NDP Have BIG plans in BC again!!!
- Thread starter insignificant
- Start date
RE: NDP Have BIG plans in
no i am not and i wish you would speak plainly what it is you think rather then playing these games.
no i am not and i wish you would speak plainly what it is you think rather then playing these games.
You're kidding, right? You've never heard of the Ant and the Grasshopper?
A quick summary...
An ant worked hard all summer gathering food to store for the winter. Meanwhile, a grasshopper played the days away, laughing at the ant all the while for wasting all that energy. Long story short, winter arrives, the cold hungry grasshopper dies, and the ant lives to work hard another summer.
Moral of the story... hard work pays off.
According to your post, you would have demanded the ant share his hard-earned food/wealth with the lazy grasshopper, even though he clearly was the master of his own misfortune.
Now... had the grasshopper stored any food, we'd have a whole other scenario.
A quick summary...
An ant worked hard all summer gathering food to store for the winter. Meanwhile, a grasshopper played the days away, laughing at the ant all the while for wasting all that energy. Long story short, winter arrives, the cold hungry grasshopper dies, and the ant lives to work hard another summer.
Moral of the story... hard work pays off.
According to your post, you would have demanded the ant share his hard-earned food/wealth with the lazy grasshopper, even though he clearly was the master of his own misfortune.
Now... had the grasshopper stored any food, we'd have a whole other scenario.
RE: NDP Have BIG plans in
I'm sorry you must of misunderstood me. When I said that a man could work very hard hoarding bread and milk but one must consider what work it is he has done. We are referring to corporations and the rich. If a corporation works really hard at driving villagers in Indonesia into poverty so that they will work in sweatshops thereby producing cheap goods that the corporation can sell, does the corporation deserve the reward? The corporation worked very hard indeed. Is this to be commended?
If someone can afford to live in luxury then they can afford to pay higher taxes. I'm talking about taxing the greedy. If you want to refer to a story that is a good analogy then use robin hood, not grasshoppers and the ants.
I'm sorry you must of misunderstood me. When I said that a man could work very hard hoarding bread and milk but one must consider what work it is he has done. We are referring to corporations and the rich. If a corporation works really hard at driving villagers in Indonesia into poverty so that they will work in sweatshops thereby producing cheap goods that the corporation can sell, does the corporation deserve the reward? The corporation worked very hard indeed. Is this to be commended?
If someone can afford to live in luxury then they can afford to pay higher taxes. I'm talking about taxing the greedy. If you want to refer to a story that is a good analogy then use robin hood, not grasshoppers and the ants.
No.. I didn't misunderstand. Do you honestly think every wealthy person earned their money off some poor labourer's back? Do you have any idea how much some labourers make nowadays? Electricians? Welders? Anyone else in the trades?
Those that live in luxury do pay higher taxes. Tax them any more and they'll take their corporations (and the jobs that go with them) elsewhere. Who can blame them?
Jheeeesh! I don't even know what to say to you... wealthy people are greedy? Labourers aren't?
Those that live in luxury do pay higher taxes. Tax them any more and they'll take their corporations (and the jobs that go with them) elsewhere. Who can blame them?
Jheeeesh! I don't even know what to say to you... wealthy people are greedy? Labourers aren't?
Both stories have relevance. That you can't see that tells me that you have a very narrow viewpoint.
RE: NDP Have BIG plans in
Nonetheless, you asked how the green party would pay for the proposition we talked of earlier. I have answered your question. I do not think that the wealthy will leave because of a tax hike. If some do, so be it. You are worried corporations would leave the province and take their job oppurtunities with them because of a tax hike. I do not think they will leave because of a tax hike, some may, but a dip in their profits is not the end of the world.
Nonetheless, you asked how the green party would pay for the proposition we talked of earlier. I have answered your question. I do not think that the wealthy will leave because of a tax hike. If some do, so be it. You are worried corporations would leave the province and take their job oppurtunities with them because of a tax hike. I do not think they will leave because of a tax hike, some may, but a dip in their profits is not the end of the world.
Calgary is booming, partly because many companies have moved their head offices there from B.C.
Everyone needs to pay his fair share of the taxes. People who earn a higher income already pay a higher rate than low income earners.
Everyone needs to pay his fair share of the taxes. People who earn a higher income already pay a higher rate than low income earners.
RE: NDP Have BIG plans in
I like the Green Party's idea a lot and I hope one day it is introduced into the province.
I like the Green Party's idea a lot and I hope one day it is introduced into the province.
Re: RE: NDP Have BIG plans in BC again!!!
Calgary is booming due to the very high prices of Oil, That means more jobs, and more people buy homes, not because a few companies moved there.
If oil were to tank like it did in the late 70's and early 80's Alberta and Calgary would implode. Albertans should remember those "dark days"
Alberta is basically a one industry province and its economy is determined by oil prices. Sure there are farms (not doing to good) and some forestry but the "black gold" is what makes Alberta go. Take that away and they would be a have not province.
LadyC said:
Calgary is booming due to the very high prices of Oil, That means more jobs, and more people buy homes, not because a few companies moved there.
