Maritimes Future after Quebec Separation

[jimmoyer]

One thing that most American History scholars know is that if the South became independent during the civil war, most scholars think that America would have at least split into 4 or 5 countries instead of just two, and that some sort of alliance between some of the 4 countries would have occurred during WWI and WWII.

If the first province successfully splits, the precedent will seriously embolden the others to consider an option they thought was distant.

Whether this is good for Canada, I do not know.

 

[danielle]

I live in the Maritimes and I have never even considered the separation of Quebec as a viable happening. To my knowledge, Quebec wants to continue getting goodies from Canada whilst being separate from Canada. I can't see Canada allowing for that and I can't see Quebec being able to stand separate totally on her own with no help from Canada. Quebec is being a renegade and I hope no one puts up with it.

Perhaps I am way out in left field but I sure hope it is a temper tantrum that will grow up and go away.

 

[annabattler]

RE: Maritimes Future afte

Quebec,at this point,gets back far more,in federal transfer dollars,than it contributes to Ottawa.
The same is true for the Maritime provinces.
So,financially,Quebec would be a poor country.
The United states helped to finance the St Lawrence Seaway,and depends on it for shipping...no way the U.S. would allow Quebec to "take" that part of the Seaway.
I think those wishing to separate just like to keep the pressure on the feds...they certainly get a lot of mileage and a lot of perks for their 'separatism" rhetoric.

 

[Martin Le Acadien]

"What else can we do, chain 'em to the stove? If they want to go they will go. It isn't worth shooting people over...it isn't like they can go far."

This is a typically Canadian point of view. I have long believed that after two referendums, and a third on the horizon, that it is now time for Canada to consider military options.

The Civil War settled once and for all the question of slavery in the USA, The Revolutionary War also settled once and for all the question of the USAs position in the British Empire.

A Canada vs Quebec war would certainly settle the question of Quebec's position within Canada. If Quebec wins a war of independence as the Americans did, then they can leave and have their glorious French utopia.

If they lose the war, the question will also be settled and they will be a part of Canada, period end of story.

They want to have a country just by marking an "X" on a ballot? Way to easy, if they want out they'll have to fight their way out. When Quebec chose of it's own free will to join Canada in 1867 they gave up their right to be a separate country. Now if they want it back they'll have to fight for it.

Many will argue that Canada can do this break-up peacefully, and that's a pie in the sky option. We are assuming that just because we are Canadian we'll do it right, and only those third and second world countries have civil wars. This simply can not be guaranteed.

Quebec may very well end up with a terrorist group of English Canadians after a yes vote in a referendum. People opposed to an independent Quebec and loyal to Canada who will see the vote as a call to arms.

I have no problem supporting the rolling in of the tanks to Quebec, arrest the separatist leaders as traitors, put them on trial and then shoot them all. We did it to Louis Riel, we can do it again.

George.

Gee, George,

Great idea, lets have blood in the street and see who wins! What happens when bush and the boyz get involved? Bad enough we got our Armed Forces tied up with Iraq, now you propose a little tit-a-tat in Montreal! I lives 70 Kms southwest of New Orleans and keep hearing the horror stories over the Scanner, commercial radio & TV (filtered) and the Ham Radio Set, now you want to rumble?

Let's keep quebec where it is, a part of Greater Canada and nobody will have to worry about warfare on NORTH AMERICAN SOIL bad enough having katrina visit!

Keep it managable, 2 countries North of the Rio Grand!

No civil wars here since 1865, lets keep up the record.

 

[Martin Le Acadien]

Re: RE: Maritimes Future after Quebec Separation

'There's no nationalism in the USA"...I can't believe you said that.That's like saying you'll still respect me in the morning.

What I think the message he doesn't understand is that "Nationalism" in the USA is just the feeling of "Being an American" which means USA whereas Canada has more of National Sense of Purpose centered around "LAW, ORDER and PUBLIC GOOD"

To say there isn't nationalism in either country is wrong, here it is blind patriotism, in Canada, it is a sense of belonging.

