Stupid, Dumb and Just Plain Ignorant Cop Thread

White_Unifier

Senate Member
Feb 21, 2017
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"How you think any of this makes the British system worse than the Yankee version is beyond me!"

The US uses the British adversarial system too, as do the federal Government of Canada, most Canadian provinces, and many if not most or maybe even all Commonwealth states and maybe the Philippines too due to its being a former US colony.

So why do you talk of them as if they're different systems?
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Mar 18, 2013
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"How you think any of this makes the British system worse than the Yankee version is beyond me!"

The US uses the British adversarial system too, as do the federal Government of Canada, most Canadian provinces, and many if not most or maybe even all Commonwealth states and maybe the Philippines too due to its being a former US colony.

So why do you talk of them as if they're different systems.
I prefer the inquisitorial system as well.

spill doesn't know what we're talking about. He's as ignorant as he is stupid.
 

White_Unifier

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Feb 21, 2017
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I prefer the inquisitorial system as well.

spill doesn't know what we're talking about. He's as ignorant as he is stupid.

Now now, be kind. :)

I'm curious, bones. What do you prefer about the inquisitorial system?

I'm also curious. Would it be possible for a state that uses the adversarial system to allow an accused to request an inquisitorial hearing? And if it did, how would that work? for example, should he opt for the inquisitorial, would it then have to follow the inquisitorial system all the way through his hearing and any appeal that follows.

Interesting questions, anyway.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Now now, be kind. :)

I'm curious, bones. What do you prefer about the inquisitorial system?

I'm also curious. Would it be possible for a state that uses the adversarial system to allow an accused to request an inquisitorial hearing? And if it did, how would that work? for example, should he opt for the inquisitorial, would it then have to follow the inquisitorial system all the way through his hearing and any appeal that follows.

Interesting questions, anyway.
As the adversarial system has worked through its evolution, perversely the goal for the lawyers is to deny the factfinder as much information as humanly possible. It seems to me that maximum ignorance is not a good basis for decisionmaking.

Trials and procedures under the adversarial system also cost too much and there is no finality.. I'm not such a fool as to think the law produces justice, but it should at least strive to produce certainty.

Finally, I think the adversarial system attracts people who just want to fight to the law, where the inquisitorial system is a better fit for people whose orientation is to discovering the truth. I think the latter is a better personality fit for a field that is supposed to produce something approaching equity.
 

White_Unifier

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Feb 21, 2017
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As the adversarial system has worked through its evolution, perversely the goal for the lawyers is to deny the factfinder as much information as humanly possible. It seems to me that maximum ignorance is not a good basis for decisionmaking.

Trials and procedures under the adversarial system also cost too much and there is no finality.. I'm not such a fool as to think the law produces justice, but it should at least strive to produce certainty.

Finally, I think the adversarial system attracts people who just want to fight to the law, where the inquisitorial system is a better fit for people whose orientation is to discovering the truth. I think the latter is a better personality fit for a field that is supposed to produce something approaching equity.

Interesting. That has been my observation too, whereby the prosecution, district attorney, minister's counsel, etc., will oppose any request to present more information that should logically be in their possession.

But I can also understand how some people can become quite blindly attached to tradition, not to mention retraining into the inquisitorial system, etc. If a jurisdiction that has been using the adversarial system for generations wanted to switch to an inquisitorial system, I can imagine that a transition phase would probably be needed with the two systems existing side by side during that transition. An example I might imagine would be one in which the adversarial system would remain the default system but that the accused would have the right to opt out and request an inquisitorial hearing. I could see that as the initial transition phase, with the first inquisitorially trained judges presiding.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Interesting. That has been my observation too, whereby the prosecution, district attorney, minister's counsel, etc., will oppose any request to present more information that should logically be in their possession.

But I can also understand how some people can become quite blindly attached to tradition, not to mention retraining into the inquisitorial system, etc. If a jurisdiction that has been using the adversarial system for generations wanted to switch to an inquisitorial system, I can imagine that a transition phase would probably be needed with the two systems existing side by side during that transition. An example I might imagine would be one in which the adversarial system would remain the default system but that the accused would have the right to opt out and request an inquisitorial hearing. I could see that as the initial transition phase, with the first inquisitorially trained judges presiding.
Either that or change the rules a bit at a time. Just as the common law hardly exists anymore, having been codified to more than 95%, we could proceed like this. . .

The lawyers do their adversarial thing, then the judge asks questions as well, subject to objection.

Then the lawyers do their thing and the judge asks question NOT subject to objection.

