Iran or Syria next for Staged Terror excuse?

Dexter Sinister

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Oct 1, 2004
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But back to the main theme.

EagleSmack and Nascar_James:

Both you lads need to do a little reading and thinking to provide some historical context and a somewhat more sophisticated understanding of geopolitical reality than you've so far displayed. I suggest the following:

Barbara W. Tuchman's The March of Folly, A Distant Mirror, and The Guns of August.

John Keegan's A History of Warfare, The First World War, and The Second World War.

Gwynne Dyer's War, Ignorant Armies, and Future: Tense

In particular, you have no hope of properly understanding what's happening in the world today, and especially the messes the United States has involved itself in over the last two decades or so, without a good grasp of the origins and consequences of World War One, the nature of imperialism and colonialism, and their legacy in the contemporary Middle East. Until you've got that, your opinions will be vacuous, ignorant, and ill-informed, and not taken seriously by people who do know what they're writing and talking about.
 

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: Iran or Syria next for Staged Terror excuse?

EagleSmack said:
Oh I am not saying that the ancestors of what are now known as Canadian citizens did not take part as militiamen. However the bulk of the fighting was done by British Regulars. During that time armies always augmented their regular army with militias or mercenaries.


sounds a lot like you are trapped in an era where guns , war and killing were actually admired............or REALLY nec. Yes.....there was a time.......but that time has past. Seems brains of mankind should be taking over .....

but the US still LOVES guns, wars and killing.......so progress/evolution is very slow......"down there".
 

Nascar_James

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Reverend Blair said:
You do know that Damascus is the operational headquarters for Hamas, right?

You know that Hamas is considered a legitimate political organisation by many, especially in the Middle East, right?

Rev you are kidding ...right? I've got some flash news for you ... Hamas has been declared a terrorist organization by the U.S. State Department, as well as the European Union, Canada, and Australia.


Reverend Blair said:
Why in blue blazes does the Syrian government not get rid of this organization?

Why doesn't George Bush have Pat Robertson arrested?

Pat Robertson is not a terrorist.


Reverend Blair said:
Also, a UN report accused Syrian Intelligence in the assasination of Rafik Hariri, Lebanon's former Prime Minister. How could you condone such actions?

Can you show me where I've condoned such actions? Of course you can't.

Silence speaks volumes.....


Reverend Blair said:
I still believe we went to Iraq after Afghanistan as a result of attack on our soil on 9/11, Dexter.

How could you possibly believe that? Even the nut-bags in the Bush administration have quit telling that particular lie.

It's a fact Rev. Deny it if you want, but going into Iraq was one of the objectives on the war on terror after we were struck on 9/11.


Reverend Blair said:
We were simply going after those who attacked us first.

Iraq never attacked you. Why didn't you invade Saudi Arabia instead? Their people attacked you.

Saudi Arabia is a strong ally. The Saudis have forces that do indeed go after the terrorists ... unlike Syria. Look at the situation that occured in Ryad several months back. The Saudi forces arrested and killed many of the terrorists involved. Why can't Syria do the same and dismantle the Hamas headquarters in Damascus. I know why, cause Syria supports terrorism, that's why. It is an outrage! However, mark my words ... there are strategic targets in Damasus that are just waiting to be taken off the map.


Reverend Blair said:
Even the Democrats were talking about Al Qaeda presence in Iraq some 3 years ago.

That's because Bush was diddling the intelligence. They were lied to.

The fact of the matter remains that the Democratcs (including Kerry by the way) had told us to go to Iraq and take care of business. Now that we did, they change their tunes. Funny thou how they were rejoicing and took credit once we liberated Bagdad and after Saddam was arrested.


Reverend Blair said:
Here's a quote from as far left as you can get ...

Hillary Clinton is far, far frm being a leftist. Do you know anything about politics at all?

Are you kidding Rev? Seeing that the Democrats are the left wing party here, I'd like to see you name any Democrat politician who's any further left than Hillary.


Reverend Blair said:
Persistence has paid off. We haven't had any further attacks on our soil since we seriously started going after the terrorists.

Traditionally the pattern has been that the attacks are few and far between.

Or in our case since we've dealt the Al Qaeda network a huge blow, they simply do not have the resources to engage in another attack. They will not suceed. Our intelligence has greatly improved.


Reverend Blair said:
So any anyone could see, we were justified in going to Iraq.

No you weren't. You became international criminals once again when invaded Iraq. you also showed beyond a doubt that your president and his administration was a nest of rotten liars.

What international criminals? Innocent casualties of war are not illegal under the Geneva Convention. They have occured at every past war and will undoubtedly keep occuring in future wars. Deliberately killing your own people as Saddam did is illegal and he will pay for it.


Reverend Blair said:
We got rid of a dictator who deliberately killed his own people.

Not to many years ago you defended and protected him when he killed his own people. Are you now admitting that Ronald Reagan was a war criminal?

