It doesn't matter that all governments in all countries do it ! It's bull**** and they get away with it because we let them !!
From a Conservative: Our Government is failing our Veterans
- Thread starter Retired_Can_Soldier
- Start date
Check how the NDP voted on the new veterans Charter. They are far from innocent.
quote
There is no doubt Canadian veterans have been treated in the most vile way possible by one of the most ignorant people in the Harper government. Julian Fantino has demonstrated, quite clearly, that he feels a greater duty to his benefactor, Harper, than he does to the armed services veterans his department is mandated to assist. In fact, his recent behaviour demonstrates a total disdain for veterans. He believed he could appear at a time of his choosing and start issuing orders.
This to a group who, now no longer in uniform, would loudly tell a serving general where to go if they didn't like what was being said. Fantino forgot, (or perhaps has never understood) who it is he actually works for. Not surprising, actually.
Fantino has a long and documented history of being a dangerously stupid person with too much power which he felt was his to abuse and then to attack anyone who shone a light on his activities.
Some people are giving Fantino credit for "sincerely apologizing" to veterans for the spectacle he created. Except that it wasn't a sincere apology and accepting any part of it would be a huge mistake. Professor Stephen Kimber explains why.
Fantino clearly does not understand veterans. Worse though, is that he expects veterans to kneel before him and then be grateful for his very existence. His style is to issue orders; not to listen. And he further insults veterans by telling them they have been "duped" by the public service union, PSAC.
Really? Duped by the very union veterans watched like hawks when they were serving? The same union whose collective wage and benefit package formed the basis for the Canadian Forces compensation and benefit negotiations with the Treasury Board? Ya think?!!
If there's been any "duping" going on it's been by Harper and company, Fantino included. They have made a point of positioning themselves as "friends of the forces" and the "protectors of veterans", all without having done much except make loud noises about it. While the Harperites have been diligent in making certain they applied a nice shiny surface paint job, they have been hacking away at personnel, cutting pay and benefits, cancelling equipment acquisition and fighting against veterans attempting to hang on to disability benefits.
Not to mention the biggest duping of all. Harper, on Sunday, 1 March 2009, on CNN in the U.S., (he never says this kind of thing where a Canadian can get at him), told Fareed Zakaria that the war in Afghanistan was futile. And rather than call the Chief of Defence Staff and require that all Canadian troops be withdrawn to a safe area, he continued to knowingly send Canadian kids to their death. That made them cannon fodder and it highlighted Harper as a dangerous sociopath. Fantino too, is a sociopath but with perhaps a more lingering aroma of corruption.
And here ends part 1.
quote
There is no doubt Canadian veterans have been treated in the most vile way possible by one of the most ignorant people in the Harper government. Julian Fantino has demonstrated, quite clearly, that he feels a greater duty to his benefactor, Harper, than he does to the armed services veterans his department is mandated to assist. In fact, his recent behaviour demonstrates a total disdain for veterans. He believed he could appear at a time of his choosing and start issuing orders.
This to a group who, now no longer in uniform, would loudly tell a serving general where to go if they didn't like what was being said. Fantino forgot, (or perhaps has never understood) who it is he actually works for. Not surprising, actually.
Fantino has a long and documented history of being a dangerously stupid person with too much power which he felt was his to abuse and then to attack anyone who shone a light on his activities.
Some people are giving Fantino credit for "sincerely apologizing" to veterans for the spectacle he created. Except that it wasn't a sincere apology and accepting any part of it would be a huge mistake. Professor Stephen Kimber explains why.
Sincerely? In the next breath, Fantino was bitching to his stenographers at the Toronto Sun that the multi-medalled, wheel-chaired vets had been “duped… jacked up” by the union representing public servants who will lose their jobs and who had paid the veterans’ airfare to Ottawa.
When those mindless-dupe vets failed to show Fantino the due deference he required, he told the Sun, “I wasn’t just going to play dead.”
Keeping in mind, of course, that on one of Fantino's previous yap-sessions with those same stenographers he tried to paint himself into the same frame as a combat veteran. That should have told the veterans who attempted to meet with him that such endeavours were likely to fail. Fantino, who does not know how to control his authoritarian impulses, views himself as a hero. A self-styled hero who brooks no protest without his explicit permission. When those mindless-dupe vets failed to show Fantino the due deference he required, he told the Sun, “I wasn’t just going to play dead.”
