kids being allowed to sue smoking parents

[Ariadne]

Children sueing their parents? If I was a parent who smoked and my child decides to sue me for it. I would threaten to kick them out of the house. After giving them clothes, a home, food, and other things. Not to mention their LIFE. Then they decide to sue me because I'm a 'threat', well wheres the love?

Crazy doctors are only promoting children to be even more spoilt than they already are.

It's kind of funny when you think about it. The child sues the parents, child wins the lawsuit, parents hand over their paycheque to the child to pay off the debt, the child takes the family income and buys ice cream and video games, the family can no longer pay bills, the wage earners are put out on the street, they lose their jobs and voila ... the perfect solution. Some doctors really do say stupid things.

 

[miniboss]

Wow what a response. I just get p*ssed off every now and then, about what I see in the paper, or see and hear on TV, and I have to vent. Thanks for indulging me.

 

[Kreskin]

That's a serious downloading of responsibility. Anything else he wants kids to do? Write speeding tickets? Inspect the exhaust systems and fine violating adult drivers? Force parents to take breathalizer tests?

 

[Zzarchov]

If we lived on a planet that didn't have millions..maybe a billion I don't know for sure..cars puking poison into the air the PTB wouldn't need to have a concern over the costs of health care. The smoking causing increased costs to our healthcare system is a lie...or at least if not a lie the means and methods of curtailing suspended particulate matter and toxins in the atmosphere have existed for a long time and its the attitude that we'll allow or permit anything for a dollar ...including collecting the taxes on a pack of smokes that's behind most if not all our problems...

This "collective" you speak of....

Is that the collective that's routinely ignored by our governments....routinely lied to by our governments and who are all actively poisoned by our government who think supporting big business like tobbacco and petroleum is the way to cure our problems...

I didn't ask for the crap that's passed for government in this nation and long before the costs of healthcare for the individual is made the cudgel for beating up on smokers, how about this collective stand up against a corrupt and disingenuous government that steals and wastes far more than the cost of healthcare given to the collective...

"The government that wastes" its wasting our money, and its our money to waste.

I hate to break it to you guys, but a smoker will cost more to health care in his life than he will put back in, even with his 70% from each pack.

Cars and all kinds of other things also spew pollutants into the air, and if the public will was that they too needed to be squeezed out, then we have that right as a people. For the moment we decide the money thing bring in, is more than the money they drag out. Not so with smoking.

I understand your hooked on smokes and it bothers you to think that MAYBE, man wasn't meant to inhale smoke, and that MAYBE smoke inhalation is bad. Its up there with drinking alcohol which is a poison (literally, being drunk is just being mildly poisoned).

And I don't care if you smoke or drink, until you start saying I need to pay for it.

Even if the government was sparkling clean and 100% efficient (which isn't the point) there is no denying that you smoking, costs me money.

I think you should get one warning from your doctor, if you smoke too much (ie, more than cigars on special occassions or a smoke with your beer at the bar once a week), If you drink too much or are Overweight then you have to clean up your act or lose OHIP coverage.

 

[eh1eh]

Smokers and drinkers actually save the government money. Not only do they pay much more in taxation of their evil products, they don't cost in long term care needs later by dieing earlier on average than all the good healthy people.

http://www.bupa.co.uk/health_information/html/health_news/240604smoke.html

http://www.forces.org/evidence/carol/carol8.htm

http://www.infoplease.com/askeds/smoking-life-expectancy.html

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=9703

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/320/7226/53

Now for the boozers

http://www.cdc.gov/MMWR/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5337a2.htm

http://lib.bioinfo.pl/meid:111648

http://alcoholism.about.com/od/health/Health_Effects_of_Alcohol.htm

 

[tamarin]

It is a no-brainer. Smokers are God's gift to the health care system and the government treasury. The people the government should be most concerned about are those who live into old age, collect their pensions far beyond what they actually contributed to the system, use the government's drug plan at 65 plus, develop a debilitating disease (more and more it's Alzheimers) and spend their long, last days in chronic care. How the big lie got perpetuated that smokers cost society dearly is boggling. It's the big lie. And an outrageous one.

 

[Tonington]

Solution, ditch tobacco products, make em illegal, replace them with pot. Not addictive, but habit forming, relieves stress, and lasts a lot longer than the effects of one cigarette. Something like 3 cigarettes worth of tar and junk in one doobie.

Heh, never gonna happen but it's nice to daydream.

 

[Zzarchov]

Actually, the problem is they do die earlier.

Living a long life doesn't cost Ohip, you cost more in your final 2 months than you do the rest of your life on average.

Smokers and Heavy Drinkers are young enough that they often live, making this final 2 month period repeat if they are lucky (and we are not) and in best case scenario drain as much as anyone else while paying far less taxes into it (they die quicker)

 

[marygaspe]

Solution, ditch tobacco products, make em illegal, replace them with pot. Not addictive, but habit forming, relieves stress, and lasts a lot longer than the effects of one cigarette. Something like 3 cigarettes worth of tar and junk in one doobie.

Heh, never gonna happen but it's nice to daydream.

Thosw who claim weed is not addictive are fooling themselves and not keeping up with current data released by Addiction Research. Weed is psychologically addictive, if nothing else.

 

[Tonington]

That would be habit forming, as addictive as biting your nails. I have an addiction, pot certainly isn't it.

 

[marygaspe]

That would be habit forming, as addictive as biting your nails. I have an addiction, pot certainly isn't it.

Semantics. Addictive is anything you cannot stop doing. I've known pot heads and they go insane when they are out of their drug or cannot find it anywhere.

