It's time to bring the death penalty back!

[VanIsle]

I am sure death penalty is not the only factor for high murder rates, talloola. There probably are other factors. But I think death penalty is a contributing factor.

If you look at BarSinister's post you should see without much reading that the states with the dealth penalty have a higher rate of murder but it is marginally higher. It seems that in reality, with it or without it, murder rates stay much the same country wide.
It seems to me that people who commit murder either don't care if they get caught or actually believe they never will be caught. Adding or taking away the death penalty would not make a difference. Most people don't actually fear death. It's the manner in which they die they fear. Since the death penalty now is a simple shot like we all choose for our ailing pets, and since many murderers are ailing in someway or another, they may welcome the peaceful easy needle they would receive. Not death by cop (suicide) but death by law (suicide).

 

[L Gilbert]

Perhaps it is useful to look at murder rates in the US and compare it to states that have the death penalty. Here are a couple of sources.
Murder Rates 1996 - 2008 | Death Penalty Information Center

Deterrence: States Without the Death Penalty Have Had Consistently Lower Murder Rates | Death Penalty Information Center

It seems to me looking at these numbers that the death penalty makes no difference at all on the murder rate. .........

That's what it looks like to me, as well. It would seem a few posters are speaking from ignorance. The death penalty is not causal to murder anyway. That's a completely ludicrous idea. There are various reasons people commit murder and the death penalty is definitely not one of them.

 

[JLM]

If you look at BarSinister's post you should see without much reading that the states with the dealth penalty have a higher rate of murder but it is marginally higher. It seems that in reality, with it or without it, murder rates stay much the same country wide.
It seems to me that people who commit murder either don't care if they get caught or actually believe they never will be caught. Adding or taking away the death penalty would not make a difference. Most people don't actually fear death. It's the manner in which they die they fear. Since the death penalty now is a simple shot like we all choose for our ailing pets, and since many murderers are ailing in someway or another, they may welcome the peaceful easy needle they would receive. Not death by cop (suicide) but death by law (suicide).

It's time to forget the silly comparisons and do a true comparison (and even that is not going to be 100%) For several years prior to 1976 there was no death penalty in the U.S. It started up again with Garry Gilmour in Utah getting a bullet in the head for being less than a noble citizen. So if you want a close comparison, take the crime rate for each state prior to '76 and each state since '76 and while you are at it do the same comparisons for law enforcement costs. You are not going to get the picture 100% because statistics won't give you but you should get a "ballpark" indication.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

In Canada, could we not just have a "Pillary of Shame"?

The internet gives us ample opportunity.

I am pretty sure that is 'pillory', and not pillary'.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

How many states to you think are predominantly Christian right?
I think New England will go Republican this year, or atleast Democratic conservative.

The Bible Belt.

And New England will go Republican, big deal. In a mid term election the party out fo power always does very well. Why should this year be an exception?

 

[SirJosephPorter]

From all I've read about the U.S. I think New England has pretty well always been the most "conservative" part of the U.S. Pretty prim and proper.

And just where did you read that, JLM? New England is just about the most liberal part of USA. New England does include Massachusetts, one of the most liberal states in USA.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

A depraved life is a cost to taxpayers and with our joke of a justice system there is an extreme risk of reoffending. Honest taxpayers have a right to be safe going about their business and risking a repeat offender is an infringement on that right. Criminals should have no or very few right.

Agreed. But the society can be kept safe by locking up the criminal for life, it has worked so far.

 

[JLM]

And just where did you read that, JLM? New England is just about the most liberal part of USA. New England does include Massachusetts, one of the most liberal states in USA.[/quote

I think you are wrong, Mass. is just one state, N.E. is comprised of six. I think Mass. was more pro Kennedy than pro Democrat.

 

[JLM]

Agreed. But the society can be kept safe by locking up the criminal for life, it has worked so far.

