most transparently and hilariously hypocritical talking points ever. In the April 4th New York Times Juan Forero repeated the trope that Chávez's use of oil revenues is unfair -- even cheating somehow: "With Venezuela's oil revenues rising 32 percent last year," the paper exclaimed, "Mr. Chávez has been subsidizing samba parades in Brazil, eye surgery for poor Mexicans and even heating fuel for poor families from Maine to the Bronx to Philadelphia. By some estimates, the spending now surpasses the nearly $2 billion Washington allocates to pay for development programs and the drug war in western South America."

Chávez, the story continued, is poised to become "the next Fidel Castro, a hero to the masses who is intent on opposing every move the United States makes, but with an important advantage."

Heavens be! A rich country using its wealth to spread influence abroad! What God would permit such an abomination? Notice, by the way, that the United States funds "development programs." Oh, and it's a "drug war" -- not a bombing campaign against leftist insurgents who oppose South America's few remaining pro-U.S. right-wing regimes.

Quoted by the Times -- which editorialized in favor of and ran flattering profiles of the right-wing oligarchs who attempted to overthrow Chávez in a 2002 coup attempt -- is "critic" John Negroponte, whose day job happens to be as Bush's Director of National Intelligence. Negroponte complained that Chávez is "spending considerable sums involving himself in the political and economic life of other countries in Latin America and elsewhere, this despite the very real economic development and social needs of his own country."

Pot, kettle, please discuss the $1 billion a week we're wasting on Iraq while people die for lack of medical care and schools fall apart right here in America. Maybe Chávez should have found a better use for the money he spent on Rio's Carnival parade. On the other hand, at least it didn't go to bombs and torture camps.

Televangelist Pat Robertson's 2005 call to assassinate Chávez was criticized only mildly by establishment media, and primarily on the basis that murdering heads of state violates a U.S. law. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice accuses Chávez of a "Latin brand of populism that has taken countries down the drain." Which ones? Certainly not Venezuela itself, where a double-digit-GDP boom leads the region and new houses, $10 billion per year is banked for future anti-poverty programs and schools are sprouting like weeds.

Loaded language unworthy of a junior high school newspaper is the norm in coverage of the Venezuelan president. "Chavez insists his government is democratic and accuses Washington of conspiring against him," the San Jose Mercury-News wrote on April 3rd. Why the "insists"? No international observer doubts that Venezuela, where the man who won the election gets to be president, is at least as democratic as the United States. The 2002 coup plotters gathered beforehand at the White House. Surely the Merc could grant Chávez's "accusation" as fact. The paper continued: "He says the United States was behind a short-lived 2002 coup, an allegation that U.S. officials reject." He also happens to be right, though it's hard to tell by reading that sentence.

Eighty-two percent of Venezuelans think Chávez is doing a good job. That's more than twice the approval rating by Americans of Bush. He roundly defeated an attempt to recall him. So why is Washington lecturing Caracas?

"The [Venezuelan] government is making billions of dollars [from its state oil company] and spending them on houses, education, medical care," notes CNN. And – gasp -- people's lives are improving.

What if the rest of us noticed? No wonder Chávez has to go.

Ted Rall is the editor of " Attitude 3: The New Subversive Online Cartoonists," an anthology of webcartoons which will be published in May.



:lol:
 

Jay

Executive Branch Member
Jan 7, 2005
8,366
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As the United States and Europe continue their shift toward a Darwinomic model where rapacious corporations accrue bigger and bigger profits while workers become poorer and poorer

Lie.


But when a democratically elected populist president uses Venezuela's oil profits to lift poor people out of poverty, they accuse him of pandering

Lie

Chávez's uncompromising rhetoric matches his politics, but what's really driving the American government and its corporate masters crazy is that he has the cash to back it up.

Sort of a lie…..people are worried when werdos run governments have oodles of cash and threaten American stability. Lets just call it a lie.

No international observer doubts that Venezuela, where the man who won the election gets to be president, is at least as democratic as the United States.

Lie

Televangelist Pat Robertson's 2005 call to assassinate Chávez was criticized only mildly by establishment media, and primarily on the basis that murdering heads of state violates a U.S. law.

Lie

On the other hand, at least it didn't go to bombs and torture camps.

Lie, it also goes to arms and instead of torture he outright kills people. If he was tourturing people he wouldn't let us know anyways. Lies.

Eighty-two percent of Venezuelans think Chávez is doing a good job.

