I would rather live my life as if there is a God

[Hard-Luck Henry]

Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God

Everyone has a religion.

Even those those that are against religions are religious about it.

I'm nominating the above for "Dumbest Premise of the Year".

I wouldn't be so hasty, Summer; there's an awful lot of competition for that prize. :lol:

 

[iamcanadian]

In a recent book Max Jammer, Rector Emeritus of Bar Lan University in Jerusalem, a former colleague of Albert Einstein at Princeton, claims that Einstein's understanding of physics and his understanding of religion were profoundly bound together, for it seemed to Einstein that nature exhibited traces of God quite like "a natural theology." Indeed it is with the help of natural science that the thoughts of God may be tapped and grasped. 1 On the subject of Einstein and God Friedrich Dürrenmatt once said, "Einstein used to speak of God so often that I almost looked upon him as a disguised theologian." 2 I do not believe these references to God can be dismissed simply as a façon de parler, for God had a deep, if rather elusive, significance for Einstein which was not unimportant for his life and scientific activity. It indicated a deep-seated way of life and thought: "God" was not a theological mode of thought but rather the expression of a "lived faith" (eines gelebten Glaubens).

 

[iamcanadian]

Einstein gave this illuminating account of himself in a public speech in Berlin:

Although I am a typical loner in daily life, my consciousness of belonging to the invisible community of those who strive for truth, beauty, and justice has preserved me from feeling isolated. The most beautiful and deepest experience a man can have is the sense of the mysterious. It is the underlying principle of religion as well as all serious endeavour in art and science. He who never had this experience seems to me, if not dead, then at least blind. To sense that behind anything that can be experienced there is something that our mind cannot grasp and whose beauty and sublimity reaches us only indirectly and as a feeble reflection, this is religiousness. In this sense I am religious. To me it suffices to wonder at these secrets and to attempt humbly to grasp with my mind a mere image of the lofty structure of all that is there.

 

[Summer]

RE: I would rather live m

So Einstein held a form of "natural religion". So what? That says nothing about the millions of non-religious people walking around in the world who do NOT have "religious" feelings about things.

 

[Hard-Luck Henry]

RE: I would rather live m

"If fifty million people say a foolish thing, it's still a foolish thing."
-- Bertrand Russell

 

[Jay]

Re: RE: I would rather live m

So Einstein held a form of "natural religion". So what? That says nothing about the millions of non-religious people walking around in the world who do NOT have "religious" feelings about things.

I think your making a big deal out of a mere generality he was making.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Re: RE: I would rather live m

"If fifty million people say a foolish thing, it's still a foolish thing."
-- Bertrand Russell

AMEN!!.........( with the proper somber "attitude". :wink:

.......ain't all that long ago that the humanoid ."believed" the earth was flat............( and apparently some still do. :wink:

can't underestimate the power of "resistance to change" :wink:

 

[Summer]

Re: RE: I would rather live m

So Einstein held a form of "natural religion". So what? That says nothing about the millions of non-religious people walking around in the world who do NOT have "religious" feelings about things.

I think your making a big deal out of a mere generality he was making.

Who, Einstein or IAC?

My point is that inaccurate generalizations don't prove IAC's argument.

 

[bhoour]

Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God

Everyone has a religion.

Even those those that are against religions are religious about it.

I'm not against it, to each his own , I just don't get it .


:bs:

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God

Everyone has a religion.

Even those those that are against religions are religious about it.

I'm not against it, to each his own , I just don't get it .


:bs:

I think he is using the term metaphorically there. :?: :idea: :?:

to replace an obsession. Both amount to the same thing... :wink:

 

[iamcanadian]

I'm no Einstein, but I kind of like the view he had of religion.

Here the full link: http://www.ctinquiry.org/publications/reflections_volume_1/torrance.htm

 

[bhoour]

I still don't get it........

 

[iamcanadian]

Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God

I still don't get it........

I guess that is why some people should accept things on faith.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God

I still don't get it........

I guess that is why some people should accept things on faith.

nope...........that is exactly why they should NOT.

 

[the caracal kid]

anything that tells you "this is the way" but you have to take it on faith should be avoided completely.

