I would rather live my life as if there is a God
- Thread starter iamcanadian
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Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God
Yet a thief needs to attain a high level of competence or they get pinched...so by your logic a competent thief is one of the good guys?
iamcanadian said:
Yet a thief needs to attain a high level of competence or they get pinched...so by your logic a competent thief is one of the good guys?
People with competence in their activities can rely on their competence.
People that are incompetent in their activities can't and must apply bad ethics in order to advance inspite of their inneptness.
This explains much about the lack of ethics in public services to make up for their lack of competence.
The crap rises to the top this way.
Lack of ethics reteriorates into lack of personal morals. People advance from stabbing others in the back, and continue to degrade till they do harm just for the fun or it and to show they can. This my friends is the state of our higher civil servants in this country. No amount of politicling is ever going to fix this.
We need ethics and morals brought back into society before its too late.
People that are incompetent in their activities can't and must apply bad ethics in order to advance inspite of their inneptness.
This explains much about the lack of ethics in public services to make up for their lack of competence.
The crap rises to the top this way.
Lack of ethics reteriorates into lack of personal morals. People advance from stabbing others in the back, and continue to degrade till they do harm just for the fun or it and to show they can. This my friends is the state of our higher civil servants in this country. No amount of politicling is ever going to fix this.
We need ethics and morals brought back into society before its too late.
and whose ethics and morals are you trying to promote here? your posts sound like an underhanded method to promote your own agenda by claiming there is something that needs fixing and only your way will achieve it. Yet, as a few of us have pointed out, your logic is fatally flawed.
RE: I would rather live m
Does it then deep-fry them or does it merely bake them at about 350F for a half-hour? Do they turn out crispy enough by the oven method? What sort of wine goes best with them, and what kind of side dishes?
iamcanadian said:
Does it then deep-fry them or does it merely bake them at about 350F for a half-hour? Do they turn out crispy enough by the oven method? What sort of wine goes best with them, and what kind of side dishes?
Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God
Actually no ones. I would be content with our civil services being overhauled so that people advance based on competence and the incompetence gets taken out of the system instead of being allowed to advance with bad ethics.
Competent people don't need bad ethics to get ahead in life.
the caracal kid said:
Actually no ones. I would be content with our civil services being overhauled so that people advance based on competence and the incompetence gets taken out of the system instead of being allowed to advance with bad ethics.
Competent people don't need bad ethics to get ahead in life.
i think you are also overlooking the very important issue of social factors.
people get ahead because of their "soft skills" as much and sometimes moreso than their "hard skills". This has nothing to do with incompetence at their job but with their competence in interacting with people. Again, people that get ahead have competencies. It is just you seem to only like certian competencies and are labelling all other ones as "evil".
as has been said by many people, it does not matter how brilliant or insightful you are if you can not communicate effectively with others. The soft skills play an important role in the functioning of an organization. This is why companies put so much effort into determining if one's personality "fits" with the corporate structure.
people get ahead because of their "soft skills" as much and sometimes moreso than their "hard skills". This has nothing to do with incompetence at their job but with their competence in interacting with people. Again, people that get ahead have competencies. It is just you seem to only like certian competencies and are labelling all other ones as "evil".
as has been said by many people, it does not matter how brilliant or insightful you are if you can not communicate effectively with others. The soft skills play an important role in the functioning of an organization. This is why companies put so much effort into determining if one's personality "fits" with the corporate structure.
There are a lot of people with nothing more than soft skills (and perfectly incompetent in every other way) that would be great for selling used cars, but are instead running multi-billion dollar government departments as they personally please and screwing everyone in the process.
that is a large claim. while i am sure there is inefficiency in government (as there is inefficiency in all human organizations, given that humans are not robots), do you have any real statistics on what the levels of error or inefficiency are in the civil service?
I have heard the hardest part of the civil service is getting in and that once you are "in", moving around is quite easy. Do you have any information on this as well that would back up your claim of people with no core competencies in the field they are working in holding positions in the civil service?
I have heard the hardest part of the civil service is getting in and that once you are "in", moving around is quite easy. Do you have any information on this as well that would back up your claim of people with no core competencies in the field they are working in holding positions in the civil service?