Fantino clearly does not understand veterans. Worse though, is that he expects veterans to kneel before him and then be grateful for his very existence. His style is to issue orders; not to listen. And he further insults veterans by telling them they have been "duped" by the public service union, PSAC.
Really? Duped by the very union veterans watched like hawks when they were serving? The same union whose collective wage and benefit package formed the basis for the Canadian Forces compensation and benefit negotiations with the Treasury Board? Ya think?!!
If there's been any "duping" going on it's been by Harper and company, Fantino included. They have made a point of positioning themselves as "friends of the forces" and the "protectors of veterans", all without having done much except make loud noises about it. While the Harperites have been diligent in making certain they applied a nice shiny surface paint job, they have been hacking away at personnel, cutting pay and benefits, cancelling equipment acquisition and fighting against veterans attempting to hang on to disability benefits.
Not to mention the biggest duping of all. Harper, on Sunday, 1 March 2009, on CNN in the U.S., (he never says this kind of thing where a Canadian can get at him), told Fareed Zakaria that the war in Afghanistan was futile. And rather than call the Chief of Defence Staff and require that all Canadian troops be withdrawn to a safe area, he continued to knowingly send Canadian kids to their death. That made them cannon fodder and it highlighted Harper as a dangerous sociopath. Fantino too, is a sociopath but with perhaps a more lingering aroma of corruption.
And here ends part 1.
quote
Who can explain the Silence of the Cons?
Does anyone seriously believe that Conservative MPs are getting fan-mail over the atrocious disrespect the Harper government has shown to soldiers, ex-soldiers and their families? After all, the PM once said these soldiers were the best of Canadians. Is it likely these silent MPs will be greeted with brass bands when they return to their ridings?
Why don't these ordinary Conservative MPs speak out against the injustice of the so-called "universality of service" rule that declares injured soldiers unfit for duty and therefore unfit to serve? Retired general Roméo Dallaire has.
And why don't they say something about the built-in disincentives for injured soldiers who are afraid to come forward for help -- especially those suffering from mental distress? Soldiers know that 90 per cent of those who go to military support units for treatment end up getting the boot.
The military ombudsman, Pierre Daigle, isn't keeping his mouth shut. He knows the current system is unjust because he actually has taken the time to look into the face of the problem -- the human faces of the ex-soldiers and their spouses.
Some of Canada's most needy ex-soldiers don't even have pensions. The policy-makers look at actuarial charts and figure out how much money -- blood money -- they can siphon from veterans and use to balance the budget. What will backbench Tories say when the folks back home point out a shameful statistic: The Harper government spent $28 million promoting the War of 1812 for political purposes -- but for living soldiers the same government cut $35 million from Veterans Affairs and closed much-needed veterans centres.
What makes the Silence of the Cons so remarkable is that they have absolutely nothing to lose by standing up for veterans. In fact, they have a great deal to gain -- and to give.
When will it sink in (as it did with Brent Rathgeber) that Stephen Harper has no goodies for these backbenchers, no respect, no coattails to ride -- and compromised conservative credentials? The prime minister is a dictatorial cult figure who has adopted the same goals and the worst instincts of the people he once insisted were undermining democracy. At a social level, he is deconstructing Canada while delivering the nation's treasure to corporations.
The Silence of the Cons is even harder to understand because silence usually betokens agreement. Does the Conservative caucus really agree that it's more important to protect a disgraced minister like Julian Fantino than it is to make sure Canadian veterans get what they need without having to navigate a degrading bureaucratic obstacle course? They made war on Canada's behalf and now Canada makes war on them -- is that it?
more
The Tyee – Stand Up for Our Vets, Tory Backbenchers!
Does anyone seriously believe that Conservative MPs are getting fan-mail over the atrocious disrespect the Harper government has shown to soldiers, ex-soldiers and their families? After all, the PM once said these soldiers were the best of Canadians. Is it likely these silent MPs will be greeted with brass bands when they return to their ridings?