 

[Finder]

Hey I have no problem in believing there might be a higher being. But to believe in the Bible, the Korean the Tora, or the Wiccan rede um, it's kind of hard to do since these were all writen by man and all have there problems. I'd rather believe there in a higher power, be a good person and live my life like that. If a god hates me for not listening to one of the "holy texts" I think he has a problems because theres too many "holy texts" to follow and if you chose the wrong one won't you just piss him off anyways! So yeah thats my $3.50

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Hey I have no problem in believing there might be a higher being. But to believe in the Bible, the Korean the Tora, or the Wiccan rede um, it's kind of hard to do since these were all writen by man and all have there problems. I'd rather believe there in a higher power, be a good person and live my life like that. If a god hates me for not listening to one of the "holy texts" I think he has a problems because theres too many "holy texts" to follow and if you chose the wrong one won't you just piss him off anyways! So yeah thats my $3.50

like your thinking. :wink: For the life of YT .....I have a hard time comprehending a "vengeful" , hateful, hatefilled , angry "god"........that is hell bent for leather to torment some poor souls "forever and ever". But mankind has found this to be a very useful tool.........to gather a flock....and keep that flock under control. Back to the fear /control equation. There are as many interpretations of these "religious" passages are there are people who read them. One is yet to hear that two people agreed on the exact interpretation.........but fear is what keeps them coming back for more.

Will take my chances as an independant thinker and NOT a believer ......and IF there is a God entity of some sort ........(supposedly to be defined upon our earthly demise) nice.....will be great to meet him/her/it. If not........then I did not waste a lot of good living time buying into some dogma out of fear.

Will NOT Live my life under some preconditioned fears based on what are primarily myths, and fables. Life is too short as it is .......and there is too much to explore and do. We got one shot at it......so why not make the most of it and see what THIS world is all about. There are true wonders around us, natural and man made that boggle the mind with their complexity.......and these are the adventures that I personally embark on ...

Freedom of belief is one of the freedoms we have.......and that means .......what ever the belief might be. The rule of thumb is that as long as it does not hurt oneself or someone else in the process......it is just fine. The boundaries (and there HAVE to be boundaries in any society)........are simple and easy to adhere to. This includes o not foist one's "beliefs" on anyone else. .......and here we have religious types breaking that one each time they knock on ones door trying to spread their "gospel" or convert. You don't see scientists going door to door preaching their latest theories about .........whatever......trying to convert ......

just a few more random thoughts on this one.;-)

 

[bhoour]

Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God

I still don't get it........

I guess that is why some people should accept things on faith.

Humans have religion because they are afraid of, and cannot control the unknown ( i.e. our origin, death,instinct,nature, space...etc). For some the thought that life on earth evolved (even from another planet,... 8O , 'magine), is unbelievable. The thought that after life, there is nothing , or we come back, is unbarable. Religion is/has the explanation for some. Some people are controled by a set of rules decided by others ( in one case it was a burning bush that decided...no?.... :roll: ), thousands of years ago, in a very different time. These rules say to do this and don't do that,- but if you do/don't ,just ask forgiveness , say a few prayers and be absolved of all " sin". Or on the other extreme, exiled, and even condemed to death, because you have "sinned" against a faith or a "higherpower"..........I don't get it.
nobody is held accountable....oh the" higherpower" is....because it forgave/comdemed.......and everyone gets on with the worshiping part. What ever thats all about. All the standing and sitting and kneeling and fasting, and suffering. I don't get it .
Killing yourself and others in the name of "god" ....... Why would any faith that is so good and filled with love, and understanding, convince you to die to show your faith in "higherpower"? To have to go to that extreme for acceptance, amongst the believers. You would think that a"higherpower" would guide these lost souls and help them understand that killing is a "sin". Or is it justified by some of the "higherpowers"? It all so conflicting, I just don't get it......?
I have three kids, none of them have been baptised into, or practise any religion. A few people,( of different faiths) ,over the 20 yrs, have told me, my children if they were to die, would not go heaven because of this fact.
I asked....How do they know this? Had they actually witnessed children being turned away from this place called heaven?and where exactly is it located? I asked.... if I were to baptise my children, which is the correct religion to baptisie them into? Which one is the best? Also why would any "higherpower" ever condem a child, ......never mind for a decision, it was not old enough to make. That hardly seems, kind and loving and accepting ........oh and forgiving . I don't get it.

