Love Of Our Neighbour

[snfu73]

snfu. I think part of the problem is that not everyone goes into absolutely all the threads. So dragging arguments from one thread to another makes little sense to any participants besides yourself. If you feel that sanctus made points in one thread which are hypocritical, then explain those points he made, and explain why you feel they negate this post. Simply saying that he's hypocritical and pisses you off, falls into the category of personal attack, and unfounded in the context of this thread. This forum does require a certain amount of 'fitting in'. Posting standards and standard of behavior are things which people here feel very passionate about.

Your right...not everyone reads all of the threads...which is a good argument why I shouldn't stick this perfectly related argument in with this thread....

Okay...here is the thread in question...hijab

YOU may classify what I am saying as a personal attack...I, with all honestly, do not. I feel that I have reason to state what I am stating. I believe that I am not attacking...but I am expressing my opinion. When I say the guy makes me sick...it's true...that isn't an attack, that is the why I feel. You don't have to agree with me. You don't have to like it. But when I read what I read, and I make the connections I have made, I think that what I am stating is perfectly legitimate...I think I have a solid argument for what I am saying. If you don't like it, oh well...again, it's a public forum. I don't mean that in disrespect...I mean it, again, as...well...the truth. I don't see what I am doing wrong. That is not to say that I am not doing anything wrong. I have chosen to attempt to make some points here. They don't seem to be popular...but that's okay. If I just posted what everyone wanted to hear...what would be the point. Anyway...regardless...I still stand by what I have said. I don't feel that I am out of line. I don't feel that I am attacking...but I definitly am aggressively challenging and questioning.

 

[karrie]

snfu.. I can only find three posts by sanctus in that thread, and none of them seem to contradict what he's had to say in this thread so far.

 

[snfu73]

Well, yes, his input is limited...but, I do disagree...I feel that what he stated in the thread does contradict what he is saying.

 

[karrie]

Well, yes, his input is limited...but, I do disagree...I feel that what he stated in the thread does contradict what he is saying.

How exactly? I can't see what he would have said in that thread that encouraged that the Muslims be shunned, loathed, or hated in any way. Which statement of his was hypocritical to 'loving thy neighbor'?

 

[RomSpaceKnight]

Sanctus does have a habit of posting articles and saying he does not always agree with it and it is there for debate. Sometimes I think he does agree with the articles and other times not. My point is personal insults and getting bet out of shape are not good manners. Been through that here. It's not fun.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

I have a certain amount of empathy for your point of view, snfu73, you're objecting to what you perceive as inconsistencies in sanctus' position. Sanctus is human just like the rest of us though, with all the frailties that implies, and he knows it. In fact, as a priest trying to live up to impossible standards he probably knows it better than most of us do. But I think you've gone a little over the top here. I don't, for instance, think he's ever posted anything that could be stretched into claiming he thinks you must be white to have his approval. If he has, I certainly didn't see it. And the fact remains that this All of our religion is but a false religion and all our virtues are mere illusions and we ourselves are only hypocrites in the sight of God if we have not that universal charity for everyone, for the good and for the bad, for the poor people as well as for the rich, for all those who do us harm as much as for those who do us good is a profoundly true statement. Having that universal charity doesn't mean your religion isn't false and your virtues aren't illusions, and my own life strongly suggests to me that you don't need religion at all to have that virtue, but not having it certainly means that whatever religion you do have is a fraud.

But calling sanctus an idiot and saying he makes you sick doesn't help your argument. Attack what he says, attack his ideas, point out inconsistencies and attack those, sure, disagree with him all you want, but call him out on his claims where he makes them. Calling him names is the ad hominem fallacy , and all it does is damage your credibility.

 

[selfactivated]

St. John Vianney​

All of our religion is but a false religion and all our virtues are mere illusions and we ourselves are only hypocrites in the sight of God if we have not that universal charity for everyone, for the good and for the bad, for the poor people as well as for the rich, for all those who do us harm as much as for those who do us good.​

No, my dear brethren, there is no virtue which will let us know better whether we are the children or God than charity.​

The obligation we have to love our neighbour is so important that Jesus Christ put it into a Commandment which He placed immediately after that by which He commands us to love Him with all our hearts. He tells us that all the law and the prophets are included in this commandment to love our neighbour. Yes, my dear brethren, we must regard this obligation as the most universal, the most necessary and the most essential to religion and to our salvation. In fulfilling this Commandment, we are fulfilling all others. St. Paul tells us that the other Commandments forbid us to commit adultery, robbery, injuries, false testimonies. If we love our neighbour, we shall not do any of these things because the love we have for our neighbour would not allow us to do him any harm.​

