Ontario’s new “tax on the rich” could reduce revenue

[El Barto]

BUt if you overtax the producers where is the incentive to work? If my slacker neighbour refuses to work more than 40 hrs a week and takes home $40000 after taxes and I put in 60 or so hrs only to be taxed down to the same takehome why would I bother to try to get ahead?

That is not an absolute statement that it would be like that, and you make it sound like the rich would get taxed to death.... that will never happen.
Topics like this always get pushed to extreme examples and hypothetical set ups.
At the end of the day the wealthy have way more oppertunities to avoid paying thier share.

 

[captain morgan]

A quick reply to that is the unfair tax breaks that others are privilaged to... and the accounting ways they are allowed to pay next to nothing.
Just that would be a huge improvement .

That would be an accurate statement if the tax rates were equal across all income levels, but even with a 'tax break' the higher income earners pay a higher percentage.

All you're doing at this point is structuring a higher societal reliance on one demographic and assuming/hoping that their income remains the same or increases over time

So earning $10000 a year and not paying any income tax is an unfair break that someone earning $80000 is not entitled to right?

Bingo!

That is not an absolute statement that it would be like that, and you make it sound like the rich would get taxed to death.... that will never happen.

... But you're willing to experiment at their expense

At the end of the day the wealthy have way more oppertunities to avoid paying thier share.

So then, what is the definition of 'fair share'?

 

[El Barto]

That would be an accurate statement if the tax rates were equal across all income levels, but even with a 'tax break' the higher income earners pay a higher percentage.

All you're doing at this point is structuring a higher societal reliance on one demographic and assuming/hoping that their income remains the same or increases over time



Bingo!



... But you're willing to experiment at their expense




So then, what is the definition of 'fair share'?

Oh I am not hoping anything. Before defining what thier fare share should be , we would have to see all thier tax breaks they are entitled to , and how they can play around the system as it does advantage them

 

[CDNBear]

Oh I am not hoping anything. Before defining what thier fare share should be , we would have to see all thier tax breaks they are entitled to , and how they can play around the system as it does advantage them

Bingo!!!

 

[captain morgan]

Oh I am not hoping anything. Before defining what thier fare share should be , we would have to see all thier tax breaks they are entitled to , and how they can play around the system as it does advantage them

Don't get your hopes up on enjoying a 'eureka' moment.

By in large, the tax breaks that you hear about require either an expenditure of money or a loss elsewhere (in very specific scenarios)... The only tax break that would be of any consequence would be an outright reduction in the marginal rate to 'the rich' and that ain't ever gonna happen.

In the end, the it comes down to the definition of 'fair' and I can't see any tangible expression of 'fair' that isn't founded on the principal of equality. As it stands, the tax system isn't equal as the marginal rates increase as the income level increases and certainly the word 'equal' no longer applies

 

[El Barto]

Don't get your hopes up on enjoying a 'eureka' moment.

By in large, the tax breaks that you hear about require either an expenditure of money or a loss elsewhere (in very specific scenarios)... The only tax break that would be of any consequence would be an outright reduction in the marginal rate to 'the rich' and that ain't ever gonna happen.

In the end, the it comes down to the definition of 'fair' and I can't see any tangible expression of 'fair' that isn't founded on the principal of equality. As it stands, the tax system isn't equal as the marginal rates increase as the income level increases and certainly the word 'equal' no longer applies

Get my hopes up? yeah riiight

 

[captain morgan]

Get my hopes up? yeah riiight

I didn't intend for that to sound condescending... Sorry

What I really should have said was that there is a lot of confusion on this issue (no surprise considering how complicated the tax laws are).

Often, the term 'tax break' is used in a manner that is overly simplified

 

[El Barto]

I didn't intend for that to sound condescending... Sorry

thanks

 

[JLM]

That is not an absolute statement that it would be like that, and you make it sound like the rich would get taxed to death.... that will never happen.
Topics like this always get pushed to extreme examples and hypothetical set ups.
At the end of the day the wealthy have way more opportunities to avoid paying thier share.[/QUOTE]

Ya they can pay a couple of the biggest crooks in the system..................accountants and lawyers! :lol:

 

[El Barto]

That is not an absolute statement that it would be like that, and you make it sound like the rich would get taxed to death.... that will never happen.
Topics like this always get pushed to extreme examples and hypothetical set ups.
At the end of the day the wealthy have way more opportunities to avoid paying thier share.[/QUOTE]

Ya they can pay a couple of the biggest crooks in the system..................accountants and lawyers! :lol:

Yeah , as a one liner there is truth to that.... I heard something said .....if you are paying taxes , change you accountant.

