Do socialists deserve to be in the military

[darkbeaver]

RE: Do socialists deserve

We don't have a soverign country anymore we are already just another state. Harper is the last step to full integration with Uncle Sam. We will become a fascist state just like them, if in fact it hasn't already happened.

 

[I think not]

Re: RE: Do socialists deserve

We don't have a soverign country anymore we are already just another state. Harper is the last step to full integration with Uncle Sam. We will become a fascist state just like them, if in fact it hasn't already happened.

The only way you will become a fascist state is if you lean more and more to the left, and you're right, it has already started happening.

 

[Finder]

Re: RE: Do socialists deserve

We don't have a soverign country anymore we are already just another state. Harper is the last step to full integration with Uncle Sam. We will become a fascist state just like them, if in fact it hasn't already happened.

The only way you will become a fascist state is if you lean more and more to the left, and you're right, it has already started happening.

Your totally right, by pushing for equal rights, a weak welfare state and a nation which looks after it's people we really are opening up those death camps.... gawd... the extreme right really bugs me at times.

 

[I think not]

Re: RE: Do socialists deserve

Your totally right, by pushing for equal rights, a weak welfare state and a nation which looks after it's people we really are opening up those death camps.... gawd... the extreme right really bugs me at times.

When someone makes a stupid comment, you should expect a stupid reply.

 

[Finder]

I think not, yes tit for tat seems to work very well in our world, but spreading stupity doesn't make you smart, it makes you stupid.

 

[Kreskin]

Isn't fascism about social and economic control? It cracks me up the the right point to social programs as if they're the creation of disease but they have no problem with a "lower taxes" leader who spends like a drunken sailor with borrowed money. The left can go overboard on taxes and programs. And both sides have their share of social meddling. You can take either the "it's my right to own a gun" platform or the "it's my right to have an abortion" platform. Either side is capable of expanding their social agendas to the extreme.

When someone is a wolf in sheeps clothing they can be either right or left and push things toward fascism imo.

 

[I think not]

You have to fight fire with fire, and you're neck deep in it, because you didn't jump on DB's comment of the US being fascist, but rather, when I made a comment that you hit your belief you jumped. You are already part of the game.

 

[Finder]

because it's more fun to pick on you "I think not". :twisted: You know I would have jumped on that if your comment hadn't had been so far out in right field (sorry actually just plain dumb) thaght it reached out of the screen and cried for a flame in return. 50% of the time you make pretty good sence... but the other 50% of the time, I wonder about you....

 

[Kreskin]

ITN, I just expressed my personal view that any side can act like fascists. Therefore I must be part of the fascist game?

 

[I think not]

because it's more fun to pick on you "I think not". :twisted: You know I would have jumped on that if your comment hadn't had been so far out in right field (sorry actually just plain dumb) thaght it reached out of the screen and cried for a flame in return. 50% of the time you make pretty good sence... but the other 50% of the time, I wonder about you....

Actually it's more fun to support your beliefs than mine is what you mean. And DB's comment was far out left field, but because you "lean" in that direction, you agreed with it with your silence. Had you been as balanced as you claim, you would not have tolerated far right or left comments.

P.S. If you wonder about me 50% of the time, then you're not as centrist as you think you are.

 

[I think not]

Re: RE: Do socialists deserve to be in the military

ITN, I just expressed my personal view that any side can act like fascists. Therefore I must be part of the fascist game?

It was meant for Finder, not you.

 

[Finder]

Oh yes Darkbeaver and I tend to agree on much (sarcasism).... You and DarkBeaver are much more closer then you and I my friend, or myself and Darkbeaver. Even the style of your posts are oddly simuler. You both try to post what you both believe are facts from other people and documents but end up posting doctrines, propaganda and believed myths.

In another thread I am actually defeanding the Conservatives as not being fascists and you can go find that active thread if you wish and post their if you have not already. I think I'm being pretty damned balanced in my views on this situation that neither conservatives nor Democrats are Facsists or Communists.


Kreskin, the extreme left has much in common with facsism but the prinicbles are much more different. True Stalinism killed millions. Untold millions we can never be sure on the actual number. They say anywhere from 2-40 million, thats how unsure they are, and unsure who is to blame. Stalinism was a great evil on this earth, in a sence just as bad as Hitler and facsism, but you have to Remember Stalin himself in practice followed his own type of personal communism. Out of the millions he murdered, many hundreds of thousands were communisms, socialists, social democrats and left-leaning liberals. He killed any threat from the left and the right and if you remember history when he was coming to power he switched from the left to the right to the centre of the party to eliminate his threats one by one until nobody was left but him and those who could not think for themselves.

Indeed in a sence the greatist foe of communism in the 20th centry was Stalin for many reasons, and one of the death nails to marxism is Stalins legacy. I highly doubt any communist thinker, Marx or Lenin and I can say with no doubt reading a lot of Engals writings, they would not have approved of Stalin nor would have thought of him as a communist.

