Detroit Files for Bankruptcy

captain morgan

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I think it's funny how a lot of Evangelical Tea-Partyers waving the Ayn Rand flag don't know she was a hardcore athiest.

Only the most insecure devotees of the socialism-will-save-us-all cling to the notion that right-wingers or Tea-Party members are Evangelical and/or fundie Christians.

Get you head around the realities of this and you may be in a position to contribute something to the conversation that has any meaning
 

Machjo

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Oct 19, 2004
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I've always understood "free trade" to be a good thing, but from what I hear lately apparently not, but I'm not just sure of what the ramifications of it are. Doesn't "free trade" just mean no tariffs? Like I know years ago when I used to shop across the line I didn't pay duty on most things produced in North America. For me that was good.

I think some people confuse the principle of free trade with specificities in official agreements that have nothing to do with the principle of free trade per se.

But free trade is certainly good in principle.
 

BaalsTears

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Jan 25, 2011
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There is a readily available solution for all of the problems facing Detroit. The city should become part of Ontario, and the residents of Detroit can live off of the Canadian people. Problems solved.
 

Omicron

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There is a readily available solution for all of the problems facing Detroit. The city should become part of Ontario, and the residents of Detroit can live off of the Canadian people. Problems solved.

I guess that would solve the problem of Detrodians paddling accross the river to work as cheep labour insolong as they don't ask for heath-care.
 

JLM

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I guess that would solve the problem of Detrodians paddling accross the river to work as cheep labour insolong as they don't ask for heath-care.


We may as well keep them healthy, can't work as a cheap labourer if you're sick!
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Mar 18, 2013
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Thank you, Walmart, for once again disproving your own point. I said. . .

"Or that she collected Social Security."

And you said. . .

"As all American citizens do."

And now you're showing us the eligibility requirements for Social Security. So, there's two little problems with your statement:

1. If "all Americans" collect Social Security, why are there eligibility requirments, Walmart?

2. There's a difference between being eligible for Social Security and collecting it, not that I would expect you to understand that (or anything else).

So, care to modify your statement, Walmart? Do "all Americans" collect Social Security?

Boy, ya can't fix stupid. But you can laugh at it.
 

Chev

Electoral Member
Feb 10, 2009
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My understanding so far is they're in this position due to over spending and corruption.
Sounds exactly like Edmonton.. (some of) Our useless City Council and the Mayor... Mayor and his cronies 'want this and want that...' spending money we don't have.
 

Omicron

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Only the most insecure devotees of the socialism-will-save-us-all cling to the notion that right-wingers or Tea-Party members are Evangelical and/or fundie Christians.

Get you head around the realities of this and you may be in a position to contribute something to the conversation that has any meaning

I didn't say all right-wingers and Tea-Partiers are Evangelicals, but many of them are.

Most, but not all, canaries are yellow, but all things yellow are not canaries.

Ever studied set-theory?

I was pointing specifically to the sub-set of right-winger/Tea-Partiers who are Evangelical *and* who march to the tune of Ayn Rand who don't know she was a hard-core athiest (and who don't know she collected social-security, as another poster pointed out).

To me that's funny.

Hey, there is nothing new there, Walter, the exact same things have happened on a smaller scale in British Columbia in the past 40 years. Port Alberni and Trail being two examples.

Yup... BC has a long and enduring tradition of towns ghosting out:

List of ghost towns in British Columbia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

But a couple of things make the Detroit situation different.

First, those towns were virtually all resource based, so they *knew* they were going to ghost out some day, therefor the people were generally prepared to move on when the resources ran out. Detroit was not resource based... it was based on industry, which meant as long as they kept building things, the city should have endured forever.

But there's a second thing, which has Political Geographers paying very close attention, and it has to do with Detroit's size.

In Political Geography, one of the things they note is that in history, whenever a city exceeded a certain size - something around a million people - it would always endure no matter what happened to the nation-state within which is resided, and no matter the condition of its economy or the health of its citizens.

Something about getting people together in large-enough numbers created a sort of economic critical-mass where even if everyone had to change what they do for a living, and how they lived, and what they worshiped, etc., still, the city would endure.

To a Political Geographer, Rome, Paris, London, Berlin, Moscow etc. all have exceeded that critical mass, therefore there will always be a Rome, a Paris, a London, a Berlin, and a Moscow, etc.

Detroit was supposed to have exceeded that critical mass. At one point it was the fourth largest urban center in the US. Consequently, Political Geographers used to state with confidence that there would always be a Detroit, and some of them are starting to wonder if they're looking at a pardigm-shift.