I don't get how people believe all of this on faith. To me it seems very limiting. You can't be your trueself with so many restrictions in place. I cannot live my life this way.

What I do get is the nature of things, that things are, I don't need to know why. I know I don't need others to tell me what I should believe , in order to be a whole person. I figured it out myself.
What ever works for you go with it, but try and remember there is more than one angle to see things from.

 

[Vanni Fucci]

I'd rather believe there in a higher power, be a good person and live my life like that.

What part of that statement necessitates the belief in a higher power?

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God

I still don't get it........

I guess that is why some people should accept things on faith.

Humans have religion because they are afraid of, and cannot control the unknown ( i.e. our origin, death,instinct,nature, space...etc). For some the thought that life on earth evolved (even from another planet,... 8O , 'magine), is unbelievable. The thought that after life, there is nothing , or we come back, is unbarable. Religion is/has the explanation for some. Some people are controled by a set of rules decided by others ( in one case it was a burning bush that decided...no?.... :roll: ), thousands of years ago, in a very different time. These rules say to do this and don't do that,- but if you do/don't ,just ask forgiveness , say a few prayers and be absolved of all " sin". Or on the other extreme, exiled, and even condemed to death, because you have "sinned" against a faith or a "higherpower"..........I don't get it.
nobody is held accountable....oh the" higherpower" is....because it forgave/comdemed.......and everyone gets on with the worshiping part. What ever thats all about. All the standing and sitting and kneeling and fasting, and suffering. I don't get it .
Killing yourself and others in the name of "god" ....... Why would any faith that is so good and filled with love, and understanding, convince you to die to show your faith in "higherpower"? To have to go to that extreme for acceptance, amongst the believers. You would think that a"higherpower" would guide these lost souls and help them understand that killing is a "sin". Or is it justified by some of the "higherpowers"? It all so conflicting, I just don't get it......?
I have three kids, none of them have been baptised into, or practise any religion. A few people,( of different faiths) ,over the 20 yrs, have told me, my children if they were to die, would not go heaven because of this fact.
I asked....How do they know this? Had they actually witnessed children being turned away from this place called heaven?and where exactly is it located? I asked.... if I were to baptise my children, which is the correct religion to baptisie them into? Which one is the best? Also why would any "higherpower" ever condem a child, ......never mind for a decision, it was not old enough to make. That hardly seems, kind and loving and accepting ........oh and forgiving . I don't get it.

I don't get how people believe all of this on faith. To me it seems very limiting. You can't be your trueself with so many restrictions in place. I cannot live my life this way.

What I do get is the nature of things, that things are, I don't need to know why. I know I don't need others to tell me what I should believe , in order to be a whole person. I figured it out myself.
What ever works for you go with it, but try and remember there is more than one angle to see things from.

excellent points.

I suspect that "religion" and the existance of "god" (with all that this entails) is what provides the perimeters for many people. They seem to need some script to follow about what is "right" and what is "wrong....destructive". Which is ok.......as long as they are aware of this. Many almost need the "fear" to prevent them from doing something they might be inclined to do on impulsive desire or whatever motivation. If this provides them with the "standards" to live by........can't see an issue with it....as long as they don't try to impose their beliefs on others.


IMHO:........we as a people need to comprehend human nature a lot more than we do. We need to study the abstracts that make humans what they are .......and here is where psychology comes in. The better we understand ourselves ......the more secure we are within ourselves and the less dependant we are on outside forces .......abstract or otherwise.....(even people).

excessive "neediness" is neurotic and part of dependancy in such personalities.

It makes NO LOGICAL Sense to live one's life out of fear of something and in the hopes of some eternal 'contentment " and peace as a "reward". But it makes all kinds of sense to live each moment for the treasure it is.... despite the obstacles and challenges (wouldn't life be a bore without them???) as these go into the maturational process and character construct.

Far too many people seek "religion" because they have a void in their life. an inner void. They try to fill it with entertainment......and it does not work, They try to fill it with drugs.......andsoon more problems result of that one.( drugs are the great escape from the inner void/pain) They have lost a sense of drive, purpose that can only be found through challenging and productive work effort........or study effort.