Certainly. I can back this up with analogous reasoning:
Public Lawyers (i.e. Lawyers that are practicing as lawyers employeed in large legal departments in government). They get paid about 1/3 what lawyers get paid doing the exact same thing in the exact same size organization that is in the private sector.
No lawyer would take the public lawyer's job unless they where not competent doing their jobs in the real world where their competence is everything for being hired, kept or advanced in the organization.
In Public sector its who you know that gets you in. Then you wait your turn and seniority moves you ahead regardless of your professional competence. Once in, then you can speed the process along by stabbing those around you in the back by applying bad ethics, and eventually reach for the top.
The higher you go the worse the people are, the less competent and the more unethical.
It's inherent in the system, because nowhere in public sector do people advance based on having more competence and/or better ethics for doing the job.
Public Lawyers (i.e. Lawyers that are practicing as lawyers employeed in large legal departments in government). They get paid about 1/3 what lawyers get paid doing the exact same thing in the exact same size organization that is in the private sector.
No lawyer would take the public lawyer's job unless they where not competent doing their jobs in the real world where their competence is everything for being hired, kept or advanced in the organization.
In Public sector its who you know that gets you in. Then you wait your turn and seniority moves you ahead regardless of your professional competence. Once in, then you can speed the process along by stabbing those around you in the back by applying bad ethics, and eventually reach for the top.
The higher you go the worse the people are, the less competent and the more unethical.
It's inherent in the system, because nowhere in public sector do people advance based on having more competence and/or better ethics for doing the job.
Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God
What if they have other reasons for doing that particular job? Money isn't everything, you know - not even to a lawyer, sometimes. So you can't go just by remuneration.
Not always, and not necessarily. I'm in the U.S., but I know a lot of people who work locally in the public sector in my city and county who got those jobs because they were qualified for them and applied through everyday channels (newspaper ads, etc.). Conversely, I also know of a lot of people in the private sector who have been hired for positions simply because they were someone's friend.
Oh, like we're supposed to believe that no one has ever been passed over for promotion or even lost a job in the public sector due to an inability to perform as required? Sorry; I'm not buying the idea that things are as you say, especially given that I know differently. Sure, sometimes incompetence doesn't impede one's progress in the public sector, but that also is true in the private sector, and in neither case can a few examples form a sound basis for the sort of sweeping conclusion you have made.
And again, this happens pretty often in the private sector too.
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. What exactly is your point, or do you even have one?
Prove it. Once again, I'm not buying this claim of yours based just on what you've said, because thus far all you've given is opinion.
iamcanadian said:
What if they have other reasons for doing that particular job? Money isn't everything, you know - not even to a lawyer, sometimes. So you can't go just by remuneration.
Not always, and not necessarily. I'm in the U.S., but I know a lot of people who work locally in the public sector in my city and county who got those jobs because they were qualified for them and applied through everyday channels (newspaper ads, etc.). Conversely, I also know of a lot of people in the private sector who have been hired for positions simply because they were someone's friend.
Oh, like we're supposed to believe that no one has ever been passed over for promotion or even lost a job in the public sector due to an inability to perform as required? Sorry; I'm not buying the idea that things are as you say, especially given that I know differently. Sure, sometimes incompetence doesn't impede one's progress in the public sector, but that also is true in the private sector, and in neither case can a few examples form a sound basis for the sort of sweeping conclusion you have made.
And again, this happens pretty often in the private sector too.
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. What exactly is your point, or do you even have one?
Prove it. Once again, I'm not buying this claim of yours based just on what you've said, because thus far all you've given is opinion.
Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God
Did you ever stop to think that these "used car salespeople" are successful at getting promotions because they are very adept at emphazing their own abilities to the higher ups? Thus, they are advanced through the ranks. How well you interact with people is a very good way to obtain a promotion.
iamcanadian said:
Did you ever stop to think that these "used car salespeople" are successful at getting promotions because they are very adept at emphazing their own abilities to the higher ups? Thus, they are advanced through the ranks. How well you interact with people is a very good way to obtain a promotion.
Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God
Yeah, yeah ... science is a religion, too. Not.
iamcanadian said:
Yeah, yeah ... science is a religion, too. Not.
Re: RE: I would rather live my life as if there is a God
I'm nominating the above for "Dumbest Premise of the Year".
iamcanadian said:
I'm nominating the above for "Dumbest Premise of the Year".