 

[marygaspe]

We listened to the new-wave of child psychologists and childcare professionals and educationists and ended up with a society conditioned to pander to children. A child has more rights in this society than an adult and while the protection of children should be a primary concern, the message of how fragile their poor little egos are and how sensitive to discipline the modern child has become is simply a load of crap. Good doctors collecting enormous salaries for rising to the challenge of protecting children...California Edubabble that advises that you can't tell Johnny or Jane that they failed a test...that would devastate their self-esteem....

In the community I live in the problem of University and College students littering loud parties swarming, violence and rowdiness at "keg-parties", street racing the list is lengthy... When I suggested to the local authorities that there's a simple solution I was ridiculed and pushed aside.

If a university student or a college student is involved in something that demands police intervention that student (or students) lose their opportunity to attend the higher-educational facility they've been enrolled in and paid to attend...

Children whether they're university students or not, in these moder times of excess and limited control need to understand that you're behavior is not only unacceptable but is costing the people who live in this community. Losing a year and the tuition might seem harsh, but so is trying to get through life basing your notion of civic responsibility on a lie.

good post! Very accurate too. Children nowadays are amazingly spoiled. I'm glad I'm done with child-raising frankly, for I'd hate to do it nowadays. It was hard enough in the 70's and 80's....and we thought it was narcisstic than! Now..my god, it must be near impossible to instill values in kids.

 

[Zzarchov]

Funny, I always figured..you know, looking at statistics, it is infact the middle aged generation with the worst record, especially with post secondary behaviour.

All this "Kids these days" talk is really forgetting how much better they are now then when the older generation was their age. Rose Coloured glasses and all that.

From Youth Violence to Gang Warfare..its all down from the older generation, yet the older generation seems intent to brutally punish them for the ways they themselves only recently gave up.

 

[marygaspe]

Funny, I always figured..you know, looking at statistics, it is infact the middle aged generation with the worst record, especially with post secondary behaviour.

All this "Kids these days" talk is really forgetting how much better they are now then when the older generation was their age. Rose Coloured glasses and all that.

From Youth Violence to Gang Warfare..its all down from the older generation, yet the older generation seems intent to brutally punish them for the ways they themselves only recently gave up.

I disagree. As bad as were in the 60's, or my kids later in the 70's or the 80's, we never had the sort of moral influences we have now...or the high levels of promiscuity and violence.Hun, in my day, when you broke the law and were caught, you actually could possibly get punished, not slapped on the wrist.

 

[hermanntrude]

yes, it's true. the further back you go the more accepted bullying and violent behaviour was. competition and racism was encouraged. things are better now, i think, when what people hate most about kids is the way they dress and the fact that they skateboard on war monuments

 

[Tonington]

Semantics. Addictive is anything you cannot stop doing. I've known pot heads and they go insane when they are out of their drug or cannot find it anywhere.

I'm going to get semantic here again, addiction is not anything you cannot stop doing, metabolic activity eating, breathing drinking are not addictions. An addiction is when the dopamine in your head is telling your brain to reward yourself. Marijuana does have an active chemical which acts much like other addictive compounds, only the studies have shown conflicting conclusions. The conclusion is that although marijuana does have addictive properties, the response to the active compound is not as homogenous among users as it is in other drugs like nicotine or the opiates. Comparing marijuana to nicotine we can see that the two drugs are not even close in the addiction response. I'm not advocating for people to be potheads, hell I hardly smoke it at all anymore, but I do think it deserves deregulation. It's a stigma pot has had for a long time.

 

[hermanntrude]

Originally Posted by marygaspe
Semantics. Addictive is anything you cannot stop doing. I've known pot heads and they go insane when they are out of their drug or cannot find it anywhere.

I was a pothead. i didnt go insane when i couldnt find any more. i noticed i could get on with my work better though. I was definately never addicted to pot. I just liked it a lot

 

[MikeyDB]

Depends how you measure it and how its reported Zzarchov.

For instance, it was common only thirty years ago for the only intervention commonly available to parents with parenting problems and children with childhood problems was after a youngster had been identified in the education system by that system as presenting problems. Frequently the justice system became involved as truancy issues compelled both parents and school boards to use that avenue of approach to addressing behavior. A complete assessment was usually required to be performed by a qualified psychologist, therapist or psychiatrist. That's what I did for many many years.

While statistically fewer numbers of children are processed so-to-speak through the various systems, the real failure is in our healthcare/social support frameworks, not the education or judicial systems themselves per se.

Perceptions among the broder populace are shaped by media, and often that shaping is performed in such a way as to lead to a "reasonable" conclusion and not in fact an awareness of the how or why of any particular dynamic. Culturally North Americans have been failing their children for the past sixty years. Some of the responsibility for that certainly lies with the social dynamics, distribution of wealth among societies and the intentional cafting of perception to address political agendas. There's many topics that can be discussed under the broader umbrella of societies responses to social perceptions but I'm afraid you and I are just going to have to settle for disagreeing when it comes to the relationship between the "costs" to these systems attributable to smokers and the escalating costs readily apparent with only a cursory overview...

 

[MikeyDB]

Herm the pothead...I shooda known....

 

[marygaspe]

Originally Posted by marygaspe
Semantics. Addictive is anything you cannot stop doing. I've known pot heads and they go insane when they are out of their drug or cannot find it anywhere.

I was a pothead. i didnt go insane when i couldnt find any more. i noticed i could get on with my work better though. I was definately never addicted to pot. I just liked it a lot

That's you, not the norm though. Addiction Research foundation of Ontario states that weed is addictive and harmful.