For the NDPers thinking of voting Liberal.

Colpy

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 5, 2005
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Re: RE: For the NDPers thinking of voting Liberal.

the caracal kid said:
Mulroney is still involved with the Cons.

As for making up one's mind:
The reformers were bad news, period.
The old PC's were somewhat progressive,but still carried the right-wing ideology to the detriment of the country.
The new CPC = Reform + the conservative aspects of the PC party.
In other words, what little good there was in the PC's (and i admit there was some good to the old party) was tossed because it was too liberal to fit with the Reform agenda.

I only wish the meat of what you say was true.

Reform dumped a lot of their platform when they joined with the PC Party to form the CPC. I see it as Reform giving up, to tell you the truth. Necessary to get the Liberals out of power, but very unfortunate.

Good Lord, it would be hard to slide a piece of paper between CPC and Liberal positions on most of the platform. There are exceptions, of course, but nothing glaring.

There were very good things in the old Reform party. Parliamentary reform springs to mind. That has really fallen aside.

I still have to make the case: give the CPC a government.....let them run with it for five years. God, if they are half as bad as most of you here believe they are, I'll vote Liberal next time.
 

the caracal kid

the clan of the claw
Nov 28, 2005
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but we saw how committed the reformers were to change as soon as they got to Ottawa and could not turn down the perks they said they would. They corrupted faster than anybody.

To be honest, i don't think the country is politically stable enough to face the potential fallout of a CPC screwup. That is of course if you want to see Canada prosper.
 

Colpy

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 5, 2005
21,887
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Re: RE: For the NDPers thinking of voting Liberal.

the caracal kid said:
but we saw how committed the reformers were to change as soon as they got to Ottawa and could not turn down the perks they said they would. They corrupted faster than anybody.

To be honest, i don't think the country is politically stable enough to face the potential fallout of a CPC screwup. That is of course if you want to see Canada prosper.

Yeah, human nature at work.

But perks are not corruption.

And yeah, I would like to see Canada prosper. In many ways. And I think the liberals have screwed up, are screwing up, and will continue to screw up very seriously until we throw them out.
 

the caracal kid

the clan of the claw
Nov 28, 2005
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Well, they took what they could get their hands on given being a western rump party at the time.

Well, choosing the libs is probably a game of picking the least rotten apple from the barrel for many people.

Too bad the bloc could not form the government! If it wasn't for Bouchard and Duceppe i probably would be disinterested in politics in Canada.
 

Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
10,168
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Regina, SK
Well, think about this. The last conservative PM was Mulroney, from 17 September 1984 to 24 June 1993. Before that, it was Diefenbaker, 21 June 1957 to 21 April 1963, about 21 years before. Before that, it was Bennett, 7 August 1930 to 22 October 1935, about 22 years before. I'm not counting Kim Campbell and Joe Clark, they weren't in office long enough to matter.

What conclusion can we draw from this information? My conclusion is this: in modern times, every generation tries out the Tories, and when they prove themselves to be completely inept and corrupt they're banished, until there are enough new voters around who don't remember the last time and vote the buggers in again. It's too soon for another conservative government, it's not due for another 8 or 10 years.
 

the caracal kid

the clan of the claw
Nov 28, 2005
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dex, sort of like if people only know prosperity they loose their appreciation for it. It takes some "hard times" to remind people of the different ways things can be. We will always have the cons to show us how bad things can be.
 

yballa09

Electoral Member
Sep 8, 2005
103
0
16
Rexburg, Idaho
Oh, and the NDP... oh ya, we've always been smart enough to never even go that far. 43 seats is the most we've ever entrusted in them, and we quickly realized it was too much.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
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Winnipeg
For those complaining that the media wasn't covering the Chow story, from Maclean's:
Print Story | Email Story | Subscribe Now!



December 26, 2005 - 23:22

Liberal exec resigns after comparing NDP's Olivia Chow to a dog on his blog

TARA BRAUTIGAM

TORONTO (CP) - A high-ranking official within the Liberal Party of Canada resigned Monday after he made disparaging comments on his blog about NDP Leader Jack Layton and his wife, NDP candidate Olivia Chow.

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, NDP candidate for the Toronto riding of Trinity-Spadina, and a chow chow dog were posted on his blog dated Dec. 9 under the heading Separated at Birth.






The blog also contained an offensive reference to Layton.

"I'm going away for a couple of days so I thought I would find something smart and witty to put up on my blog before I left," the blog said, dated Nov. 23.