 

[Martin Le Acadien]

Let em leave Canada, fine. Here's an idea...Let them actually leave Canada. :idea:
No blood has to be shed, but Canada doesn't have to sign over their land. The choice would then be left to Quebec...

Gee, does 1755 ring a bell? Let's send'em to Louisiana to join their cousins.

 

[missile]

Martin: All is forgiven! Come on back home,brother

 

[manda]

Wow, rev., I always wanted to live in PEI but forgo leaving the US, you mean I might get to have my cake and eat it too?? :lol:

P.E.I will NEVER become a part of the US...don't even kid about it :evil:

 

[Martin Le Acadien]

Martin: All is forgiven! Come on back home,brother

A serious option for when I retire!

 

[alex31]

RE: Maritimes Future afte

I don't think any of the atlantic proviences would chose to become a state in the US. I do think that it is possiple for them to separate as well and become a country together. loseing Quebec would mean Isolation from Ontario and the rest of Canada. that would be a mojor blow to the atlantic proviences but they could still probbably remain in Canada. My reasons are Britain was able tol maintian an empire over the world so why woouldn't Canada be able to keep control over the atlantic proviences

 

[meitme]

RE: Maritimes Future afte

i belive that it is hard to tell what would happen. also what are the terms of the separation. what they did last quebec referendum was not that they would completly separeate they would think about there separation way in a confrence or something. but i do not think they actualy would have completly separated i think they would have done what canada did with britan slowly completly separate.

but anyway i have no idea how it would effect newofundland or the other atlandtic provinces. i do not know enough about there exporting and imports to know. also how exports and imports would be affected. i think that they are where our decesion would lie.

also i think we would not do it anyway.

 

[missile]

Watching a bit of the show on CBC last night on the last Quebec referendum and the actions of the native groups were mentioned as a major problem for Quebec if they did separate. The Mohawks wouldn't stand for much from Quebec.

 

[Shiva]

Re: RE: Maritimes Future afte

Why can't they remain in Canada? Is Canada will abandon them? Why doesn't unity have to depend on geographical position?

Yes there is a lot of French there, and I know some. Those that I know envy our independance project and would be willing to join us! But my guess is that it's not the majority.

Yes there is a lot to do after a separation. But what an exciting adventure!

The tone of your statement, "Is Canada will abandon them?", is quite rich. It implies that we're leaving them behind in a selfish manner. Aren't you abandoning them and the rest of Canada? in which case where do you get off with a holier than thou attitude?

Take any country- territorial continuity is essential. You can't have a country where citizens cannot move from one section to the next without going through another nation. That's the crux of the issue with Israel & Palestine, and was a contributing factor to the end of East & West Pakistan. There's a word for a nation separated by nations in the middle of it- bantustan.

 

[Shiva]

As a person with Newfie relatives, I'm aware of the fact that Newfoundland already had a vote on whether or not to enter economic union with the United States and they shot it down.

In the referendum leading up to union with Canada in 1949, Newfoundlanders were given the option of economic union with the U.S. or union with Canada. They chose Canada (it would be interesting to see by what margin- I have no idea what the stats are). I believe the U.S. would be just as unpopular a choice now as before, though if they had to leave Canada they might opt for an option like that Puerto Rico has, if offered.

 

[alex31]

RE: Maritimes Future afte

I'm sure nobody in the atlantic proviences would want to become a part of the US if not able to retain ties with Canada Newfoundland in prticular would become its own country

 

[alex31]

RE: Maritimes Future afte

The newfoundland refarrendum results were something like this Becomeing part of Canada 51% staying independant 44% and becomeing part of the US 5% i am not positive but i think that was the results the percentages might be off by a little bit

 

[TenPenny]

Let em leave Canada, fine. Here's an idea...Let them actually leave Canada. :idea:
No blood has to be shed, but Canada doesn't have to sign over their land. The choice would then be left to Quebec...