That's because they will be shot otherwise, what should be said is “18% of Venezuelans are very brave” So this is kinda a lie.

Ted Rall is the editor of " Attitude 3: The New Subversive Online Cartoonists," an anthology of webcartoons which will be published in May.

And a liar.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
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RE: The danger of Hugo Ch

Globalization sucks, you two better pick up a copy of Capital and get some friend, (if you have any) to read it to you. What a pair of frightened little capitalist piggy poodles. See you in the trenches. hahahahahahahaha
 

Jay

Executive Branch Member
Jan 7, 2005
8,366
3
38
Re: RE: The danger of Hugo Ch

darkbeaver said:
Globalization sucks, you two better pick up a copy of Capital and get some friend, (if you have any) to read it to you. What a pair of frightened little capitalist piggy poodles. See you in the trenches. hahahahahahahaha

Why don't you explain it to us since we can't read and have no friends....
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
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RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Venezuela's Currency Is Doing Even Worse Than Previously Thought
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...y-is-doing-even-worse-than-previously-thought

You should be more concerned with American currency but your,re a fanatical fan of a diseased western economic system being destroyed while we exchange pleasantrys.
 

spilledthebeer

Executive Branch Member
Jan 26, 2017
9,296
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The danger of Hugo Chavez's successful Socialism

*snicker*

Oh well.....before anybody gets too bent out of shape over that Chavez "successful socialism, they should first look at the date the date on the starting post at the head of this topic! It was 2006!

And of course the bloom is off the socialist lily! Oil prices are WAY DOWN and so it Venezuelan revenue! So much so that Chavez- who died of old age a while back is probably rolling over in his grave as the army- which has not been paid in many months- STEALS the food rations they are supposed to be handing out to the starving public!

A communist is merely a socialist with little patience! The communist drags out enemies of the state and shoots them in the head. The socialist merely allows enemies of the state to starve to death in some slum!

Its why all those illegals who have arrived in socialist Trudopia/Canada are swarming into homeless shelters!

LIE-berals do not care what happens to people- just so long as they are desperate enough to vote for socialist LIE-berals!
 

OpposingDigit

Electoral Member
Aug 27, 2017
903
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About 2 Million homeless and about 50 million folks on Food Stamps.

Homeless in America
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homelessness_in_the_United_States

Americans are so brave to fight for homes for Afghanistani Folks, but not brave enough to stand up against the Capitalists in their own country.





Justice In America: A Tale Of Two Crimes
Consider Paul Allen, 55, a former mortgage CEO who defrauded lenders of over $3 billion. This week, prosecutors celebrated the fact they got him a 40-month prison sentence. Consider Roy Brown, 54, a hungry homeless man who robbed a Louisiana bank of $100 - the teller gave him more but he handed the rest back. He felt bad the next day and surrendered to police. He got 15 years. Justice in America has a ways to go.
By Abby Zimet
June 24, 2011
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/another-messed-up-mortgage-meltdown-2011-06-24
http://www.bizjournals.com/birmingh...6/former-taylor-bean-ceo-gets-3-years-in.html
http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2009/01/28/prosecutions
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1353941#1355786

Ain't U.S. Capitalism Just Great ?

Detroit: Too broke to bury their dead
Money to bury Detroit's poor has dried up, forcing struggling families to abandon their loved ones in the morgue freezer.

Inside the Wayne County morgue in midtown Detroit, 67 bodies are piled up, unclaimed, in the freezing temperatures. Neither the families nor the county can afford to bury the corpses. So they stack up inside the freezer.
By Poppy Harlow
October 01, 2009
Bodies pile up in Detroit morgue; poor can't afford burial - Oct. 1, 2009

Unclaimed dead stack up in Wayne County morgue
"It really is a sign of how bad things have gotten," says Schmidt, 52, a 16-year veteran of the Detroit death scene. "Some people really have to make a choice of putting food on the table or burying their loved ones. It is very sad really. In all of my years here, I have never seen it this bad."
By Charlie LeDuff
August 06, 2009
http://detnews.com/article/20090806...nclaimed-dead-stack-up-in-Wayne-County-morgue