"Unfortunatley (sic) I couldn't think of anything so I just want to say that I think Jack Layton is an asshole . . . for no reason other than it makes me feel good to say it . . . and because he is."

The site also had a Top 10 list of things that would "piss me off" during the federal election campaign.

They included:

-"Being dragged out to a Liberal rally, lied to so I'm there 30 minutes early, and then forced to stand in a hot room that's way too small to give the appearance that everyone wants to be there."

-"Harper being flanked by the sexy Rona Ambrose at every opportunity."

-"Harper being flanked by the ethnic Rahim Jaffer at every opportunity."

The blog has since been taken offline.

Klander's blog was personal and did not reflect the view of the federal Liberals, said Stephen Heckbert, a spokesman for the Liberal campaign in Ontario.

"I think he recognized that there's some things that are outside the bounds of good taste," Heckbert said. "And I think then it came to a decision that it would be better for the party and for him if he were to step down."

Klander was a volunteer and did not play an official role for the Liberals during this campaign, Heckbert said, adding he has apologized to Chow.

"Obviously, this is something the Liberal Party of Canada doesn't condone. It's our view that partisan rhetoric has its limits."

But Ian Capstick, a spokesman for the NDP campaign, said the postings reflect Liberal mud-slinging.

"We were shocked, disappointed and offended," Capstick said from Ottawa. "This has become indicative of the way Liberals are seeing this election. They couldn't find basis for attack on Ms. Chow's community record, her activism, so they chose instead to focus on one thing."

Klander's resignation was a positive step, but he needs to make further amends, Capstick added.

"He needs to take a good long hard look at some of the postings he made on that website and realize the impact that they had on a variety of different communities."

Tory Leader Stephen Harper also faulted the Liberals for theuir attacks on rival parties.

"There is quite a campaign of slur and personal attack going on here and one can only hope that the Liberal party will get a bit of a public backlash over it," Harper said at a brief campaign appearance in Calgary

Though Klander's comments were regretful, it's not uncommon for political blogs of all stripes to cross certain boundaries, Heckbert said.

"Partisan blogs get a little heated, particularly around election time," he said. "You'd see some language that might curl your hair."
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
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RE: For the NDPers thinki

I saw it on one of the fillers between shows on NewsWorld.

It's funny how it's the Conservatives complaining that it didn't make the news. They don't watch the news, how would they know?
 

Roy

Electoral Member
Nov 23, 2005
218
0
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Alberta
It's funny how it's the Conservatives complaining that it didn't make the news. They don't watch the news, how would they know?

maybe they are going to school or working to make sure that they won't have to collect welfare cheques...thus becoming NDP supporters :wink:

And it should of at least been a short clip on the National, I mean can you honestly say that if the CPC was involved it would not make the National? If you do not think that the CBC is liberal bias then you are simply selectively hearing. Fact is that most Canadians actually accept this as truth.
 

Finder

House Member
Dec 18, 2005
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Roy said:
It's funny how it's the Conservatives complaining that it didn't make the news. They don't watch the news, how would they know?

maybe they are going to school or working to make sure that they won't have to collect welfare cheques. :wink:

And it should of at least been a short clip on the National, I mean can you honestly say that if the CPC was involved it would not make the National? If you do not think that the CBC is liberal bias then you are simply selectively hearing. Fact is that most Canadians actually accept this as truth.

I think the CBC has a very moderate view on most things. I don't think the CBC supports any political party, and I think your reading into this a little bit too much. The news in the last few days because of the holiday season has been slow. working at CTV for about 2 years I saw how dead these places can be around this time of year.

Really this story slipt threw the cracks it would seem. Also with Peoples focus on the holidays perhaps they didn't want to make this story a front page article the day after xmas. *shrugs*
 

Roy

Electoral Member
Nov 23, 2005
218
0
16
Alberta
RE: For the NDPers thinki

some one from a political party calling another candidate an asshole and his wife a dogg? if this was a conservative it would of made front page new be it a slow christmas day or not.

And I do not think the CBC is non partisan, actually over 65% of Canadians feel that the CBC has an inherant liberal bias, so I am not alone.
 

Finder

House Member
Dec 18, 2005
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Re: RE: For the NDPers thinki

Roy said:
some one from a political party calling another candidate an asshole and his wife a dogg? if this was a conservative it would of made front page new be it a slow christmas day or not.

