Layton & NDP against our Troops in Afghanistan

BitWhys

what green dots?
Apr 5, 2006
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Re: RE: Layton & NDP against

Colpy said:
I certainly didn't intend to twist your words.

According to the National, the NDP policy is to remove Canadian troops from AFGHANISTAN.

If you don't stop the Taliban returning to power, how do you intend to keep Afghanistan from becoming a training ground for mass murder yet again?

Quit dodging.

now you're changing the topic. I didn't say "the UN will prevent their return to power if military assets are removed."

I haven't seen the exact wording of the resolution yet but the NDP press release says that "that Canadian troops must be withdrawn from their fighting mission in Afghanistan" (not a quote from the resolution). If fighting in the South is all we're doing over there now, as it seems the resolution as quoted implies, that's just another sign of how downhill this whole process has taken us.

but now that you mention it, again...

I'm not dodging. You're just not listening. We help prevent the Taliban from restablishing training camps by not tolerating their existence. Like I told Toros, read my posts.

You, like the conservative pundits that you rely on to feed you your lines, make it sound like Canada is the only thing standing between the current anarchy being sold as stability that exists now and a total overthrow of the legitimate government. That's simply not the case. Afghanistan is NOT going to fall overnight just because we pull our troops out in a safe manner. We have until February to ensure we don't leave our NATO allies that are active in the current operation in a dangerous situation.

There's a vast difference between holding a line and moving a line. If, as is likely, our withdrawal slows the military operation down to something more akin to maintaining security where possible (as is our mandate) and less like the current ground clearing operation that serves Chevron's needs, so much the better.
 

Zzarchov

House Member
Aug 28, 2006
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Im curious why people think you can't win this militarily? What are you basing that thought on? Insurgencies just like this one, are beaten by being militarily occupied for long enough. "Never end" has never been the case though "A generation" is usually a bare minimum.

North Ireland had these same arguments going for it, the Brits just sat through it and you know what? No matter how much this new age of media everyone wants everything solved in a 30 second soundbyte, it doesn't change the reality. Just because it doesn't happen during the fall primetime season doesn't mean it isn't going to happen and its impossible.
 

mabudon

Metal King
Mar 15, 2006
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RE: Layton & NDP against

so is it just a talking point that "no insurgency has EVER been put dow in modren times"??? I was under the impression that this was the case, especially if one is trying to do such a thing with any semblance of humanity..
 

Colpy

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 5, 2005
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We help prevent the Taliban from restablishing training camps by not tolerating their existence.

How do we "not tolerate their existence" except by smashing them militarily? Please explain. This is the crux of the matter.

Afghanistan is NOT going to fall overnight just because we pull our troops out in a safe manner.

Not overnight, no. BUT, as a student of history, I know that losing the initiative against an enemy is ALWAYS a mistake. Give the Taliban the territory to use for training and regrouping unmolested, and they will exert control, they will gain strength, and they will attack into the north......then, I guess, we run from there as well.

I just listened to Layton on CTV's Question Period. The man has no plan, no concept of the Taliban and who they are. Sometimes you can't talk, you have to shoot.

Please, give me a sensible alternative......that is all I ask.
 

BitWhys

what green dots?
Apr 5, 2006
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Re: RE: Layton & NDP against our Troops in Afghanistan

Colpy said:
Please, give me a sensible alternative......that is all I ask.

an alternative to no real plan at all?

you're asking for more than you realize.
 

Lineman

No sparks please
Feb 27, 2006
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RE: Layton & NDP against

Another U.N.resolution!
Man those are really effective! Just look at the success they had in Rwanda, the early Balkans crisis before Nato stepped up, East Timor, Haiti, Afghanistan before the U.S. and their Allies (of which we were a part) decided to go in, Iraq, Iran today, North Korea today and on and on and on... None of these resolutions were effective until the decision to use force was made. Now I grant you that there may be some resolutions that were effective but I just can't think of one that applies to any area that may pose a threat.

If anyone is under the impression that the only thing our troops are doing there is fighting you're dead wrong. Approximately half are part of the battlegroup while the others range from the Provincial reconstruction team, to supporting the Nato Command structure, Training the Afghan National army and a large medical contingent. The PRT is working to help rebuild government and infrastructure in areas already pacified. For whatever reason either our government or the media have not made it a priority to publish this fact or show the projects. The reason our PRTs are doing work traditionally done by Non Governmental Organizations is the NGO's won't go there, they had people there at the beginning but when the Taliban started killing them they pulled out. In other words, Peace must be imposed first.


Mr. Layton is an embarassement to his party. Jack has turned his back on fighting for basic human rights, wherever they may be, to sucking up for votes regardless of the truth. I used to view the NDP as never having a chance at government but at least they were principled and never ignored the truth and common sense whilst arguing. Mr. Layton has turned into just another vote sucking liar. Tommy's likely rolling in his grave...

As an aside, just exactly how are "army" troops in Afghanistan, who Jack says we should pull out and bring home to patrol our shores, supposed to do that? Maybe he has shares in a dingy manufacturer?
 

BitWhys

what green dots?
Apr 5, 2006
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If the information is so complete where's the part about the Taliban being disarmed by the end of next year?