Overload of bodies fills Tennessee morgues
Families can't afford burials

There are more unclaimed bodies at the Davidson County medical examiner's office this year, as families found themselves unable to cover the expense of a funeral and burial. So many bodies have been donated to science in Tennessee this year that the Vanderbilt School of Medicine and the University of Tennessee Body Farm have stopped accepting cadaver donations.
Between July 1, 2006, and June 30, 2007, Metro handled 49 burials and 11 cremations. That number jumped to 97 burials and 31 cremations in the same period for 2008-09.
September 08, 2009
http://www.tennessean.com/article/2...33/Overload+of+bodies+fills+Tennessee+morgues

Indigent Burials Are on the Rise
Oregon, for example, has seen a 50 percent increase in the number of unclaimed bodies over the past few years, the majority left by families who say they cannot afford services. “There are more people in our cooler for a longer period of time,” said Dr. Karen Gunson, the state’s medical examiner. “It’s not that we’re not finding families, but that the families are having a harder time coming up with funds to cover burial or cremation costs.”
“I’ve been here for 24 years, and I can’t remember something like this happening before,” Dr. Gunson said.
By Katie Zezima
October 11, 2009
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/11/us/11burial.html
 
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spilledthebeer

Executive Branch Member
Jan 26, 2017
9,296
4
36
About 2 Million homeless and about 50 million folks on Food Stamps.

Homeless in America
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homelessness_in_the_United_States

Americans are so brave to fight for homes for Afghanistani Folks, but not brave enough to stand up against the Capitalists in their own country.





Justice In America: A Tale Of Two Crimes
Consider Paul Allen, 55, a former mortgage CEO who defrauded lenders of over $3 billion. This week, prosecutors celebrated the fact they got him a 40-month prison sentence. Consider Roy Brown, 54, a hungry homeless man who robbed a Louisiana bank of $100 - the teller gave him more but he handed the rest back. He felt bad the next day and surrendered to police. He got 15 years. Justice in America has a ways to go.
By Abby Zimet
June 24, 2011
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/another-messed-up-mortgage-meltdown-2011-06-24
http://www.bizjournals.com/birmingh...6/former-taylor-bean-ceo-gets-3-years-in.html
http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2009/01/28/prosecutions
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1353941#1355786

Ain't U.S. Capitalism Just Great ?

Detroit: Too broke to bury their dead
Money to bury Detroit's poor has dried up, forcing struggling families to abandon their loved ones in the morgue freezer.

Inside the Wayne County morgue in midtown Detroit, 67 bodies are piled up, unclaimed, in the freezing temperatures. Neither the families nor the county can afford to bury the corpses. So they stack up inside the freezer.
By Poppy Harlow
October 01, 2009
Bodies pile up in Detroit morgue; poor can't afford burial - Oct. 1, 2009

Unclaimed dead stack up in Wayne County morgue
"It really is a sign of how bad things have gotten," says Schmidt, 52, a 16-year veteran of the Detroit death scene. "Some people really have to make a choice of putting food on the table or burying their loved ones. It is very sad really. In all of my years here, I have never seen it this bad."
By Charlie LeDuff
August 06, 2009
http://detnews.com/article/20090806...nclaimed-dead-stack-up-in-Wayne-County-morgue

Overload of bodies fills Tennessee morgues
Families can't afford burials

There are more unclaimed bodies at the Davidson County medical examiner's office this year, as families found themselves unable to cover the expense of a funeral and burial. So many bodies have been donated to science in Tennessee this year that the Vanderbilt School of Medicine and the University of Tennessee Body Farm have stopped accepting cadaver donations.
Between July 1, 2006, and June 30, 2007, Metro handled 49 burials and 11 cremations. That number jumped to 97 burials and 31 cremations in the same period for 2008-09.
September 08, 2009
http://www.tennessean.com/article/2...33/Overload+of+bodies+fills+Tennessee+morgues

Indigent Burials Are on the Rise
Oregon, for example, has seen a 50 percent increase in the number of unclaimed bodies over the past few years, the majority left by families who say they cannot afford services. “There are more people in our cooler for a longer period of time,” said Dr. Karen Gunson, the state’s medical examiner. “It’s not that we’re not finding families, but that the families are having a harder time coming up with funds to cover burial or cremation costs.”
“I’ve been here for 24 years, and I can’t remember something like this happening before,” Dr. Gunson said.
By Katie Zezima
October 11, 2009
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/11/us/11burial.html

This is what happens when people stop voting- it allows stupid LIE-berals- with their VAST ENTITLEMENTS TO TAKE OVER -and to make massive messes!