If oil were to tank like it did in the late 70's and early 80's Alberta and Calgary would implode. Albertans should remember those "dark days"
Alberta is basically a one industry province and its economy is determined by oil prices. Sure there are farms (not doing to good) and some forestry but the "black gold" is what makes Alberta go. Take that away and they would be a have not province.
BC environmental groups have joined forces to get the message out about the liberals environmental rollbacks. Since the 2001 election more invironmental protection laws have been rolled back in this province than at any time in living memory. Examples:
1) Opening provincial parks and protected areas to commerical logging, rolling back protected area boundaries to accommodate mining and increasing park privatization.
2) Trying to implement permanent logging zones on public forest lands. If this is legislated, the so called working forest initative would give logging corporations private property rights over most of BC public lands.
3) Endangering wild salmon with aggressive expansion of salmon farms after lifting the moratorium on new salmon farms.
4) Lifting the moratorium on the the trophy hunting of grizzy bears, a species at risk.
5) Watering down pulp mill population standards designed to limit the discharge of dioxins.
6) Opposing ratification of the koyoto Accord, promoting dirty coal-fired power production, and pushing the federal government to lift the moratorium on coastal oil and gas development.
Agricultural lands and publicly owned lands are being developed and sold at greatly increased numbers.
Visit the www.BCfact.org to see the liberals record on the enviroment.
Vote "wild" on May 17 :wink: additonal websites with information
www.wildernesscommittee.org
www.environmentalleadership.org
1) Opening provincial parks and protected areas to commerical logging, rolling back protected area boundaries to accommodate mining and increasing park privatization.
2) Trying to implement permanent logging zones on public forest lands. If this is legislated, the so called working forest initative would give logging corporations private property rights over most of BC public lands.
3) Endangering wild salmon with aggressive expansion of salmon farms after lifting the moratorium on new salmon farms.
4) Lifting the moratorium on the the trophy hunting of grizzy bears, a species at risk.
5) Watering down pulp mill population standards designed to limit the discharge of dioxins.
6) Opposing ratification of the koyoto Accord, promoting dirty coal-fired power production, and pushing the federal government to lift the moratorium on coastal oil and gas development.
Agricultural lands and publicly owned lands are being developed and sold at greatly increased numbers.
Visit the www.BCfact.org to see the liberals record on the enviroment.
Vote "wild" on May 17 :wink: additonal websites with information
www.wildernesscommittee.org
www.environmentalleadership.org
WRONG! Many Corporations WILL leave if the NDP gets in and reverts back to their old ways! They did in the 90's, and they will do it again.
WRONG! Many corporations which moved to Alberta in the 90's were not in the energy sector at all. They moved due to the tax incentives that Klein was offering.
The only way that is going to happen is if Alberta runs out of oil. The worldwide demand is very high(especially China), thus making the barrel price very high.
This election will be about social conscious. I belive that the majority of British columbians still have it. The liberals under campbell have gutted and tried to destroy the social programs in this province, not satisfied with that they have moved on the greatest asset this province has, our environment. That is why every major environemental group has joined forces to act. Get informed, imform others and vote wild on May 17.
:lol: Hey, now I know why you buy all that soap - it's so you've got a soapbox to stand on! :lol: Good on you, peapod. 8)
RE: NDP Have BIG plans in
or an alternate fuel source to replace fossil fuels. But with so many right wing governments around it will never happen.
or an alternate fuel source to replace fossil fuels. But with so many right wing governments around it will never happen.
Well yes henry, the enviroment is my soapbox, and what better soapbox eh? I was brought into the world of dark forests, the sea, steep mountains and thousands of small islands. 8) I live in the world of enchantment and powerful beauty. 8) A place I dream of staying unspoiled and retaining its natural beauty. Its there big H I find my understanding and enlightenment 
And I am not alone. as the thousands of visitors that come here to experience this place. Its here big H, that you can touch the earth, and for a time experience self connected to the living world. The liberal policies want to do any with this experience big H, they seem to think that a mcdonalds in a provincial park is what we are all seeking. To that I say, lets see what british columbians want on election day.
Funding per hectare of national and provinical park land in British Columbia is $2.19 per hectare, in 2003. Parks canada is $14.63 per hectare in 2003.
In 2001 the provincial government of this province, the liberals made massive cuts to park programs, along with the services being cut in the parks, user taxes were introduced. The result was, and its a no brainer, park vistorship dropped. The liberals came up with more insane schemes. Silver star, Mt robson, manning and wells gray provincial parks now have commerical logging plans, sell logs to help pay for the park 8O 8O.
The landscape of this province is our greatest asset natural or otherwise, and the liberals are destroying it. On May17 vote Wild. 8)
And I am not alone. as the thousands of visitors that come here to experience this place. Its here big H, that you can touch the earth, and for a time experience self connected to the living world. The liberal policies want to do any with this experience big H, they seem to think that a mcdonalds in a provincial park is what we are all seeking. To that I say, lets see what british columbians want on election day. Funding per hectare of national and provinical park land in British Columbia is $2.19 per hectare, in 2003. Parks canada is $14.63 per hectare in 2003.