No so Rev. Back when Iraq was fighting Iran, we were simply sideliners not involved in the conflict.


Reverend Blair said:
This dictator was indeed involved with terrorism ... he was certainly paying off the families of Palistinian suicide bombers tens of thousands of dollars.

That's never been proven either, but even if he was not one of those bombers attacked the United States.

State sponsored terrorism of any kind is unacceptable Rev. We need to enforce a zero tolerance global policy on terrorism. Simply the fact that he rewarded the familes of Palestinian suicide bombers justified going after him. We were rightly justified in enforcing our zero tolerance policy on terrorism.


Reverend Blair said:
Let us hope he gets the death penalty so Iraqis can get justice.

Let's hope he discloses American complicity in his crimes against humanity.

How and for what? He has absolutely no credibility. He will hang for his crimes.


Reverend Blair said:
I have to aske the question, James. If you believe so much in this war, then why don't you go sign up to fight it? You like guns and seem to fancy yourself some sort of John Wayne. If the military won't take you, there are security companies who will. You aren't one of those chickenhawks, are you?

Although I am a little too advanced in age to be joining the armed forces now, I'm sure they would give me a shot considering that I do have firearms training. If I had to do it all over again, yes I would sign up. If I were called upon by my government to fight for my country, yes I would go. I'm no traitor! They should institute severe prison time for draft dodgers or those enlisted who skip.
 

Ocean Breeze

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They should institute severe prison time for draft dodgers or those enlisted who skip.


hrmm..."Heil Hitler".......oops , Hail Bush.


( actually Hail to the chief --oops-Thief must be a take off from Heil Hitler. Hmm........


sheesh. But if that is what you redneck neocons want.-fine ....just KEEP IT IN YOUR COUNTRY.......and leave the rest of the world alone.... Not that complex to comprehend , is it??
 

Nascar_James

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Ocean Breeze said:
They should institute severe prison time for draft dodgers or those enlisted who skip.


hrmm..."Heil Hitler".......oops , Hail Bush.


( actually Hail to the chief --oops-Thief must be a take off from Heil Hitler. Hmm........


sheesh. But if that is what you redneck neocons want.-fine ....just KEEP IT IN YOUR COUNTRY.......and leave the rest of the world alone.... Not that complex to comprehend , is it??

Well Ocean if any of our enlisted go awol and escape to Canada to try and avoid prosecution by a military court, it becomes our business if Canada in any way harbors these individuals.
 

Reverend Blair

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Apr 3, 2004
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Rev you are kidding ...right? I've got some flash news for you ... Hamas has been declared a terrorist organization by the U.S. State Department, as well as the European Union, Canada, and Australia.

So? It's still considered a legitimate political institution by many in Middle East. Why would Syria ban what they consider to be a legitimate political institution?

Pat Robertson is not a terrorist.

He called for the illegal assassination of a foreign leader. According to your government, anybody who calls for the assassination of your leader is a terrorist. Why would the leader of Venezuela be any different?

Silence speaks volumes.....

Silence does speak volumes. Either show me where I've condoned such actions or shut your fecking yap.

It's a fact Rev. Deny it if you want, but going into Iraq was one of the objectives on the war on terror after we were struck on 9/11.

There were no ties between Iraq and 9-11. There were no ties between Iraq and al Qaeda. There were no ties between Hussein and bin Laden. Quit trying to perpetuate lies.

Saudi Arabia is a strong ally. The Saudis have forces that do indeed go after the terrorists ... unlike Syria.

How many of the hijackers were Saudis?

The fact of the matter remains that the Democratcs (including Kerry by the way) had told us to go to Iraq and take care of business. Now that we did, they change their tunes. Funny thou how they were rejoicing and took credit once we liberated Bagdad and after Saddam was arrested.

That was before they knew you'd been lying to them.

Are you kidding Rev? Seeing that the Democrats are the left wing party here, I'd like to see you name any Democrat politician who's any further left than Hillary.

You've once again revealed your complete lack of political knowledge.

Or in our case since we've dealt the Al Qaeda network a huge blow, they simply do not have the resources to engage in another attack. They will not suceed. Our intelligence has greatly improved.

Considering some of the claims you make, I sincerely doubt you have much intelligence.

What international criminals? Innocent casualties of war are not illegal under the Geneva Convention. They have occured at every past war and will undoubtedly keep occuring in future wars. Deliberately killing your own people as Saddam did is illegal and he will pay for it.

The invasion itself was illegal. Not guarding the as illegal. Torture is illegal. Targeting journalists is a crime. Group punishment is a crime. Using depleted uranium is crime. Using napalm is a crime. Failing to stop looting is a crime. Your leaders are war criminals, Nero.

No so Rev. Back when Iraq was fighting Iran, we were simply sideliners not involved in the conflict.

You were arming both sides. You sold arms to Iran against your own laws. Ronald Reagan was a domestic criminal.