Why don't these ordinary Conservative MPs speak out against the injustice of the so-called "universality of service" rule that declares injured soldiers unfit for duty and therefore unfit to serve? Retired general Roméo Dallaire has.
And why don't they say something about the built-in disincentives for injured soldiers who are afraid to come forward for help -- especially those suffering from mental distress? Soldiers know that 90 per cent of those who go to military support units for treatment end up getting the boot.
The military ombudsman, Pierre Daigle, isn't keeping his mouth shut. He knows the current system is unjust because he actually has taken the time to look into the face of the problem -- the human faces of the ex-soldiers and their spouses.
Some of Canada's most needy ex-soldiers don't even have pensions. The policy-makers look at actuarial charts and figure out how much money -- blood money -- they can siphon from veterans and use to balance the budget. What will backbench Tories say when the folks back home point out a shameful statistic: The Harper government spent $28 million promoting the War of 1812 for political purposes -- but for living soldiers the same government cut $35 million from Veterans Affairs and closed much-needed veterans centres.
What makes the Silence of the Cons so remarkable is that they have absolutely nothing to lose by standing up for veterans. In fact, they have a great deal to gain -- and to give.
When will it sink in (as it did with Brent Rathgeber) that Stephen Harper has no goodies for these backbenchers, no respect, no coattails to ride -- and compromised conservative credentials? The prime minister is a dictatorial cult figure who has adopted the same goals and the worst instincts of the people he once insisted were undermining democracy. At a social level, he is deconstructing Canada while delivering the nation's treasure to corporations.
The Silence of the Cons is even harder to understand because silence usually betokens agreement. Does the Conservative caucus really agree that it's more important to protect a disgraced minister like Julian Fantino than it is to make sure Canadian veterans get what they need without having to navigate a degrading bureaucratic obstacle course? They made war on Canada's behalf and now Canada makes war on them -- is that it?
more
The Tyee – Stand Up for Our Vets, Tory Backbenchers!
And we let them because it saves us money in taxes. After all, why should we sacrifice eh?
Saves us money on taxes ? How do you figure ? When have taxes gone down ? They may change the name to fee, but you still end up with less service for the same or more money.
Never mind the facts. I like to see government cut funding for the marginalized, underprivileged and destitute, especially veterans and the elderly. Anything to save a buck.
My Grandfather was a veteran of both World Wars, the things that soldiers have to go through to protect us and our way of life are brutal, at the very least we owe them the best care we can provide when they are wounded or retire after years of loyal service.
What the Harper government is doing to our veterans is obscene.
Retired soldiers, Mounties hit by Conservative budget changes - Politics - CBC News
Canadian Veterans Home-Care Program Changes Irk Housecleaners
Internal documents show Veterans Affairs staff concerned about impact of office closures
Veterans affairs Minister Julian Fantino seems much more concerned about putting veterans in their "place" than honouring their sacrifices for this nation.
‘Sorry isn’t good enough’: Veterans call Fantino’s apology a performance as Tories accuse unions of stoking anger | National Post
This is just one more way the present government has abandoned the people of Canada.
What the Harper government is doing to our veterans is obscene.
Retired soldiers, Mounties hit by Conservative budget changes - Politics - CBC News
Canadian Veterans Home-Care Program Changes Irk Housecleaners
Internal documents show Veterans Affairs staff concerned about impact of office closures
Veterans affairs Minister Julian Fantino seems much more concerned about putting veterans in their "place" than honouring their sacrifices for this nation.
‘Sorry isn’t good enough’: Veterans call Fantino’s apology a performance as Tories accuse unions of stoking anger | National Post
This is just one more way the present government has abandoned the people of Canada.
And the utter bull**** just continues.
Canadian Vets' Medical Records To Be Held By Private, U.S. Firm: NDP
Canadian Vets' Medical Records To Be Held By Private, U.S. Firm: NDP
It's hard to believe after what the Harper Cons have done to our veterans, that they could betray them even more than they already have.
But that's exactly what they are doing. First they closed down those veteran service centres for no good reason.
Now they're going after their healthcare plans.
Retired soldiers and Mounties, along with wounded veterans and their families, are among a group of former federal employees that the government targeted for savings in its budget Tuesday.