I took my friend home and needed gas. I used my debit card but needed a reciept. Im dead tired, fustrated and ovalating! The machine wouldnt give me a reciept. It below freezing and I just pumped a full tank of gas. The attendent inside says I have to wait 15 mins the comp is down. I have to have SOMETHING that says the amount for my checkbook. I was upset and left to go rumage in the car for a pen. I turned around and asked fo a pen and the guy took an attitude with me and OF COURSE I had one back. I stomped out with the pen and went back to the pump and wrote the amount on my hand AND the attendants name! As I walked in he was talking to the customer about me and I was pissed. He said the comp was back up did I want a reciept. I said yes and told him it was plain rude to talk about another customer to another customer I wanted his bosses name too........he WAS the manager! I flew home before I hyperventalated and clicked on this thread. I reread the OP and realised Im in a fustrated mood and its nearly 2am ......In the wide sceame of things what good would it do to call this guys boss? None. He's prolly got a family and fustrations of his own. Thank You Padre you saved somebodies job tonight.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

He's prolly got a family and fustrations of his own. Thank You Padre you saved somebodies job tonight.

That is exactly the charity the OP was talking about. You've got it, and you're not even Christian. In essence, what you did was to forgive him his trespasses against you, as the Lord's Prayer puts it. Could there be a clearer indication that you don't have to be Christian to be good? I'd give you rep points for that but the system won't let me until I spread some around to some others first.

What's up with that, BTW? I can't approve of more than one post a week from the same poster or something?

 

[selfactivated]

Im just a silly Priestess who's hormomal...........we ALL have good even people that piss us off. We just need to choose what mirror we want to look into.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

I don't think you're silly at all. I think you're wrong about a few pretty basic things, as you well know, but silly is not a word that describes you accurately.

 

[selfactivated]

Yeah but you still Love me as I do you not inspite of our differences but BECAUSE of our differences. We'd be clones if it was any other way.

 

[sanctus]

Oh for FRICK SAKES! You are one piece of work Sanctus. After your crap in the FIFA vs Quebec thread, you have the NERVE to post this...and say the crap you are saying. God damn...what an idiot. You make me sick.

Generally I'm in the habit of ignoring your posts in terms of replying, but in this case you need a reply. In essence, and with respect, you're lying. I said nothing in that thread to contradict the message of this one. Below are the total comments I made in that thread. Which of them do you feel contradicts the point of this one?

1)Exactly. What people do in their own homes and in their private lives is their own business, but expecting the entire country to accomodate those practices is a bit much.//////

2)That's not at all what she was suggesting and you know it. Her points were actually succinct. Would you support hindu citizens dumping the ashes of their dead in our rivers?/////////

3)You need to relax, and read the comments she was replying to regarding an issue in Toronto where the Hindu community wants to dump the ashes of their dead into the rivers as is their custom back where they came from.//////////

 

[sanctus]

That is exactly the charity the OP was talking about. You've got it, and you're not even Christian. In essence, what you did was to forgive him his trespasses against you, as the Lord's Prayer puts it. Could there be a clearer indication that you don't have to be Christian to be good? I'd give you rep points for that but the system won't let me until I spread some around to some others first.

What's up with that, BTW? I can't approve of more than one post a week from the same poster or something?

The premise behind the teachings of the faith are universal. That is, if you subtract the religious faith of Jesus as the Christ, or God, the message He brought is still applicable to how we can live a peaceful existence. Despite the claims of some of my fellow Christians who seem to feel you must be Catholic to be good, or Christian, the fact is not once has the Church suggested this. In fact, the Church is quite clear that it recognizes and supports those teachings which are consistent with its own.
Frankly, loving your neighbour just makes good sense as a way to live, and as a beginning to understanding other people.

 

[csanopal]

I took my friend home and needed gas. I used my debit card but needed a reciept. Im dead tired, fustrated and ovalating! The machine wouldnt give me a reciept. It below freezing and I just pumped a full tank of gas. The attendent inside says I have to wait 15 mins the comp is down. I have to have SOMETHING that says the amount for my checkbook. I was upset and left to go rumage in the car for a pen. I turned around and asked fo a pen and the guy took an attitude with me and OF COURSE I had one back. I stomped out with the pen and went back to the pump and wrote the amount on my hand AND the attendants name! As I walked in he was talking to the customer about me and I was pissed. He said the comp was back up did I want a reciept. I said yes and told him it was plain rude to talk about another customer to another customer I wanted his bosses name too........he WAS the manager! I flew home before I hyperventalated and clicked on this thread. I reread the OP and realised Im in a fustrated mood and its nearly 2am ......In the wide sceame of things what good would it do to call this guys boss? None. He's prolly got a family and fustrations of his own. Thank You Padre you saved somebodies job tonight.

Wow, what a great example! I'm floored and you've taught me a good lesson. Isn't it great how we can learn from one another as we work out our path in this world?