Consider the socialist inspired Cdn mess- as described in this old post that is still relevant:


History repeats itself-most people know this axiom but apparently Lie-beral party members- and idiot socialists don’t believe it. How else to explain that the economic plan that has been presented by our new prime minister-Our idiot Boy Justin is almost identical to the disaster implemented by Ontari-owe premierand NDP socialist doorknob Bob (BOOB!) Rae 25 years ago? Even worse is that Ontari-owe provincial LIE-berals are working from the same borrow till you are rich play book! Our socialist LIE-beral Queen Wynne-bag has managed to double Ontari-owe debt with the same economic benefits as we got from Boob Rae!

Bob The Boob Rae has had more influence on the Lie-beral party than some people want to admit. After being turfed after one catastrophic term as Ontari-owe premier-the suddenly disgraced former NDP premier found his career in such tatters that he abandoned his beloved NDP and joined the Lie-berals...and in time became Lie-beral `interim` leader while they tried to decide what to do after their own terrifying disgrace of the three billion dollar adscam theft of tax dollars during the Lie-beral Chretien years.

Apparently The RAE Boob is more persuasive and influential with the weak minded and ill-educated then one might suppose! How else to explain that the economic so called plan that Justin Trudope wants to implement now that he is prime minister happens to be a near perfect retread of the plan Rae tried on in Ontari-owe when he became premier for that one disastrous term! Consider:

Rae wanted to end what he called corporate welfare-that long standing Lie-beral tradition of giving tax breaks to corporations in exchange for them setting up shop here and giving us jobs. And Rae wanted to make the rich pay-firstly because the rich have the most money and also because its hard to make the poor pay as they are...well....POOR! Rae wanted to put money into the pockets of ordinary people-by which he meant the civil service Working Family Hogs who largely elected him. Rae wanted to `stimulate` the economy with borrowed money so that we would all have more, wanted to aid the disadvantaged and clean up the environment and all that noble and high minded stuff.

What he ended up with was credit trouble on a massive scale as lenders don’t like to loan to dorks who have no idea how they will repay what they want to borrow. Worried lenders also like to punish careless spenders with HIGHER credit charges...hoping to scare the careless (like The Boob and The Boy) into better discipline. The rich resented the foolish NDP/Rae attitude and moved their investment money to other places out of his reach. Corporations reacted badly to his ending of tax breaks and his raising of tax rates and also moved on to other places, taking their jobs with them.

Company closings and job loses sent welfare costs soaring as people turned to NDP govt for help-and that was help Rae really could not afford to give as his revenue stream was turning into a trickle. Easy access to freely available govt money fuels inflation and civil service union Hogs wanted THEIR CUT.....they are ENTITLED you know!

We ended up with hospitals with no nurses, no doctors, no beds, no patients. I took a walk through Women’s College Hospital 2 years into the Reign of RAE Boob and it was a creepy ghost town on many floors.....empty, abandoned, no longer in use as its operation was unaffordable. Whole floors of Ontari-owe hospitals were shut down and forgotten, simply waiting for better days and a new election and more sensible money managers.

The day after Rae was elected, the heads of Toronto Housing Authority held an emergency meeting and agreed to CANCEL MILLIONS of dollars of maintenance contracts. As an example of the devastation, they cancelled a MILLION and a HALF dollars worth of contracts with ONE single moderate sized construction company, plus millions more with other businesses. None of it was enough to halt the govt red ink and Rae had to order civil servants to take unpaid days off while unaffordable govt business was neglected.

And now we have Justin Trudope trying to repeat the Rae plan. Our idiot Boy is going to spend us rich! Trudope does not talk of corporate welfare, he simply labels it as benefits for the rich....but it’s the same target...people and corporations....those people are not pretty but they are our employers and financiers and if they get pissed and shut down then what is to be done? Except admit govt stupidity and implement Rae Days and Trudope Tuesdays.....and HOPE that will save us.

People suddenly ORDERED to pay more tax don’t hand out raises or bonuses to deserving employees. Corporations that are paying more taxes don’t invest in new equipment or hire new people...especially if they are going to be hit with new payroll taxes for things like the `made in Ontari-owe` carbon tax and the new pension plan from Ontari-owe premier/ Great Whore McWynnty who has sold herself, her party and our future to the civil service Hogs.

Trudope has assured us his first act as prime minister will be to reduce taxes on the `middle class`-by which he means civil servants. Yes, the public sector people who are already getting about one third MORE for the same work done by people in private sector will be getting a tax break while Trudope economically bombs the private sector corporate employers we ordinary people depend upon.