In its economic plan, the government announced it was going after $7.5 billion in savings by forcing participants in the government’s health plan for public servants to pay half of the costs, up from 25 per cent. Before 2006, it was even lower.
Retired soldiers, Mounties hit by Conservative budget changes - Politics - CBC News
But that's exactly what they are doing. First they closed down those veteran service centres for no good reason.
Now they're going after their healthcare plans.
Retired soldiers and Mounties, along with wounded veterans and their families, are among a group of former federal employees that the government targeted for savings in its budget Tuesday.
In its economic plan, the government announced it was going after $7.5 billion in savings by forcing participants in the government’s health plan for public servants to pay half of the costs, up from 25 per cent. Before 2006, it was even lower.
Retired soldiers, Mounties hit by Conservative budget changes - Politics - CBC News
Colonel (retired) Pat B. Stogran Responds to Maj.-Gen. Lewis MacKenzie
Last week Retired Maj.-Gen. Lewis MacKenzie had an opinion piece in the Globe and Mail about suicides in the Canadian Forces.
You can access that article here:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/canadian-forces-holding-the-line-on-mental-health/article16892831/
MacKenzie starts his piece with this paragraph: “The unfortunate cluster of suicides by Canadian Forces personnel, serving and retired, bracketing the recent Christmas break, understandably drew a good deal of media attention – almost all of it negative. Much of the discussion focused on the lack of military support for the victims, on inappropriate compulsory release procedures and on the stigma associated with mental illness.”
His piece prompted Colonel (retired) Pat B. Stogran to offer this rebuttal:
RE: Canadian Forces: Holding the Line on Mental Health By MGen (ret’d) Lewis MacKenzie
I suffered several rude awakenings as I arrived at the golden years of my military career. First, I was demoralized at having had committed my life to a military institution that was incapable of winning the war in Afghanistan.
Then, as Veterans Ombudsman, I discovered that the very government, to which so many warriors made life-shattering sacrifices, goes to great lengths, not only to eliminate the financial liability they pose, but also to distance itself from any obligation to care for them in kind.
Now, in the face of a military that seems incapable of dealing with force reconstitution in the aftermath of war, the fabled Peacekeeper and famous Canadian military ‘expert’ on just about everything, retired Major General Lewis Mackenzie, simply shrugs at the issues and says ‘meh’!
In his recent Globe & Mail special (14 February), the General not only demonstrated that he no longer believes in the Mission-Team-Self ethos that our military members live by, but he turned his back on a Force Protection* issue – something that, as a commissioned military officer, he was duty bound to champion.
Mackenzie once publicly admonished General Romeo Dallaire for doing nothing to stop Belgian paratroopers under his command in Rwanda from being slaughtered; suggesting Dallaire’s guilt for failing to act was the source of the mental torment he suffers to this day.
General Mackenzie, on the other hand, seems to have a clear conscience in abandoning those very soldiers who made him look good, according to the title of his last book.
It is bad enough that few Generals or Admirals have risen to support the disabled and disadvantaged Veterans. Andrew Leslie did – as he positions himself for candidacy on Trudeau Train. Rick Hillier made a call for a public inquiry; belatedly and only after he was cornered by a journalist on the issue. Shame on General Mackenzie for coming out against the claims of Veterans.
I won’t waste any time debating the veracity of any of the facts he has presented because, in-and-of-themselves, they are irrelevant. If any suicide can reasonably be attributed to military duties, then something must be done.
But a “cluster of suicides by Canadian Forces personnel” that can be directly related to service to this Country cannot be trivialized as being “unfortunate” – it is a signal that things must change. If the things that you are doing aren’t working, then doing the same things, only harder, is not a good idea.
As Will Rogers once said: the best away to get out of a hole is to stop digging it.
The CF’s Joint Personnel Support Unit and Integrated Personnel Support Centres – which General Mackenzie credits with having evaluated and treated some 2,000 non-deployable personnel according to their illness or disability – may very well be the manifestation of all that is wrong.
MWO Barry Westholm recently and very publicly retired from the JPSU, citing that “it’s so overwhelmed that it can’t do anything and they’re losing track of people.” He added, “You don’t want to self-identify, because then you’re in this big grist mill”.