Except when they escaped, were paroled or inadvertantly released.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

And just where did you read that, JLM? New England is just about the most liberal part of USA. New England does include Massachusetts, one of the most liberal states in USA.[/quote

I think you are wrong, Mass. is just one state, N.E. is comprised of six. I think Mass. was more pro Kennedy than pro Democrat.

The other states also are very liberal, JLM. All the New England states have civil union for gays. Vermont, Connecticut, New Hampshire and Massachusetts also have legalized gay marriage.

And Massachusetts pro Kenndy and not pro democrat? Where did you get that? Until recently both the senators were democrats, a big majority of House members are democrats, in the state legislature, Democrats have a comfortable majority, the Governor is Democrat.

Even the Republicans from Massachusetts tend to be moderates, and not conservative (the new Republican Senator voted with Democrats on the jobs bill, he is also pro choice rather than pro life).

Massachusetts is a heavily Democratic, liberal state, don't go by the recent Senate election. Indeed, it is as heavily Democratic as Texas is Republican.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Except when they escaped, were paroled or inadvertantly released.

And how many times has that happened? Probably fewer times than convicting and executing the wrong person for the murder in a death penalty situation.

 

[Risus]

Agreed. But the society can be kept safe by locking up the criminal for life, it has worked so far.

I agree with that but life is never life....

 

[Risus]

And how many times has that happened? Probably fewer times than convicting and executing the wrong person for the murder in a death penalty situation.

With new DNA testing the chances of executing the wrong person is greatly reduced.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

With new DNA testing the chances of executing the wrong person is greatly reduced.

We have discussed this before. DNA evidence is not infallible; it is not the magic bullet. DNA evidence can be planted, there can be mix ups while testing, there still are many uncertainties.

While DNA evidence makes us surer of the guilt of a criminal, it is not a magic bullet, it cannot prove guilt beyond all doubt (nothing can do that, really).

 

[JLM]

With new DNA testing the chances of executing the wrong person is greatly reduced.

Hey Risus, I've been pounding on that for years but I don't think it's "taken" so far.

 

[talloola]

Does a murdurer ever think, 'at the time he is deciding'
to kill, if there is a death penalty or not.

Wouldn't a probable murdurer, leave a person alive, to
save his own life, or complete the killing, knowing he
will never be put to death, or is that a far fetched idea, maybe
they are so raged, or completing a premeditated murder,
that those thoughts never enter his/her mind.
Is gang killing always listed as premeditated, unless a
stray bullet hits an innocent person, a bystander, is it
still first degree in that case.

Are repeat offenders part of the 'death penalty' list,
because of repetition or?

And, is the death penalty only used for premeditated crimes, and not crimes of passion etc, or first degree
manslaughter, if there is such a thing, and the killing
of police officers.

Of all the people who kill other people, what is the
percentage who are put to death.

 

[Francis2004]

Texas Death Penalty Ruled Unconstitutional


Yes it's true.. On Fox News none the less. I am sure this will go to appeal but it is making headlines.

Texas Judge Says Death Penalty Unconstitutional - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com

 

[Francis2004]

What amazes me most about the debate on the Death Penalty is that those is favour usually side on the being against Euthanasia for the terminally ill..

So let me understand..

Mercy for the basturds that did a crime and not let them sit and rot in jail, hence give them a quick out..

But penance for those who may have sat in Church, were great humans, lived a clean life and could possibly donate an organ and make then suffer as long and terrible as possible although there is no chance to save them.

Yup sounds right to me..

 

[Risus]

Texas Death Penalty Ruled Unconstitutional


Yes it's true.. On Fox News none the less. I am sure this will go to appeal but it is making headlines.

Texas Judge Says Death Penalty Unconstitutional - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com

He's just a renegade judge trying to make a name for himself.

 

[JLM]

"What amazes me most about the debate on the Death Penalty is that those is favour usually side on the being against Euthanasia for the terminally ill.."

To me it seems like pretty consistant thinking- shorten life for the bastards that don't deserve to live, while extending it for those who do. Where the fallacy lies I guess is that some of the ones they are trying to extend are too far gone to begin with. That is probably a case of emotion taking over from reason.