And so on, phasing toward an inquisitorial model. We may find it more comfortable not to go all the way to, say, France, but still introduce significant elements of the inquisitorial system in our procedures.

Certainly as the world gets smaller and there's more and more intercourse between the systems, this becomes more possible.
 

White_Unifier

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Feb 21, 2017
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Good point. I agree.

Obviously such a good, practical idea that it has no chance of surviving the political process!

Hmmm... Could this be why I've never voted for a winning candidate in any election yet?

If I tell a candidate in an election that I'll be voting for him, he probably doesn't want to know my track record of voting for the winning candidate.

How's your voting record?
 

tay

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Officials say a Boston police officer who made a video with the tagline, “black people have met their match,” will be suspended without pay for six months.

Officer Joseph DeAngelo Jr. also has been ordered to participate in sensitivity and unconscious bias training, meet with community leaders and perform community service.

In the cellphone video, which was shot like a movie trailer, the tagline ran over an image of black women.

Boston Police Commissioner William B. Evans says DeAngelo told investigators that the video was intended to be a spoof on another officer. Police later determined the other officer was unaware he was in it.

In an open letter, DeAngelo says he apologizes for his actions and regrets the embarrassment the video has caused for the police department.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2017/06/30/boston-cop-suspended-video/442010001/
 

spilledthebeer

Executive Branch Member
Jan 26, 2017
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"How you think any of this makes the British system worse than the Yankee version is beyond me!"

The US uses the British adversarial system too, as do the federal Government of Canada, most Canadian provinces, and many if not most or maybe even all Commonwealth states and maybe the Philippines too due to its being a former US colony.

So why do you talk of them as if they're different systems?

Why are you e-mailing me? I am the guy supporting the British system by illustrating the British system being easier for people such as Hollywood Erin Brokovitch- the Yankee system requires higher specific proof for chemical poisoning than the British way

In the British system one has only to prove the chemical is poisonous- one does not have to supply as much information regarding the damage done by a specific dosage in the Yankee way- its the key scene in the movie.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
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Nakusp, BC
Disabled woman beaten bloody by TSA agents after becoming confused and afraid at security checkpoint





A disabled woman was beaten bloody by federal agents during an airport security screening while on her way to undergo treatment for a brain tumor.
Hannah Cohen set off the metal detector at a security checkpoint at the Memphis International Airport, and she was led away for additional screening, reported WREG-TV.
“They wanted to do further scanning, (but) she was reluctant — she didn’t understand what they were about to do,” said her mother, Shirley Cohen.
Cohen said she tried to tell agents with the Transportation Security Administration that her 19-year-old daughter is partially deaf, blind in one eye, paralyzed and easily confused — but she said police kept her away from the security agents.


Disabled woman beaten bloody by TSA agents after becoming confused and afraid at security checkpoint
 

spilledthebeer

Executive Branch Member
Jan 26, 2017
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He gets his law from films.

Its better than making it up on the fly as your repeated LIES are exposed as you do T-gurly! And how lame are that your arguments are being destroyed by a person you dismiss as a "Cdn wimp" and as a "retard"? HAHAHAHAHAHA! Just how sad is your situation anyway that your ONLY rebuttal to so much fact is a little name calling?

Oh well....it looks like the Cdn LIE-beral party might just have shot itself in both feet with the "award" to terror poster boy Omar Khadr? It ought to be really FUNNY watching Our idiot Boy Justin out campaigning in 2019 and trying to justify that crap! But then LIE-berals have never been much good at defending Canada! Consider:

Here is a nice story to illustrate that not all Cdns share the same values-and that some people have values that are properly labeled as `poisonous! With some comments of my own in brackets):

By Mark Bonokoski, Postmedia Network. First posted: Wednesday, October 05, 2016 06:41 PM EDT | Updated: Wednesday, October 05, 2016 08:22 PM EDT

A Montreal borough has followed through on a controversial plan to rename a park that honoured Vimy Ridge to instead pay tribute to late sovereigntist premier Jacques Parizeau. (THE CANADIAN PRESS/Paul Chiasson)

OTTAWA -- Those who lived in this so-called town that fun forgot, a phrase coined years ago by political columnist Allan Fotheringham, will never forget Quebec’s 1995 sovereignty referendum. It was definitely not fun.

During a single day in October of that year, Canada came within a razor’s edge of being busted up, its enemy being a separatist Quebec premier named Jacques Parizeau. Most Canadians saw him as a treasonous malcontent. As editor of the Ottawa Sun at the time, I recall writing editorials calling him a treacherous backslider.