If the Chief of Defence Staff, General Tom Lawson, really wants to de-stigmatize mental health issues in the CF, he should cease lame public service announcements on YouTube, and stop banishing stress casualties to The Island of Misfit Toys (as some warriors have nicknamed the IPSCs).
The chain of command must stop dismissing this problem as a medical one for the CF Surgeon General to sort out. There was a time in the Canadian Army when a Commanding Officer, facing a crisis such as this “unfortunate cluster of suicides,” not only had the authority but also the proclivity to do something — anything — decisive to fix the problem.
Even something as unsophisticated as issuing an edict in Routine Orders that suicides were prohibited, and confining the entire unit to barracks until assured that everybody was looking out for one another. I am not suggesting the CF should go back to those simpler times, but the chain of command must be more decisive, engaged, and assertive in preventing further suicides.
Ironically, a politician has demonstrated greater empathy and courage than any of our mighty military men. In another Op-Ed recently, failed Prime Ministerial-aspirant Bob Rae did not show any such complacency with the Nation’s suicide rate – which General Mackenzie asserts the CF mirrors, and is dismissive of – In fact, Rae is critical of all armies, in every war, that, when faced with post traumatic stress, have been reluctant to confront the real consequences.
Unlike the let-them-eat-cake attitude General Mackenzie conveys, Mr Rae urges a national strategy on suicide prevention.
It disappoints me to be telling General Mackenzie – for whom I had so much respect and admiration when I was a junior combat leader – to take note of how a leader should act. I do not wish any ill-will towards the good General, but that old soldier really should fade away.
Colonel (retired) Pat B. Stogran
Canada’s First Veterans Ombudsman
Pat Stogran To Lewis MacKenzie: Shame On You For Coming Out Against The Claims of Veterans | Ottawa Citizen
Last week Retired Maj.-Gen. Lewis MacKenzie had an opinion piece in the Globe and Mail about suicides in the Canadian Forces.
You can access that article here:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/canadian-forces-holding-the-line-on-mental-health/article16892831/
MacKenzie starts his piece with this paragraph: “The unfortunate cluster of suicides by Canadian Forces personnel, serving and retired, bracketing the recent Christmas break, understandably drew a good deal of media attention – almost all of it negative. Much of the discussion focused on the lack of military support for the victims, on inappropriate compulsory release procedures and on the stigma associated with mental illness.”
His piece prompted Colonel (retired) Pat B. Stogran to offer this rebuttal:
RE: Canadian Forces: Holding the Line on Mental Health By MGen (ret’d) Lewis MacKenzie
I suffered several rude awakenings as I arrived at the golden years of my military career. First, I was demoralized at having had committed my life to a military institution that was incapable of winning the war in Afghanistan.
Then, as Veterans Ombudsman, I discovered that the very government, to which so many warriors made life-shattering sacrifices, goes to great lengths, not only to eliminate the financial liability they pose, but also to distance itself from any obligation to care for them in kind.
Now, in the face of a military that seems incapable of dealing with force reconstitution in the aftermath of war, the fabled Peacekeeper and famous Canadian military ‘expert’ on just about everything, retired Major General Lewis Mackenzie, simply shrugs at the issues and says ‘meh’!
In his recent Globe & Mail special (14 February), the General not only demonstrated that he no longer believes in the Mission-Team-Self ethos that our military members live by, but he turned his back on a Force Protection* issue – something that, as a commissioned military officer, he was duty bound to champion.
Mackenzie once publicly admonished General Romeo Dallaire for doing nothing to stop Belgian paratroopers under his command in Rwanda from being slaughtered; suggesting Dallaire’s guilt for failing to act was the source of the mental torment he suffers to this day.
General Mackenzie, on the other hand, seems to have a clear conscience in abandoning those very soldiers who made him look good, according to the title of his last book.
It is bad enough that few Generals or Admirals have risen to support the disabled and disadvantaged Veterans. Andrew Leslie did – as he positions himself for candidacy on Trudeau Train. Rick Hillier made a call for a public inquiry; belatedly and only after he was cornered by a journalist on the issue. Shame on General Mackenzie for coming out against the claims of Veterans.