And I do not think the CBC is non partisan, actually over 65% of Canadians feel that the CBC has an inherant liberal bias, so I am not alone.
Where did you get that poll from? The Conservative Party website? lol.

Anyhow here, your wrong. CTV has it here for anyone to read and it's at the top of the election page.

http://www.ctv.ca//servlet/ArticleN...d_051226/20051226?s_name=election2006&no_ads=


Here's another one from the CBC at the top of the election news

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canadavotes2006/national/2005/12/26/liberal-051226.html
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
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38
Winnipeg
RE: For the NDPers thinki

Like I pointed out before, Roy, Conservatives have been doing this for quite some time now. It was Conservatives who first started this particular slur against Olivia Chow during the last campaign even though they weren't a factor in the riding. Just because they did so anonymously doesn't change that.

For them to try to use it to their political advantage at this point, especially when they were not slighted and are not involved, is extremely hypocritical.

I can't say whether this on The National or not because I was otherwise occupied, but here's the CBC story:
Liberal executive resigns after disparaging NDP politicians on blog
Last Updated Mon, 26 Dec 2005 23:44:55 EST
CBC News

A prominent member of the federal Liberal Party resigned Monday over comments he made on his blog about NDP Leader Jack Layton and his wife, NDP candidate Olivia Chow.

Mike Klander, a public affairs consultant in Toronto, had been executive vice-president of the party's Ontario wing.

He stepped down from the volunteer position after it was revealed that he had posted a picture of Chow on his personal blog alongside a picture of a chow chow dog, with the heading "Separated at birth."

Chow is running as the NDP candidate for the Toronto riding of Trinity-Spadina.

The blog, which has been taken offline, also contained nasty comments about Layton.

In an entry dated Nov. 23, he wrote: "I'm going away for a couple of days so I thought I would find something smart and witty to put up on my blog before I left. Unfortunately I couldn't think of anything so I just want to say that I think Jack Layton is an a**hole ... for no reason other than it makes me feel good to say it ... and because he is."

Stephen Heckbert, a spokesman for the Liberal campaign in Ontario, said Klander's blog was a personal one that did not reflect the view of the federal party.

He called the material "outside the bounds of good taste" and said Klander had apologized to Chow.

"Obviously, this is something the Liberal Party of Canada doesn't condone," Heckbert told the Canadian Press.

"It's our view that partisan rhetoric has its limits."

Canada Votes 2006
 

Finder

House Member
Dec 18, 2005
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Re: RE: For the NDPers thinki

Reverend Blair said:
Like I pointed out before, Roy, Conservatives have been doing this for quite some time now. It was Conservatives who first started this particular slur against Olivia Chow during the last campaign even though they weren't a factor in the riding. Just because they did so anonymously doesn't change that.

For them to try to use it to their political advantage at this point, especially when they were not slighted and are not involved, is extremely hypocritical.

I can't say whether this on The National or not because I was otherwise occupied, but here's the CBC story:
Liberal executive resigns after disparaging NDP politicians on blog
Last Updated Mon, 26 Dec 2005 23:44:55 EST
CBC News

A prominent member of the federal Liberal Party resigned Monday over comments he made on his blog about NDP Leader Jack Layton and his wife, NDP candidate Olivia Chow.

Mike Klander, a public affairs consultant in Toronto, had been executive vice-president of the party's Ontario wing.

He stepped down from the volunteer position after it was revealed that he had posted a picture of Chow on his personal blog alongside a picture of a chow chow dog, with the heading "Separated at birth."

Chow is running as the NDP candidate for the Toronto riding of Trinity-Spadina.

The blog, which has been taken offline, also contained nasty comments about Layton.

In an entry dated Nov. 23, he wrote: "I'm going away for a couple of days so I thought I would find something smart and witty to put up on my blog before I left. Unfortunately I couldn't think of anything so I just want to say that I think Jack Layton is an a**hole ... for no reason other than it makes me feel good to say it ... and because he is."

Stephen Heckbert, a spokesman for the Liberal campaign in Ontario, said Klander's blog was a personal one that did not reflect the view of the federal party.

He called the material "outside the bounds of good taste" and said Klander had apologized to Chow.

"Obviously, this is something the Liberal Party of Canada doesn't condone," Heckbert told the Canadian Press.

"It's our view that partisan rhetoric has its limits."

Canada Votes 2006

Thanks for stealing my thunder (link to the cbc page where you got the quote from)... *kicks your shin* *wallks off*