He was aided, of course, by former Brian Mulroney cabinet minister Lucien Bouchard who, in a show of contempt for Mulroney’s two attempts to unify the country through the Charlottetown and Meech accords, bolted from the Tory ranks to form the federal Bloc Quebecois.

If Quebec had voted 50%-plus-one to separate in 1995, our confederation, which next year will celebrate 150 years as a united nation, would have been torn asunder.

Almost 95% of Quebecers turned out for that referendum vote, the largest turnout in the province’s history and, in the end, the “No” side won the day — by 50.58% to 49.42%. It was that close.

Today in Montreal, a park once named to honour the heroes of Vimy Ridge who fought and died in great numbers in World War One is now honouring a man most Canadians would still look upon as a traitor.

On Monday, Vimy Park was officially renamed Jacques Parizeau Park as if it were no big deal. Lest we forget apparently now means little.

Montreal Mayor Denis Coderre, a former federal Liberal cabinet minister first elected as an MP two years after the referendum, tweeted that because Vimy Park was never officially listed by the province, it essentially didn’t exist. He needs to give his unappreciative head a shake.

(But what else should we expect from a LIE-beral who never met a real, ordinary Cdn he did not feel MUCH superior to! And isn’t it typical that a LIE-beral would find some tiny technicality-the obscure `registration` issue- to hide behind while doing dirty work! And what else should Cdns expect from LIE-berals since their most famous leader-Pierre Trudeau stated that the war between Britain and Nazi Germany was a British imperialist war! Trudeau campaigned hard to get Canada OUT of the war and referred to any person who supported the war as a traitor to Canada who ought to be HUNG-AND offered to tie the rope himself! These quotes by Trudeau are available in the Ottawa Citizen review of the Max Nemni biography of Trudeau-and expanded upon in greater detail in the book itself.)

(Vimy was attacked 3 times during the First World War and it was a key strong point in the German line. In 1915, 500,000 French troops with light artillery support tried a sneak attack and lost 100,000 men-killed, wounded or captured

(In 1916 300,000 British troops, with more heavy artillery than any British army had before possessed, tried to blast their way up the Ridge. The Germans let them exhaust themselves on the lower slopes and then launched a counter attack that drove the British back PAST their starting point-with 150,000 British troops killed, wounded or captured.)

(In 1917 it was the turn of the Cdn Corps-all 88,000 of them. Cdn Commander Arthur Currie re-wrote the book on war at Vimy and his methods startled every general in Europe. The first Cdns began streaming out of the trenches at 9 am Easter Sunday and the first reached the top of Vimy at noon-the same day. By nightfall, they held all the Ridge except a bump at one end. The next day the advance went on. By the end of the second day, Curry and his Cdns had crushed every German obstacle placed in front of them.)

(In 48 hours, the Cdns suffered 3500 dead and 6500 wounded-one man in 9. For 3 years, Cdns had argued bitterly with their British allies about strategy and tactics with Cdns griping about everything from the location of British trenches to the way in which attacks were organized. Vimy transformed Cdns from being mouthy Colonial troops into valued allies and also pushed the demonstrably elite and now apparently infallible Cdn Corps into a key position in any subsequent British attack.)

Parizeau, meanwhile, lucked out. Born in 1930 into a family of wealth and privilege, he was too young to fight in the Second World War, or join up as part of Quebec’s storied 22ndRegiment, the fabled Van Doos.

Instead, Frere Jacques spent part of his carefree teenaged years being a very silly boy, honing his radical views and distributing pamphlets for the election campaign of communist Fred Rose, the only federal politician ever convicted of spying.

Rose was sentenced to six years in prison in 1947 after being implicated in spying for the Soviets when Soviet embassy clerk Igor Gouzenko famously defected with the goods, leading to his expulsion from the House of Commons.

(It is a gross insult that a famous moment in Cdn history should be shoved aside in favour of the traitor and trouble maker Parizeau. That the park should be renamed this way speaks volumes about the twisted values of some Montreal politicians! With LIE-berals leading the shameless movement!)

(Gosh it must be difficult to be a LIE-beral-so many things to be embarrassed about regarding the military, economics, shameless vote buying and general greed and selfishness. Watch how quickly they flag this post as proof of their shame!)

There is no Fred Rose Park, at least not yet.

(Though at the rate LIE-berals are kissing up to Muslim asses we WILL have an Omar Khadr Park in Montreal BEFORE we get a re-named Vimy Park! )

markbonokoski