 

[csanopal]

it's a public forum. I don't mean that in disrespect...I mean it, again, as...well...the truth. I don't see what I am doing wrong. That is not to say that I am not doing anything wrong. I have chosen to attempt to make some points here. They don't seem to be popular...but that's okay. If I just posted what everyone wanted to hear...what would be the point. Anyway...regardless...I still stand by what I have said. I don't feel that I am out of line. I don't feel that I am attacking...but I definitly am aggressively challenging and questioning.

You're not making a point, you're attacking him personally. What does any of your comments have to do with theOP? In the thread you did mention, he made three posts, all of which basically said he did not think it was a good idea for the Hindu's in Toronto to dump the ashes of their dead into the rivers in Toronto. How is that contrary to this OP?

 

[csanopal]

Slander is saying stuff that isn't true. I believe that it very much is related to the topic. He talks about loving thy neighbour...but what really is his version of loving thy neighbour?? It seems to me that his loving thy neighbour is loving thy neighbour as long as they are white, christian, live like him, act like him, don't demand too much, respect his religion while abandoning theirs...and then I ask, what is his god teaching him?

I mean, I agree... I think loving thy neighbour is VERY important. I can support that. BUT, what DOES it mean to the original poster. What does that REALLY mean. Is it just a line...a good sounding, wonderful, warm line...or is it something that is actually done??? If it isn't....why?

Why does Sanctus, or anyone on this forum for that matter, have to justify his personal beliefs and life to the likes of you or anyone else here? Who or what has set you up as his judge? I think you just have an attitude about the Catholic Church, and you're using him to be the target of your prejudice. I've yet to read any comments from him that even come close to the accusation you are hurling, which is just slander by the way.

I think you're pissed off because he got the rabid Catholics to lay off replying to your posts.

 

[sanctus]

Why does Sanctus, or anyone on this forum for that matter, have to justify his personal beliefs and life to the likes of you or anyone else here? Who or what has set you up as his judge? I think you just have an attitude about the Catholic Church, and you're using him to be the target of your prejudice. I've yet to read any comments from him that even come close to the accusation you are hurling, which is just slander by the way.

I think you're pissed off because he got the rabid Catholics to lay off replying to your posts.

You already made your point. Respectfully, wouldn't it be best just to allow him to rant, and focus instead on the point of St. John Vianney's comments on loving your neighbour?

 

[Libra Girl]

Your right...not everyone reads all of the threads...which is a good argument why I shouldn't stick this perfectly related argument in with this thread....

Okay...here is the thread in question...hijab

YOU may classify what I am saying as a personal attack...I, with all honestly, do not. I feel that I have reason to state what I am stating. I believe that I am not attacking...but I am expressing my opinion. When I say the guy makes me sick...it's true...that isn't an attack, that is the why I feel...

snfu, you know, I'm a real fan of yours, I avidly read your posts in threads... I may not agree with your stance or points always, but, you give food for thought, and are an interesting read. I'd never read the 'hijab' thread, I'm not into soccer, (hides head in shame) but, I read the link you posted, and, I'm sorry, I just don't see where you are coming from this time! Of the three post sanctus made, I thought they were spot on as pertaining to that thread, which was all about safety, not racism, or neighborliness/unneighborliness. What he, and many others said in that thread is true imho, political correctness has gone way over the top in many ways. This is unworthy of you... C'mon man, make the same point elsewhere where it might be relevent maybe, but it isn't here in this thread hon... :wave:

 

[mapleleafgirl]

St. John Vianney​

All of our religion is but a false religion and all our virtues are mere illusions and we ourselves are only hypocrites in the sight of God if we have not that universal charity for everyone, for the good and for the bad, for the poor people as well as for the rich, for all those who do us harm as much as for those who do us good.​

No, my dear brethren, there is no virtue which will let us know better whether we are the children or God than charity.​

The obligation we have to love our neighbour is so important that Jesus Christ put it into a Commandment which He placed immediately after that by which He commands us to love Him with all our hearts. He tells us that all the law and the prophets are included in this commandment to love our neighbour. Yes, my dear brethren, we must regard this obligation as the most universal, the most necessary and the most essential to religion and to our salvation. In fulfilling this Commandment, we are fulfilling all others. St. Paul tells us that the other Commandments forbid us to commit adultery, robbery, injuries, false testimonies. If we love our neighbour, we shall not do any of these things because the love we have for our neighbour would not allow us to do him any harm.​

gees, i havent been on cc in days and days and days, so into the new forum. anyway. this is really, really wise. everything we believe is false if we dont practice it. otherwise it is just words we use. this has really, really made me think long and hard on my faith. thank you fr. c. for posting this!

 

[mapleleafgirl]

You already made your point. Respectfully, wouldn't it be best just to allow him to rant, and focus instead on the point of St. John Vianney's comments on loving your neighbour?

yup. like you said a week or so ago, best to move over these kinds of posts and instead pray for the maliciousness of the poster to be cleansed. by the by, who is this saint? do you have any info about him father?