I won’t waste any time debating the veracity of any of the facts he has presented because, in-and-of-themselves, they are irrelevant. If any suicide can reasonably be attributed to military duties, then something must be done.
But a “cluster of suicides by Canadian Forces personnel” that can be directly related to service to this Country cannot be trivialized as being “unfortunate” – it is a signal that things must change. If the things that you are doing aren’t working, then doing the same things, only harder, is not a good idea.
As Will Rogers once said: the best away to get out of a hole is to stop digging it.
The CF’s Joint Personnel Support Unit and Integrated Personnel Support Centres – which General Mackenzie credits with having evaluated and treated some 2,000 non-deployable personnel according to their illness or disability – may very well be the manifestation of all that is wrong.
MWO Barry Westholm recently and very publicly retired from the JPSU, citing that “it’s so overwhelmed that it can’t do anything and they’re losing track of people.” He added, “You don’t want to self-identify, because then you’re in this big grist mill”.
If the Chief of Defence Staff, General Tom Lawson, really wants to de-stigmatize mental health issues in the CF, he should cease lame public service announcements on YouTube, and stop banishing stress casualties to The Island of Misfit Toys (as some warriors have nicknamed the IPSCs).
The chain of command must stop dismissing this problem as a medical one for the CF Surgeon General to sort out. There was a time in the Canadian Army when a Commanding Officer, facing a crisis such as this “unfortunate cluster of suicides,” not only had the authority but also the proclivity to do something — anything — decisive to fix the problem.
Even something as unsophisticated as issuing an edict in Routine Orders that suicides were prohibited, and confining the entire unit to barracks until assured that everybody was looking out for one another. I am not suggesting the CF should go back to those simpler times, but the chain of command must be more decisive, engaged, and assertive in preventing further suicides.
Ironically, a politician has demonstrated greater empathy and courage than any of our mighty military men. In another Op-Ed recently, failed Prime Ministerial-aspirant Bob Rae did not show any such complacency with the Nation’s suicide rate – which General Mackenzie asserts the CF mirrors, and is dismissive of – In fact, Rae is critical of all armies, in every war, that, when faced with post traumatic stress, have been reluctant to confront the real consequences.
Unlike the let-them-eat-cake attitude General Mackenzie conveys, Mr Rae urges a national strategy on suicide prevention.
It disappoints me to be telling General Mackenzie – for whom I had so much respect and admiration when I was a junior combat leader – to take note of how a leader should act. I do not wish any ill-will towards the good General, but that old soldier really should fade away.
Colonel (retired) Pat B. Stogran
Canada’s First Veterans Ombudsman
Pat Stogran To Lewis MacKenzie: Shame On You For Coming Out Against The Claims of Veterans | Ottawa Citizen
Now military families are losing thousands as they're forced to move from depressed housing markets to more healthy ones.
Military Family Battles Harper Government Over Moving Losses
This was a government that was shooting billions of dollars out into "stimulus" spending. most of it going to conservative ridings even at a time when they were in a minority, and yet when it comes to taking care of our veterans and serving personnel there's a constant battle for what's been promised.
What if the soldiers who were sent to war had said we'll get around to our job when we feel like it...in any war Canada has been in. They represent the best in us and maybe that's why this government is so focused on dishonouring them. They take some of the limelight off of the glory hounds on the government benches.
Military Family Battles Harper Government Over Moving Losses
This was a government that was shooting billions of dollars out into "stimulus" spending. most of it going to conservative ridings even at a time when they were in a minority, and yet when it comes to taking care of our veterans and serving personnel there's a constant battle for what's been promised.
What if the soldiers who were sent to war had said we'll get around to our job when we feel like it...in any war Canada has been in. They represent the best in us and maybe that's why this government is so focused on dishonouring them. They take some of the limelight off of the glory hounds on the government benches.
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Typical of Generals abandoning the troops. The evidence showing DND failing is clear, public and well known.
Hillier recently stated that in 2005, NDHQ was surprised at the rate of PTSD- Now how in the world of Fukn Stupid could that come as a surprise. Answer- Because it was not a priority.
Rick Hillier calls for public inquiry in wake of soldier suicides - Politics - CBC News
Veterans don't have social contract, Ottawa says in lawsuit response
The federal government is arguing it does not have a social contract with veterans in response to a class-action suit brought by veterans upset with the compensation arrangement offered to wounded soldiers under the New Veterans Charter.