In 2001 the provincial government of this province, the liberals made massive cuts to park programs, along with the services being cut in the parks, user taxes were introduced. The result was, and its a no brainer, park vistorship dropped. The liberals came up with more insane schemes. Silver star, Mt robson, manning and wells gray provincial parks now have commerical logging plans, sell logs to help pay for the park 8O 8O.
The landscape of this province is our greatest asset natural or otherwise, and the liberals are destroying it. On May17 vote Wild. 8)
When the economy is doing well it is nothing to do with the party in power, you say, methinks that if the economy was doing badly you would be very quick to blame the BC Liberals.peapod said:
Your mainly rhetorical diatribe focusses primarily on revenues and fails to critically examine the spending side of the ledger. We elect politicians to manage expenditures. We do not elect politicians to manage the businesses that generate revenues. All government revenues come from Taxes, not from tourism, or commodities, or transfer payments etc.
Taxes can only be collected if there are businesses willing to invest in the province, regardless of the business cycle. Business is not willing to invest in a province that spends more money than its overall economy generates because they know that eventually they will have to pay the price through increased Taxes.
As you suggest a quick look at the past and present might be in order...
The Past:The BC NDP destroyed the credit rating of our province by spending more money than they could reasonably expect to raise in the form of taxes.
Because of the BC NDP we became a "have-not" province.
BC under the NDP had it's own sponsership scandal except that the Advertising Agencies were Trades Unions.
BC under the NDP BC had its own Gun Registry/HRDC scandal in the form of Fast-Cat Ferries.
The Present: The BC Liberals appear to have focussed some attention on, and discipline to managing the Taxes they screw out of us, and appear willing to manage the expenditure of this money so that we in BC live within our collective means.
Except for a drunk driving incident in Hawaii, which did little damage to the province, BC under the Liberals has been relatively scandal free.
The Future: With luck the BC Liberals will be allowed to continue the good work they are doing so that in four years time we can have our pride back and can move toward the future with some confidence that we can pay our way.
And I maintain swirl that the voters of british columbia will be voting in this election on social conscious. May 17 will decide if I am wrong. Vote wild :wink:
Whilst I empathise and support your goals, pod, as with humanity my observations, enquiries, experimentations and re-examinations lead me to the postulate that the evolution of Social Progress "is NOT a faith based system".
On 17th May the BC electorate will vote with their prejudices and/or pocket-books, the same way they always have. We live in a world controlled by capialists and accountants, neither of whom have a "social conscious [sic]". The problem with evolution is that it takes time, and the time you crave is not yet...
"And no one shall work for money, and no one shall work for fame,
But each for the joy of the working, and each, in his separate star,
Shall draw the Thing as he sees It for the God of Things as They are!"
On 17th May the BC electorate will vote with their prejudices and/or pocket-books, the same way they always have. We live in a world controlled by capialists and accountants, neither of whom have a "social conscious [sic]". The problem with evolution is that it takes time, and the time you crave is not yet...
"And no one shall work for money, and no one shall work for fame,
But each for the joy of the working, and each, in his separate star,
Shall draw the Thing as he sees It for the God of Things as They are!"
Well i might tend to agree with you somewhat on that silentswirl, The time has come in fact to decide and define what your social concious is.
People who have a social conscious, are not only thinking about compassion, they are thinking about the future of democracy. Educaton is a good example of this. Making education inaccessible to lower income and struggling students by hiking there tution fees, cutting grants, will have a effect on our society, education is necessary for the evolution of civil society.
What benefits are obtained from education for a civil society to exist, kind of a no brainer really. I will sum it up in a quote I read on a discussion paper on education.
"learning is about opportunity. Its about imagination. Its about innovation. Its about aspiring to excelllence. It opens up the world to each one of us. Its how we understand our obligations to one other, how we build a sense of justice. Its about how we see, how we feel, and how we understand the world within us and around us. It is also the means to which our democracy functions: an educated public holding our elected officals accountable."
So it is my opinion that lowering titution fees and making grants more accessable will only pave the way for a civil society to flourish.
Regardless, I believe that this election will be voted on the basis of social conscious or should I say evolution :lol: :wink:
People who have a social conscious, are not only thinking about compassion, they are thinking about the future of democracy. Educaton is a good example of this. Making education inaccessible to lower income and struggling students by hiking there tution fees, cutting grants, will have a effect on our society, education is necessary for the evolution of civil society.
What benefits are obtained from education for a civil society to exist, kind of a no brainer really. I will sum it up in a quote I read on a discussion paper on education.
"learning is about opportunity. Its about imagination. Its about innovation. Its about aspiring to excelllence. It opens up the world to each one of us. Its how we understand our obligations to one other, how we build a sense of justice. Its about how we see, how we feel, and how we understand the world within us and around us. It is also the means to which our democracy functions: an educated public holding our elected officals accountable."
So it is my opinion that lowering titution fees and making grants more accessable will only pave the way for a civil society to flourish.
Regardless, I believe that this election will be voted on the basis of social conscious or should I say evolution :lol: :wink: