FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schools

[Reverend Blair]

RE: FRANCE banned all rel

Keep in mind that Jews cannot wear their headwear either. Neither can Catholics wear their crosses, Sihks carry their knives, or worshippers of Hearn wear deer antlers.

 

[moghrabi]

When these moslems immigrate to France or Germany, they have to apply to get in. They must be told before immigrating that their head scarf is not welcome.

 

[moghrabi]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all rel

Keep in mind that Jews cannot wear their headwear either. Neither can Catholics wear their crosses, Sihks carry their knives, or worshippers of Hearn wear deer antlers.

The rest will find a way to overrule this. It is the size of the muslims that is at issue and the reason behind it is to be able to see the person in full and not hidden under a veil.

 

[DasFX]

This may come out bad, but isn't it France's prerogative to do and implement whatever laws they want. I mean the law has the backing of the majority. I mean, just because we have a charter of rights that promotes freedom of religion, that doesn't mean France does. France isn't a nation of immigrants, they don't want their culture and society to change, they like what they have. So if they feel this law helps preserve French society from change then so be it.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: FRANCE banned all rel

They should be told before immigrating, I agree.

Once there they do have the option of private schools though. The law applies only to public schools. I'm not fully decided on this but as long as it is applied equally and there are other options available, it has at least some validity.

 

[DasFX]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

As a matter of fact, the head scarf is a necessity in the Moslem religion. Some women choose not to wear it but nontheless it is a religious duty.

Not just some, but lots. I mean I would say half judging from my travels. I guess there are a lot of infidel out there who are angering Allah!

 

[moghrabi]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

As a matter of fact, the head scarf is a necessity in the Moslem religion. Some women choose not to wear it but nontheless it is a religious duty.

Not just some, but lots. I mean I would say half judging from my travels. I guess there are a lot of infidel out there who are angering Allah!

Yes there are a lot of women with no head scarfs. I wouldn't call them infidels but liberal women. And they look GOOOOOOOOD.

 

[DasFX]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

Yes there are a lot of women with no head scarfs. I wouldn't call them infidels but liberal women. And they look GOOOOOOOOD.

That just decreases my sympathy for their claims of persecution and oppresion. They aren't being forced to do anything that goes against the very core of their religion. They are merely being asked to conform to French culture and society.

 

[moghrabi]

But don't forget the other half of the women who have head scarfs and they chose to wear it. I have nothing against a law passed against all religious symbols as along as people are told that before coming into the country.

 

[DasFX]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

But don't forget the other half of the women who have head scarfs and they chose to wear it. I have nothing against a law passed against all religious symbols as along as people are told that before coming into the country.

You mention two things, the first, that they choose to wear it. Secondly, what obligation does the French government have to tell immigrants of any future laws? This law wouldn't work as one that is grandfathered in. Laws can change without notice. The people who don't like the law now, know about it now and can leave France if they so wish.

 

[moghrabi]

Laws can change of course. But what are the faults of the people who entered france prior. Do they have to leave their new homes if the new laws doesn't agree with their religious obligations?

 

[DasFX]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

Do they have to leave their new homes if the new laws doesn't agree with their religious obligations?

They left their original countries for far less of a reason.

 

[moghrabi]

People move around looking for a better life, better way of living and so on. Your grandparents did the same. They were treated with respect and dignity here. We don't care if your wear a cross or have a turban. The opposite is happening in France. I wouldn't like to go there now as they might come up with a law against brown skinned people.

 

[DasFX]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

Your grandparents did the same. They were treated with respect and dignity here. ... The opposite is happening in France. I wouldn't like to go there now as they might come up with a law against brown skinned people.

When my parents came here, they faced adversity and encountered some ignorant people. I wouldn't say the welcome mat was out, but they adapted and learned the ways of Canada.

Might I remind you that the law only applies to schools, not everywhere! As for your law banning brown skin, that is the same kind of stupid leap those opposed to Same Sex Marriage make about how it will lead to polygamy.

 

[moghrabi]

When I immigrated to Canada, the red carpet was put out for me and my family (parents). You face ignorant people anywhere you go. Canada welcomed us in all ways than one. We had to learn different ways of doing things but we were treated with dignity and we were showed how to do it.

As for my "stupid" law of banning brown skinned people, please go back and see what the white man did to the African-American and still do now. I am not against same sex marriage or any kind of marriage as long as the two parties agree to what they are doing.

As for the law passing for schools only now, nothing will comfort the parties involved that it might not extend to other public places. Grumpy restaurant managers and movies theater owners etc... might complain that they are not comfortable serving people with head scarf. I also would like to see the reaction on the Sikh people when they are told that they can't wear a turban or carry a dagger. This problem could spiral in a very bad way if it happens in Canada and I don't think it will.

 

[passpatoo]

Seems to me, that there is a seperation of church and state, not church and individual. Therefore, it would be right and appropriate for the schools to ban all religious symbols in thier buildings (eg, no crucifixes hung on walls etc.), What the students themselves choose to wear or display is of thier own choice just as it is in the general population.

 

[moghrabi]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

Seems to me, that there is a seperation of church and state, not church and individual. Therefore, it would be right and appropriate for the schools to ban all religious symbols in thier buildings (eg, no crucifixes hung on walls etc.), What the students themselves choose to wear or display is of thier own choice just as it is in the general population.

This is what we have in Canada Passpatoo. No religious symbols in schools, however, each student go to school can wear what they wish to wear, a cross, a turban or a head scarf. Isn't Canada wonderful?????

 

[Machjo]

Re: RE: FRANCE banned all religious symbols from their schoo

No. Canada is not France. We pride ourselves of being multiculture. We pride ourselves of tolerating each others religions. France was forced by a large Jewish community to force moslems to take off their head scarfs. We do not have this issue here.

Are you sure it was the Jews, and not secularists? I've worked with Jews before, and some of the men do in fact like to wear their headgear, whatever it's called, to work, and some will also wear jewellery with jewish symbols. So I doubt Jews would be behind this.

 

[Machjo]

If one believes in the total separation of Church and State,and the schools are state-run..why,of course,keep all religious symbols out of the classrooms.

Actually, this is the exact opposite of the separation of church and state. Real separation means the state doesn't stick its nose in it. If the government prohibits it, then it's effectively making a religion of its own!

 

[Machjo]

They already ban a lot of what you said LadyC :wink: I think they should bring back the uniforms it would stop a lot of the bullshit in the schools and save us parents a ton of money :wink: If my kids new I just said that they would kill me 8O :lol:

I actually do support uniforms, as long as they can be religiously inclusive. Heck, you could even adopt a uniform veil for the Muslim girls if their parents can agree, and require any other religious jewellery to be in good taste, such as rings and lapel pins. Obviously this might not give a student the right to walk into the class wearing a sleeveless shirt, exposing all his armpit hair, showing the words "Jesus Kicks Ass!" in the name of religious freedom of expression. I actually did see that once! :roll: