Kyoto Protocol

[peapod]

Re: Kyoto

What I have made my mind up about is I want a first step. And yes I also hug trees. mmmmm I better be careful about saying that..look what happened to bob spongehead....I mean do ya think some people might accuse me of trying to hump a tree.

 

[mrmom2]

RE: Kyoto

Exrafire I have been riding snowmobiles in this province for 18 years and I have seen nothing but snow levels go down and temperatures go up .We have got pine beetles eating all the trees because it dosn't get cold enough to kill them anymore.Something is going on and its not global cooling !Scientist can be bought and payed to sell any story the globalists want us to hear .Wake up the evidence is right out your front door if you look

 

[mrmom2]

Re: Kyoto

Who knows Pea you sure seem to like trees an awful lot! :lol:

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Kyoto

The science is very solid,

The drafting of such reports and statements involves many opportunities for comment, criticism, and revision, and it is not likely that they would diverge greatly from the opinions of the societies' members. Nevertheless, they might downplay legitimate dissenting opinions. That hypothesis was tested by analyzing 928 abstracts, published in refereed scientific journals between 1993 and 2003, and listed in the ISI database with the keywords "climate change" (9).

The 928 papers were divided into six categories: explicit endorsement of the consensus position, evaluation of impacts, mitigation proposals, methods, paleoclimate analysis, and rejection of the consensus position. Of all the papers, 75% fell into the first three categories, either explicitly or implicitly accepting the consensus view; 25% dealt with methods or paleoclimate, taking no position on current anthropogenic climate change. Remarkably, none of the papers disagreed with the consensus position.

linky

 

[Extrafire]

RE: Kyoto

Leaving aside the fact that Kyoto addresses a non-existant problem, it is a first step that goes no-where. Do you really think that China, India and all those other countries will be so dumb as to sign on to Kyoto 2? They've just begun to learn how wealth is created.

I used to kill trees for a living.

 

[mrmom2]

RE: Kyoto

What are you a pine beetle?

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Kyoto

Oops...thought I'd put this one up before. Read 'em and weep, mighty tree killer.

Shaviv and Veizer (2003) published a paper in the journal GSA Today, where the authors claimed to establish a correlation between cosmic ray flux (CRF) and temperature evolution over hundreds of millions of years, concluding that climate sensitivity to carbon dioxide was much smaller than currently accepted. The paper was accompanied by a press release entitled “Global Warming not a Man-made Phenomenon", in which Shaviv was quoted as stating,“The operative significance of our research is that a significant reduction of the release of greenhouse gases will not significantly lower the global temperature, since only about a third of the warming over the past century should be attributed to man”. However, in the paper the authors actually stated that "our conclusion about the dominance of the CRF over climate variability is valid only on multimillion-year time scales". Unsurprisingly, there was a public relations offensive using the seriously flawed conclusions expressed in the press release to once again try to cast doubt on the scientific consensus that humans are influencing climate. These claims were subsequently disputed in an article in Eos (Rahmstorf et al, 2004) by an international team of scientists and geologists (including some of us here at RealClimate), who suggested that Shaviv and Veizer's analyses were based on unreliable and poorly replicated estimates, selective adjustments of the data (shifting the data, in one case by 40 million years) and drew untenable conclusions, particularly with regard to the influence of anthropogenic greenhouse gas concentrations on recent warming (see for example the exchange between the two sets of authors). However, by the time this came out the misleading conclusions had already been publicized widely.

 

[Extrafire]

Re: RE: Kyoto

Exrafire I have been riding snowmobiles in this province for 18 years and I have seen nothing but snow levels go down and temperatures go up .We have got pine beetles eating all the trees because it dosn't get cold enough to kill them anymore.Something is going on and its not global cooling !Scientist can be bought and payed to sell any story the globalists want us to hear .Wake up the evidence is right out your front door if you look

I worked in the forest industry for 30 years. I've seen both snow levels and temperatures go up and down. The pine beetle epidemic is natures way of recycling. It's happening because a combination of factors all came together, the main one being that the pine stands are generally relatively old and vulnerable.

Is the climate warming? Quite possibly, but it's very difficult to tell. Is it caused by human emissions? The science doesn't support it.

I used to believe all the evironmental doomsayers, but when I realized they were lying about the forest industry I thought they might also be lying about other environmental issues, so I started looking for facts. One fact I found was none of their predictions ever came true.

 

[mrmom2]

RE: Kyoto

Your in the forest I'm in the alpine snow levels in the forest are way lower always Were seeing snow levels drop 15 to 2o feet seeing huge boulders the size of buses that we never saw before Something sure screwing with the enviroment .Maybe its HARP I don't no but we want our snow back :wink:

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Kyoto

The science does support it though, overwhelmingly. Here is yet another page debunking the anti-environmentalist luddites and their junk science.

 

[Extrafire]

RE: Kyoto

Yup, things change, but not necessarily because of us. Way up here I like it warmer, thanks. I wouldn't mind another Global Climate Optimum when temps were much higher than now.

 

[mrmom2]

RE: Kyoto

The one thing that bugs me about global warming is it sure is a good way for the elite to take more money out of our pockets Joe smuck normally dosen't pay attention to whats going on and just forks out. :?

 

[peapod]

Re: Kyoto

Bah! I've seen your logging practices...you got nothing to be proud of. Yes of course the hell with the planet, kill trees and be proud of it, such a accomplishment. Just more of the self centred, me, me, me and my wallet. As long as you are happy and satisfied the hell with the planet. Although you are to be pittied more than anything else.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Kyoto

Actually, being environmentally friendly will save you money, Mr Mom. The reason they (and we all know who they are, thanks to the many links I put up) don't like Kyoto and have spent so much fighting against it is that if you are saving money, then it isn't going into their bank accounts.

 

[Extrafire]

Re: RE: Kyoto

The science does support it though, overwhelmingly. Here is yet another page debunking the anti-environmentalist luddites and their junk science.

Here is their reply to criticisms of their work:

http://www.climateaudit.org/index.php?p=22

 

[Extrafire]

RE: Kyoto

Nothing wrong with my loggin practices and yes, I am proud of them, as well as the new forests I see growing where I had logged. Kill trees? Why not? I kill carrots and cabbage.

I don't like Kyoto because it's nonsense, Rev, just like all the other enviro scares. Mrmom saving money has no effect on me, I'm broke.

 

[mrmom2]

RE: Kyoto

Me too its the Canadian way unless your one of the elite or a politician or one of there friends :wink:

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Kyoto

You didn't read enough...not only was their work trashed, but the claims they were making about it destroying global warming theory and Kyoto turned out to be lies.

Kyoto was signed before the "hockey stick" even existed.

It just goes to show the general dishonesty of the global warming deniers. Of course if Exxon was funding me....nah, I'm too honest for that.

 

[Extrafire]

Re: RE: Kyoto

You didn't read enough...not only was their work trashed, but the claims they were making about it destroying global warming theory and Kyoto turned out to be lies.

Kyoto was signed before the "hockey stick" even existed.

It just goes to show the general dishonesty of the global warming deniers. Of course if Exxon was funding me....nah, I'm too honest for that.

Yes I know Kyoto was signed before the hockey stick. And Rio was before that. So what? They were debunking the hockey stick. Do you know one of the main problems with it? They used tree ring data up to the last century and then grafted heat island temperature records from the last century onto it for the effect they wanted. That alone is completely scientifically unsound.

You didn't read at all.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Kyoto

They failed to debunk the hockey stick, tried to sneak around the peer review process, claimed that the hockey stick was the only piece of science supporting both global warming theory and Kyoto, and got debunked.

Real scientists, as opposed to McIntyre who works in the mining industry and McKittrick, who is an economist, took their work apart like a cheap watch. As far as scientific soundness goes, it's right up there with Intelligent Design and similar voodoo bunkum.

Anyway, think I'll go to bed. All this spreading of truth, honesty and good science has made me sleepy.