The Reagan administration knew that the Kurds had been gassed. They claimed it was Iran who did it and kept sanctions from being placed on Iraq. Now you claim, as the rest of the world always has, that it was Iraq. Lying to cover up crimes against humanity is a crime. Are you now admitting that Reagan was a war criminal?



State sponsored terrorism of any kind is unacceptable Rev.

So you agree that Henry Kissinger should be arrested and stand trial at the Hague for crimes committed in Chile, Vietnam, and Cambodia? You must also agree that George Bush Sr. should stand trial for crimes committed in Guatamala and El Salvador, as well Iraq? George Bush Jr. and his cabinet should stand trial for crimes committed in Iraq, Venezuela and Colombia. If state sponsored terrorism is a crime, then it's a crime no matter who commits it.

How and for what? He has absolutely no credibility. He will hang for his crimes.

See the part on the gassing of the Kurds.

Although I am a little too advanced in age to be joining the armed forces now, I'm sure they would give me a shot considering that I do have firearms training. If I had to do it all over again, yes I would sign up.

There's nothing stopping you. Your military is short of cannon fodder. March on down to that recruiting office. Otherwise you are nothing but a chickenhawk willing to send others to their deaths but too afraid to go yourself.



If I were called upon by my government to fight for my country, yes I would go.

Sounds too me like you're afraid. You know they won't draft you. Go sign up.
 

Reverend Blair

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Well Ocean if any of our enlisted go awol and escape to Canada to try and avoid prosecution by a military court, it becomes our business if Canada in any way harbors these individuals.

No actually, it doesn't. Since the war in Iraq is illegal, then following orders to go to Iraq is also illegal. It is illegal to follow an illegal order. Canada has signed an international to harbour any soldier who may face persecution for refusing to follow an illegal order.

If your soldiers choose to seek safe haven in Canada, it is none of the USA's business.
 

Ocean Breeze

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Nascar_James said:
Ocean Breeze said:
They should institute severe prison time for draft dodgers or those enlisted who skip.


hrmm..."Heil Hitler".......oops , Hail Bush.


( actually Hail to the chief --oops-Thief must be a take off from Heil Hitler. Hmm........


sheesh. But if that is what you redneck neocons want.-fine ....just KEEP IT IN YOUR COUNTRY.......and leave the rest of the world alone.... Not that complex to comprehend , is it??

Well Ocean if any of our enlisted go awol and escape to Canada to try and avoid prosecution by a military court, it becomes our business if Canada in any way harbors these individuals.


would like to see ya apply the same stringent rules (of the law) for your HDD leader. Might get somewhere then. He lied in order to cause mass murder. THAT is a whole lot more serious than a troop going AWOL because he/she cannot fight in an illegal /unethical /immoral war. You have a very strange set of priorities.
 

Colpy

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<Snip - Personal attack - Cut it out, Colpy>Karlin

911, Pearl Harbour STAGED! Spare me.

The Tonkin Gulf thing was hardly staged. Johnson used a minor shooting incident (which may have been friendlies accidentally firing on friendlies) to get his way in Congress. One could sensibly argue that this was NOT kosher.

But 911, Pearl Harbour, STAGED!

Absolutely nutty.
 

nitzomoe

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Ocean Breeze said:
They should institute severe prison time for draft dodgers or those enlisted who skip.


hrmm..."Heil Hitler".......oops , Hail Bush.


( actually Hail to the chief --oops-Thief must be a take off from Heil Hitler. Hmm........


sheesh. But if that is what you redneck neocons want.-fine ....just KEEP IT IN YOUR COUNTRY.......and leave the rest of the world alone.... Not that complex to comprehend , is it??

I am wondering whats wrong with that stance? it seems justified to give harsh penalties for AWOL soldiers as they volunteered for service knowing full well the dangers that they may face. Isnt that different from vietnam were there was conscription?
 

Ocean Breeze

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nitzomoe said:
Ocean Breeze said:
They should institute severe prison time for draft dodgers or those enlisted who skip.


hrmm..."Heil Hitler".......oops , Hail Bush.


( actually Hail to the chief --oops-Thief must be a take off from Heil Hitler. Hmm........


sheesh. But if that is what you redneck neocons want.-fine ....just KEEP IT IN YOUR COUNTRY.......and leave the rest of the world alone.... Not that complex to comprehend , is it??

I am wondering whats wrong with that stance? it seems justified to give harsh penalties for AWOL soldiers as they volunteered for service knowing full well the dangers that they may face. Isnt that different from vietnam were there was conscription?


facing the dangers included in a career is one thing......but in the case of Iraq for eg........ one is facing dangers based on a series of lies.......so it is unethical, immoral and illegal........In this case finding an out from the military is commendable. Elective (voluntary) wars come under a different scrutiny ....one would think. ( but then I am not a warmonger , nor do I endorse anyone's BS lies)
 

Jo Canadian

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PEI...for now