Just give me that old-time atheism

[Said1]

Re: RE: Just give me that old

All reminds me of a bumper sticker ... "Jesus loves you ... but everyone else thinks you're an asshole"

Hahaha. I started singing "Jesus is Just Alright" after I read this thread. 8)

 

[Cosmo]

RE: Just give me that old

Said1 ... so nice to see you back around here. You've been MIA for a while, no?

 

[Said1]

Re: RE: Just give me that old

Said1 ... so nice to see you back around here. You've been MIA for a while, no?

Thanks! I was still lurking, but mainly too tired from a combination of heat, kids and puppy to post much. I also changed internet providers, took a day or two to get the new modem.

 

[bulldog]

Re: RE: Just give me that old

I am an American. We were founded on Christianity. If you read the Bible instead of making blind statements about it then you will know that we are here to love our neighbors as ourselves. That is why we have not only given billions to other countries but also died for their freedoms. We love you no matter what you think or say about us. God Bless America so that we can continue to bless others.

I am sorry that so many here have been so unpleasant to you.
I am the usual target. I just wanted to say welcome - I will listen to you.

Bull Dog

 

[Dexter Sinister]

It's plain in the first amendment to the U.S. constitution.

And read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state#United_States_of_America

Pay particular attention to this in that document:

"The clause of the First Amendment that adopted the founders' principles of separation of church and state and freedom of religion is known as the Establishment Clause. It states, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...."

And this:
"The modern view adopted by the Supreme Court in the latter half of the nineteenth century is that no government -- federal, state or local -- can perform any action or make any policy which blatantly favors one faith or church over the others, or which favors belief in a God or Supreme being over non-belief."

There are some dissenters, but that's the essence of it. Anybody who thinks America was founded on Christianity is ignorant of both the nation's history and its constitution

 

[Said1]

It's plain in the first amendment to the U.S. constitution.

And read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state#United_States_of_America

Pay particular attention to this in that document:

"The clause of the First Amendment that adopted the founders' principles of separation of church and state and freedom of religion is known as the Establishment Clause. It states, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...."

And this:
"The modern view adopted by the Supreme Court in the latter half of the nineteenth century is that no government -- federal, state or local -- can perform any action or make any policy which blatantly favors one faith or church over the others, or which favors belief in a God or Supreme being over non-belief."

There are some dissenters, but that's the essence of it. Anybody who thinks America was founded on Christianity is ignorant of both the nation's history and its constitution

I may be wrong, but weren't the founding "fathers" deists?

 

[manda]

Re: RE: Just give me that old

I am sorry that so many here have been so unpleasant to you.
I am the usual target. I just wanted to say welcome - I will listen to you.

Bull Dog

Now now, bulldog, we aren't attacking "media", so much as stating our opinions on his/her beliefs. I for one think that they are narrow-minded and wished to voice as much..perhaps I came across too harshly, but I am strongly rooted in what I have faith in. if you state something that you believe and criticize others, expect to get it throw back at you, refuted. Much like the phrase, "If you can't take the heat, get the pheck outta my kitchen!" :lol: :twisted:

On a side note, most countries were founded byour Royalty and our Lord, that doesn't mean that we can't question unswerving loyalty to either, or suggest that others corrupt the meaning behind what they stand for..look at history, it's always happened, corruption and questioning both! 8O

likewise, media, if you beleive all the propaganda that is being spoonfed to you by bush about his generosity, without noticing his backstabbing for personal gain, you have blinders on, and need to inform yourself about what is happening in all sides of the table, not just those willing to hold the spoon for you..knowledge is power. I'm all for love thy neighbor, but I can't tolerate those who are so high on themselves that they won't accept humility, another neccessary quality according to the bible, if you want to use that book for your arguments, you had best remember all that it says

 

[peapod]

Save your so called "pity" bulldog for the innocent civilians in Iraq. Oh I forgot they don't count coz the guy in the sky is not jesus for them he goes by mohamad.

 

[Cosmo]

Re: RE: Just give me that old

Thanks! I was still lurking, but mainly too tired from a combination of heat, kids and puppy to post much. I also changed internet providers, took a day or two to get the new modem.

PUPPY?? Do tell! Even better ... post a pic of the fur kid under the pic thread for us! (I'm a dog person, btw )

 

[Said1]

Re: RE: Just give me that old

Thanks! I was still lurking, but mainly too tired from a combination of heat, kids and puppy to post much. I also changed internet providers, took a day or two to get the new modem.

PUPPY?? Do tell! Even better ... post a pic of the fur kid under the pic thread for us! (I'm a dog person, btw )

I think I did, but I'll do it again for those who missed him. :lol:

 

[Cosmo]

Re: RE: Just give me that old

I am sorry that so many here have been so unpleasant to you.
I am the usual target. I just wanted to say welcome - I will listen to you.

Bull Dog

Unpleasant? How so, Bulldog? Because I don't believe the superstitious drivel spouted by traditional christians? That is, of course, my opinion. I didn't arrive at my current belief system by pulling it out of thin air, but by investing a great deal of time and effort into studying various religions and trying to understand what is behind them.