The social covenant is this promise that our country, Canada, has promised service people they will be protected when they get maimed and their families will be looked after if they are killed," Donald Sorochan said.
But in its legal response, government lawyers said no such contract exists.
"At no time in Canada's history has any alleged 'social contract' or 'social covenant' having the attributes pleaded by the plaintiffs been given effect in any statute, regulation or as a constitutional principle written or unwritten."
'Contradiction to the culture that is Canada'
The government goes on to argue that when Prime Minister Robert Borden first made the promise during the First World War, he was making political statements that were not meant to create a social contract.
Pat Stogran is the spokesperson for the group behind the lawsuit, the Equitas Society, and is the former veterans ombudsman. He called the government's response "ludicrous."
"That is a contradiction to the culture that is Canada," he said.
Stogran also said veterans are being shortchanged and many of the serving soldiers right now have no idea the problems they will face once they're out of the forces.
The current veterans ombudsman said there was a clause in legislation the New Veterans Charter replaced to ensure the government was fulfilling its obligations to veterans, but that clause was not included in the new legislation.
The Veterans Ombudsman's Office suggests that obligation should be part of the New Veterans Charter
"So it's clearly at least stated within the context of the legislation that there is an obligation and it doesn't matter whether it's legislated or moral or how you describe it, but there is an obligation for every citizen of Canada," current Veterans Ombudsman Guy Parent said.
more
Veterans don't have social contract, Ottawa says in lawsuit response - Politics - CBC News
The federal government is arguing it does not have a social contract with veterans in response to a class-action suit brought by veterans upset with the compensation arrangement offered to wounded soldiers under the New Veterans Charter.
The social covenant is this promise that our country, Canada, has promised service people they will be protected when they get maimed and their families will be looked after if they are killed," Donald Sorochan said.
But in its legal response, government lawyers said no such contract exists.
"At no time in Canada's history has any alleged 'social contract' or 'social covenant' having the attributes pleaded by the plaintiffs been given effect in any statute, regulation or as a constitutional principle written or unwritten."
'Contradiction to the culture that is Canada'
The government goes on to argue that when Prime Minister Robert Borden first made the promise during the First World War, he was making political statements that were not meant to create a social contract.
Pat Stogran is the spokesperson for the group behind the lawsuit, the Equitas Society, and is the former veterans ombudsman. He called the government's response "ludicrous."
"That is a contradiction to the culture that is Canada," he said.
Stogran also said veterans are being shortchanged and many of the serving soldiers right now have no idea the problems they will face once they're out of the forces.
The current veterans ombudsman said there was a clause in legislation the New Veterans Charter replaced to ensure the government was fulfilling its obligations to veterans, but that clause was not included in the new legislation.
The Veterans Ombudsman's Office suggests that obligation should be part of the New Veterans Charter
"So it's clearly at least stated within the context of the legislation that there is an obligation and it doesn't matter whether it's legislated or moral or how you describe it, but there is an obligation for every citizen of Canada," current Veterans Ombudsman Guy Parent said.
more
Veterans don't have social contract, Ottawa says in lawsuit response - Politics - CBC News
This wounded veteran describing how dealing with Veterans Affairs is like fighting the Taliban is sobering.
Why Fighting Veterans Affairs Is Like Fighting the Taliban | Bruce Moncur
So people who were there when we needed them the most are now being abandoned when they need us the most.
It's not about bucks and it's not about power, it's about showing respect for those Canadians who went halfway around the world into one of the most dangerous environments in the world in our name. Veterans should be seen as wearing the Maple Leaf even if they're no longer in uniform, by disrespecting them, the conservative government is disrespecting all of us.
Why Fighting Veterans Affairs Is Like Fighting the Taliban | Bruce Moncur
So people who were there when we needed them the most are now being abandoned when they need us the most.
It's not about bucks and it's not about power, it's about showing respect for those Canadians who went halfway around the world into one of the most dangerous environments in the world in our name. Veterans should be seen as wearing the Maple Leaf even if they're no longer in uniform, by disrespecting them, the conservative government is disrespecting all of us.