But as I have always stated Communism in theory sounds like a Utopia to many, even in a sence to myself, but you can not make Utopia on earth, only a hell and the Soviet union showed us at times what happens when you try to make an absolute Utopia on earth. =-(

 

[I think not]

Oh yes Darkbeaver and I tend to agree on much (sarcasism).... You and DarkBeaver are much more closer then you and I my friend, or myself and Darkbeaver. Even the style of your posts are oddly simuler. You both try to post what you both believe are facts from other people and documents but end up posting doctrines, propaganda and believed myths.

Hahaha. OK. :lol:

 

[Finder]

man I really got to go over my posts, before I post. I'm like the king of typos.

 

[thecdn]

When I joined the military at 19 I was fairly conservative from a conservative family. My first (and only) reg force posting was to Calgary, where I stayed as a reservist. It doesn't get much more conservative than that.

Yet as I got older I became more left leaning. I look back at all the 'tree hugging bunny lovers' comments and slams against homosexuals that I might not have said, but never said anything against.

The military is overall a conservative institution, always has been and always will. But leftists can be and are part of the military. It is good for people of all persuasions to be part of an orgainzation to let others be exposed to different ideas and have something to think about.

 

[Kreskin]

Finder, isn't fascism the polar opposite of anarchy in some ways? Economic and social control to the extreme? Either side of the political spectrum can overstep their constitutional authority. No side is immune to a power grab by their leaders.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

Last election before the ads of the military by the Libs.

I heard 60% supported the Liberals, 20% NDP, and 20% COnservative. Now, I really don't know. I now an officer really likes the Liberals and a NCM likes the COns here. However, the NDP candidate won in my election so I don't know if some voted NDP. I did.

Where did you hear that? On YTV or CBC. The military supporting the Liberals after what has been done to them? Unlikely. Even laughable.

 

[Finder]

It's true I doubt those polls as well as I could only see a very fine minority in the military support the NDP and another bigger minority support the Liberals. When I was in the armed forces it was almost completely behind the conservative parties.


Anarchy or Libertairianism is on both sides of the left and the right.

this is just a very fast drawing of the political spec and I'm omitting many factions here to


Anarchism (Left)---- Communismism----Socialism----Social democracy----Liberalism----sonservatism---Fascism---Anarchism (Right)

Often the left Anarchists call themselves anarachists but sometimes call themselves libertarianists or social libertarians or socialist libertarianism. The Right Anarchists most often just call themselves libertarians.

Communism or ideologies solo based on Marxism often can get extremely authoritiarian, or totalitarian, as it is immpossible for the individuel to opt out of the social contract for lack of better terms in the western society that a Marxist world needs. One must be a member of the common collective for communism to work. anything out side of the common can not happen and is thus against the people. Marx heavly borrowed from many writters and the best one to read to understand about the absolute of the common good is Rousseau. Anarchists on the left hate in many ways communism for it's authority over people and the state it makes. Though in communist theory once capitalism has been eliminated from the world the state would disappear completely.

So in fact Communisms goal is the same as the extreme right (Right Libertairians) and Extreme Right, Anarchists, but have a methode of doing so which is totally different then their core belief of little to no government at all. It's confussing yes, but Marx's vision of Communism is somewhat convaluded by theories and economic myths.

 

[darkbeaver]

RE: Do socialists deserve

Canada used to be a centrist country, that has not been the case for quite some time now, we have seen steady erosion of social programs over the last twenty years and a steady increase in corporate neo-conservative values taking over the national agenda, this will and is widening the gap between rich and poor, creating a totalitarian capitalist state much like what exists in the States, the creation of the overclass is nearly complete there and is becoming so here, democracy is dying, it's just not good business.I would be happy with a centrist government and value system in Canada but we have to turn left to get there.

 

[darkbeaver]

because it's more fun to pick on you "I think not". :twisted: You know I would have jumped on that if your comment hadn't had been so far out in right field (sorry actually just plain dumb) thaght it reached out of the screen and cried for a flame in return. 50% of the time you make pretty good sence... but the other 50% of the time, I wonder about you....

Actually it's more fun to support your beliefs than mine is what you mean. And DB's comment was far out left field, but because you "lean" in that direction, you agreed with it with your silence. Had you been as balanced as you claim, you would not have tolerated far right or left comments.

P.S. If you wonder about me 50% of the time, then you're not as centrist as you think you are.

My comment was not from left field at all, far from it, your country is a (fascist military industrial complex) most of the world agrees with that characterization and a signifigant percentage of your own population.Your system is corrupted beyond repair and represents the gravest danger to democracy on the planet. You have a long proveable history of military conquest and resource theft of that there is no doubt. So for you to characterize my position as being from far left field is inncorrect just like most of your posts, which support the status-quo of regression.