Just a quick unfair assessment bout those not paying any taxes at 10 k and those that do 80 k and up ... it is the one at 10 k will never be able to invest into the rrsp and the wealthy can. plus the fact they have money to invest into tax cuts like that is an advantage the 10 k revenue doesn't .... even if the wealthy get to pay more they will still be eating a steak at night.

 

[taxslave]

Yeah , as a one liner there is truth to that.... I heard something said .....if you are paying taxes , change you accountant.

Just a quick unfair assessment bout those not paying any taxes at 10 k and those that do 80 k and up ... it is the one at 10 k will never be able to invest into the rrsp and the wealthy can. plus the fact they have money to invest into tax cuts like that is an advantage the 10 k revenue doesn't .... even if the wealthy get to pay more they will still be eating a steak at night.

Again it comes down to defining fair share and reward for time invested. The really rich will simply move both themselves and their investments and all the jobs that go with it while the middle class gets stuck paying the bills for both themselves and those that do not contribute anything.

 

[Bar Sinister]

You do realize that many of which live abroad, and work here right?

Maybe, but as others have pointed out, there are ways around it.

Oh don't try and throw this back on me, it was your claim, I made none.

Nice try though.

You think so?

Ontario

There's the study again, can you show me the flaws in it? Pretty please.

Nice dodge.

 

[CDNBear]

Nice dodge.

That was almost as weak as your attempt to throw it back on me.

I'll just chalk your opinion of CD Howe under BS ideological nonsense than.

 

[Kreskin]

That is marginal tax rate. Someone making $500,001 before the change will pay an additional 3.1% on one dollar. It only applies to every taxable dollar earned above $500,000. If someone can't reduce their taxable income below $500,000 they need a new accountant. Or they need to stop whining and drink more.

 

[B00Mer]

You won't find me claiming they aren't in business to make money. I see, however, where the money is invested. It's not into houses in London and mansions in Florida, like Conrad Black, it's in businesses here in Canada. You might want to do some research.

Please don't think that I am ignorant about the fact's here.. I'm not going to get into it to much, but being you're are neighbor of his son, next time you see him.. pass a note that he should pay for all the damage to the homes on Lake Utopia, NB.

OH yeah, being New Brunswick Department of Environment denied him the use of the lake for his paper mill, he did an end run around the government and got permission from Ministry of Transportation, WTF??!!.. the money trail is being looked at..

Class Action Lawsuit pending, that's all I'm going to say..

[youtube]Hh6kKaYsdlo[/youtube]

 

[TenPenny]

Oh, boomer, you're so funny.

Typical, you don't get the facts correct, but you weave and dodge nicely. You're saying that the flooding at Bonny River was a result of the inheritance tax policy? Can you explain that one, or are you just reading from random chapters of the 'I hate the Irvings, but I'd like to have a job' book?

 

[beaker]

Re: Ontario’s new “tax on the rich” could reduce revenue

I think this is a variation of the placard we saw last week. The wealthy paying other wealthy to tell the middle class to blame the poor. CD Howe Institute definitely knows upon which side its bread is buttered. Over the years I have yet to see one of their studies have a negative connotation for large corporate "persons".

Governments might try living up to their promises of temporary taxes. Or make use of the ability to close tax dodges. I don't really expect that though, because that would impact on their own after politics wealth accumulation opportunities. It looks like a shell game to me.

 

[Cabbagesandking]

Re: Ontario’s new “tax on the rich” could reduce revenue

I think this is a variation of the placard we saw last week. The wealthy paying other wealthy to tell the middle class to blame the poor. CD Howe Institute definitely knows upon which side its bread is buttered. Over the years I have yet to see one of their studies have a negative connotation for large corporate "persons".

Governments might try living up to their promises of temporary taxes. Or make use of the ability to close tax dodges. I don't really expect that though, because that would impact on their own after politics wealth accumulation opportunities. It looks like a shell game to me.

How true!

 

[jariax]

This is the typical fearmongering from the wealthy.
If we raise taxes, the economy will fall apart. The only sensible solution is to lower taxes as much as possible.
Somehow, among all these golden goose analogies that they spin, they seem to lose sight of the fact that our taxes are much lower than in previous times of tremendous economic growth and prosperity.

 

[CDNBear]

This is the typical fearmongering from the wealthy. If we raise taxes, the economy will fall apart.

That's funny, I can't find that claim anywhere in the study.