Media is behaving in a superior, condescending manner, as if (s)he is above the rest of us by holding the expressed beliefs. To me that is far more unpleasant than a straight on disagreement.

Also, I don't recall ever "targetting" you. I may not agree with you a lot of the time, but I don't think I've persecuted you. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[peapod]

Bulldog just does not like being called on "all" her/his/ whatever personalities. :lol: lol

Yes, we have seen the "superior" ones handy work...In fact I was on kuper island yesterday. Its a beauitful place, not that long ago the "superior" one committed hanis crimes againist native childern, kuper island, one of the worst. Yes I am sure they can relate to Jesus loves you. :twisted:

 

[media]

8O Thanks Bull Dog--- Very Nice

I would like to point out to Dexter that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion" does not say separation. (As I said earlier go to www.wallbuilders.com) Churches in the US are tax exempt for the sole purpose of keeping the government from telling them what to do. Not to take away their free right of speech. Unfortunatley, that has been attacked also. The definition of religion isA collection of beliefs) It is not therefore possible to have any government anywhere that does not practice religion. (Atheism is also a religion because it is a collection of beliefs) They all have a collection of beliefs. The wallbuilders website is so awesome because they have documented proof about America's historical culture. But yes, even some American's have tried to ruin that.
I would also like to say that I am a big fan of the former Canadian Gordon Sinclair. Great man.
Again Bulldog, thank you. If you read my original message, I was simply stating that America does love it's neighbors, and I personally beleive our Christian heritage is the reason for this. Boy did that open a pandora's box!
God Bless America. No matter what they say about us, we still love them.

 

[media]

You have my sincere apology if I have come across as condesending. I feel that most people are turned off by Christianity because they feel they are being judged. I know I used to feel that way. That is why I made such a big deal about the dif between relationship and religion. I am only stubborn about my stance because of how God changed my life when I allowed him to. That does not mean that I am trying to be judgmental. Please forgive me if I came across that way.

 

[peapod]

Thats good coz..your beliefs should be like your underwear...there...but not seen....after all it is a personal thing, not need to serve it up like a "big mac" especially when you say jesus loves you...that is insulting to me. So if you keep your "advertising" to yourself, I will keep my snide remarks to myself...even tho I might draw blood when I bite on my lips..the hyporcites I mean.

 

[Cosmo]

You have my sincere apology if I have come across as condesending. I feel that most people are turned off by Christianity because they feel they are being judged. I know I used to feel that way. That is why I made such a big deal about the dif between relationship and religion. I am only stubborn about my stance because of how God changed my life when I allowed him to. That does not mean that I am trying to be judgmental. Please forgive me if I came across that way.

No big deal, Media. I just calls em as I sees em. Often enthusiastic christians give off this aura of moral superiority that is, quite frankly, a tad irksome to me.

In all sincerity, I'm glad you have a faith that works for you. I am a huge believer in faith ... can't imagine getting though life without it. I just believe it's a personal issue, an internal thing, if you like. I generally only discuss the details of my beliefs with people I know well. It's kinda like my underwear ... people assume you're wearing them but expect you to keep them private.

 

[Cosmo]

8O I posted that then read your post.

Cue scarey music ... is this divine intervention at work?? 8O 8O

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Thats good coz..your beliefs should be like your underwear...there...but not seen....after all it is a personal thing, not need to serve it up like a "big mac" especially when you say jesus loves you...that is insulting to me. So if you keep your "advertising" to yourself, I will keep my snide remarks to myself...even tho I might draw blood when I bite on my lips..the hyporcites I mean.

absolutely spot on. Like your analogy about personal beliefs being PERSONAL and not something one wears on his sleeve......as if it makes him/her better than any other human being. People who have the "need" to advertize their beliefs are very insecure within themselves and many " need" the herd mentality that "religion" offers .


(for me...... no labels at all. - as the idea of being branded into some category is offensive/demeaning and takes away from the individuals uniqueness. ) (IMHO)

 

[TenPenny]

If we are all "God's Children", then what makes Jesus so special?

 

[Cosmo]

(for me...... no labels at all. - as the idea of being branded into some category is offensive/demeaning and takes away from the individuals uniqueness. ) (IMHO)

Ahhh ... the old "labels" issue. I love this one. I have spent hours debating this topic and have switched from "pro" to "con" and back again innumerable times. It's a real hot-button topic in the lesbian community.

My current opinion is that I like labels. An analogy ... go to your cupboard, peel the label off every tin can in there. Wait a week, then try to cook something. Without some outward indicator, confusion ensues. I think it's the same for people. Labels give us a starting point to further familiarity with those we are drawn to.

I love some of my personal labels. I am a woman, a graphic designer, a spiritual person, a risk taker, a lesbian. I like all those things and any one of them offers people an in-road to getting to know me better. I spent most of my life in emotional isolation and enjoy my newfound ability to share myself with others.

Just something to think about, Breeze.