The Hogs also typically take THREE PAID sick days for every SINGLE sick day taken by a private sector worker.....and ordinary people often DON’T get paid for sick days! The Hogs also have clothing allowance, dental benefits, drug plans, eye glass plans and a wonderful pension plan so rich that ordinary people are NOT ALLOWED by LAW to invest so much so often in THEIR private RRSP’s! About 35% OF Cdns cannot afford to take any holiday while Hogs demand EVEN MORE!

Trudope will also cancel income splitting to further punish the private sector workers who so clearly dislike him and will use that money in a HOPELESS attempt to rebuild Bankrupt Hog pension plans. OSSTF-the Ontari-owe high school teachers have the single largest pension fund in all of North America; Ontari-owe municipal employees are in the richest top five pension funds and Quebec municipal employees are in the top ten in North America.

Yet all the civil service Hog pension plans are faltering....the VAST riches already given to them are NOT ENOUGH....in spite of OSSTF getting a routine TWENTY to TWENTY FIVE PERCENT return on investment! Makes your paltry little GIC look SICK doesn’t it? Yet Hog entitlements are so gross that they are in danger of bankrupting ALL 19 of the civil service union pension plans in the next few years UNLESS they get VAST NEW infusions of cash......and there is the heart of the Trudope election campaign!!!

Just like Rae, Trudope plans to make the rich pay, without noticing that he will need them to create private sector jobs that actually PRODUCE tax revenue....instead of just SUCKING IT UP! Trudope will practice the same pork barrel politics for his friends and allies as Rae did, handing out ever larger sums of money to smaller and smaller groups of people-friends and allies of govt all. Trudope will find, as Rae did that the existing revenue just doesn’t go far enough and bankers just don’t like free spending dorks like Rae and Trudope and will refuse to lend. And of course bankers have the spectacle of the collapsing Greek economy to remind them of harsh reality every time they think of getting careless with money.

And just like Rae and just like Ontari-owe premier McWynnty, Trudope will find that Hog greed is insatiable....not enough money in the world for them! Give generously this year and they WILL be back again next year! Its why Dalton McGinty is no longer in politics...he DARED to impose restrictions on the Hogs and was driven from office. His successor-McWynnty stood in front of a pack of teachers howling for more gravy like rabid DOGS and SWORE she would do whatever it took to regain their trust....and yet, here they are STRIKING against her! There is NEVER enough for these Hogs!

And Rae? He was humiliated as the Hogs totally withdrew their support from his party because he pinched THEIR pennies and imposed his Rae days-unpaid days off when things got too messy. So why would there be any different result for Trudope? Nice hair and pious platitudes don’t pay the bills nor do they impress bankers!

Justin Trudope will become our worst ever prime minister and the future he creates will be stark and ugly......red ink and lost jobs and huge debts and a series of collapsing pension plans-both public AND private ones as 97 percent of ALL defined benefit plans are in serious trouble as of a couple of years back .Not that anybody would know it now as the Lie-beral friendly media whores have ceased to comment on it in deference to the brainless Boy and the Great Whore of Ontari-owe!

So congratulations to Justin Trudope-the dull witted, slow to learn `wanna be` Boob Rae` of the Lie-beral party! What Boob did to Ontari-owe, the gormless Boy with the nice hair for brains will do for Canada!
 

Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
6,326
4,028
113
Edmonton
I suppose if you call a starving population "successful" - quite frankly I don't know what to say - pretty stupefying. Who is this guy?
 

spilledthebeer

Executive Branch Member
Jan 26, 2017
9,296
4
36
Last I heard she refused to leave the Presidential Mansion. Were they able to get her out?

The daughter of Hugo Chavez was so entitled that she refused to leave the Presidential Palace? Does this suggest that Our idiot Boy Justin might follow suit and refuse to leave Stornoway? Can we expect- and HOPE for a real live show as cops drag the defeated
airhead out of the official residence by his heels?

I would pay money to see that! Oh.....wait....I AM PAYING MONEY! And considering the size of debt that Our idiot Boy has run up in his first two years in power- with two more years of idiocy to go- my great. great. great grand children will also be paying for the stupidity of Our idiot Boy!

And since the idiot Boy used to be a drama teacher I think we should all DEMAND a real public spectacle when he is defeated!

Yes- after all the LIE-beral waste and destructive policy we are ENTITLED to a grand farewell show!!!!