Gee, does 1755 ring a bell? Let's send'em to Louisiana to join their cousins.

Lets muddy the waters. The Acadiens of 1755 and of today are not the Quebecois, remember. If I recall correctly, les Acadiens not only refused to pledge allegiance to the Queen of England, but refused to pledge allegiance to anyone. It's not like they were swearing allegiance to France - they refused that, too. And even today, les Acadiens consider themselves as entirely separate from les Quebecois.

And then there's the issue that a large chunk of the population of Quebec is of Irish descent, which really messes things up.

And what about Labrador? Did Quebec ever officially accept the boundary line?

 

[missile]

That's true We share a common heritage with the folks in louisiana,and nothing with Quebec[we Acadians,that is]

 

[Roger]

I LIKE ACADIANS! I like the French, I like anybody who doesn't have a problem with me, and if my existance is percieved as "A THREAT" to someone's culture, someone's in some sorry-assed need of TOLERANCE TRAINING, or perhaps even a military occupation.

Forget Canada. Separation would be the most self-destructive thing the Quebecoise could ever do to their "Distinct Society". The place would collapse in no time just in trying to keep up with welfare payments without assistance from Ottawa.

The problem needs to be addressed in Quebec that it is a part of Canada. The English and everyone else lumped into the Allophone and Anglophone categories must be recognized as "A Distinct Society WITHIN A DISTINCT SOCIETY" with the same rights as all Canadians, including THE FRENCH regardless of where they live.

If the rights of all Canadians are guaranteed, why is it permitted in a Western Democracy to treat ANYONE like a 3rd class citizen, in their own country?? Why if my passport says "CANADA" does the Canadian Bill of Rights NOT APPLY in one single Province of the nation? HELLOOOOOO!!!!!

Racist laws permitted by Ottawa to be passed in Quebec (please don't forget that Hitler was democratically elected too, but THAT wasn't right!)have hampered, no a better word is retarded - the economic development of the Province, effecting the entire Confederation. I can't tell you the number of foreigners I've known who blew off temporarily moving to Quebec to work on two to four year tours for corporations, just because of the moronic law which prevents them from putting their kids in an English school.

Don't get me started. Quebec's going no where, and times have changed. The situation as it exists is about the only positive byproduct of Globalization in Canada, as the French and English see a shrinking world, we have more in common with each other than not.

What should the Maritimes do? Start to make noise against racism in EVERY FORM because that's at the core of the problem. New Brunswick went officially bilingual, and Canada's officially bilingual. Europeans think in this world it's the stupidist thing to shutter yourself in like Albania and not learn the language of the world - English. It wasn't by design, it wasn't a conspiracy against the French, it was evolution.

 

[qawii]

Maybe Quebec should leave!

Non ...I have no problem with Quebec. Je parle français tout à fait comme un québecois. AND I MARRIED ONE. I am just a loyal Maritimer.

You see if we get Quebec out of the equation ( almost 8 million voters) then Ontario would no longer control Canada... Central Canada with about 22 million votes does just that right now. Canada may not be a bad place for us Maritimers at that point. And with Newfoundland on board as well ... that'd give us close to ten percent of the total vote ..
32-8=24/2.4+/- = 10% and then if we could get a "triple E Senate" ... Now we are talking!

Sure it is true that 14 million still is a majority over 10 .... but it is a hard sell to the other ten that this represents a "fair shake." Frankly .... if Quebec decides to stay, then I think it is the Maritimes that should consider pulling out ... us and Nfld, that is.

We started going downhill very soon after confederation as the populous central Canada started the process of pulling all the blankets to the middle of the bed. And now they want to play with equalisation ... Mr. MCGuinty .... doesn't like it .. too bad Sir! See how you'll like it with no Eastern seabord and us back into manufacturing and making our own deals with Europe and the rest of the world.

There that's enough said to spark a response or two.
'Bye for now.