But they still might turn out to be right. I saw a documentary about Detroit that was mostly focused on how so much of the economy of the people still there is based on the drug-trade, and along the way it mentioned a curious phenomena, which is that for some bizarre reason, po-white-trash from the deep-south are moving into Detroit to take up residence in abandoned homes, and are creating a new type of poor "urban-hipster" subculture in some parts of the city, all driven buy some sort of underground economy based on subsistance farming (which poor southern whites would have plenty of experience doing) on abandoned property, and with a sub-cultural "entertainment" theme based on consumption of N,N-Dimethyltryptamine (aka DMT), which produces an extreme hallucinogenic high that lasts only about 15 minutes.

It boggles my head to imagine how bad life in the deep-south would have to be to make living subsistance in Detroit an improvement, but who knows... the Political Geographers might be right... maybe there always will be a Detroit, in one form or another.
 

captain morgan

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I didn't say all right-wingers and Tea-Partiers are Evangelicals, but many of them are.

Many of them are atheists... So, that takes me back to your original statement and how broad (stereotypical) generalizations are a simple indication of lack of real knowledge on a subject

Most, but not all, canaries are yellow, but all things yellow are not canaries.

.. And all canaries die in mines that have high concentrations of methane

Ever studied set-theory?

Nope, and not interested... I do understand that it is not difficult to bend any theory to fit a preconceived outcome though

I was pointing specifically to the sub-set of right-winger/Tea-Partiers who are Evangelical *and* who march to the tune of Ayn Rand who don't know she was a hard-core athiest (and who don't know she collected social-security, as another poster pointed out).

Sure - keep telling yourself that
 

Omicron

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Many of them are atheists... So, that takes me back to your original statement and how broad (stereotypical) generalizations are a simple indication of lack of real knowledge on a subject

I wasn't generalizing. In fact, quite the opposite. I didn't say "all Tea-partiers are evangelicals"... I said "the evagelical tea-partiers", which means, the sub-set of tea-partiers who are evangelical.

.. And all canaries die in mines that have high concentrations of methane

And that's relevant to this discussion how?

Nope, and not interested... I do understand that it is not difficult to bend any theory to fit a preconceived outcome though

If you knew anything about set-theory you'd know that's not true. Part of the reason set-theory was invented was to nail the identification of properties down so they *can't* be misinterpreted by twisted theories.

Sure - keep telling yourself that

Telling myself what? That I think something is funny? I don't have to tell myself that something's funny when I think it's funny, because I already know it's funny.
 

captain morgan

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Mar 28, 2009
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I wasn't generalizing. In fact, quite the opposite. I didn't say "all Tea-partiers are evangelicals"... I said "the evagelical tea-partiers", which means, the sub-set of tea-partiers who are evangelical.

Whatever - Care to postulate on Muslim Tea-Baggers?

Yeah, doesn't support the stereotypical statement, therefore we shan't be expecting any depth of commentary anytime soon

And that's relevant to this discussion how?

Ya see - while you delineated the difference between yellow canaries and non-yellow canaries, I provided a common factual element accurate across sets of canaries that exist in mines.

So - to answer your question, my comment had as much to do with this discussion as did the original comment that not all canaries are yellow.

Follow?

If you knew anything about set-theory you'd know that's not true. Part of the reason set-theory was invented was to nail the identification of properties down so they *can't* be misinterpreted by twisted theories.

.. And who chooses what the parameters fro identification are to be?

Telling myself what?

Whatever it takes to help you sleep at night
 

coldstream

on dbl secret probation
Oct 19, 2005
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Hey, I'm happy to exclude the IMF, WTO, and World Bank if it means we also get to tell the Catholic Church to eff off

The particular bible-bashers who ran my school weren't Catholic, but the harm the Catholic church has done to Indians (and its own members) is horrific.

To your first point, that does not make you anything special. That is exactly what the rest of the World.. but especially the West has told the Catholic Church to do. It has decisively cast off the burdens of faith and Christianity to embrace a culture of prurient gratification.. sacrificing such structural cornerstones as marriage and the unborn to its new alter. I have predicted this will not produce the 'freedom' and 'equality'.. on which its simplistic sophistry is based.. but a cult of darkness and death. It might be centuries before the Light returns.

As to the second, i would refer you the story of St. Kateri Tekakwitha .. the Lily of Mohawks, patron of the aboriginal peoples of North America.. which the best of the Catholic Church represents. You can certainly find examples of horrible acts perpetrated in the guise of the RCC.. which were conducted by frauds.. who were not acting as Surrogates of Christ.. as is required of all priests, but of their OWN debased motives and appetites. I've never denied that Catholic Church is rife with human frailities.. it is its Mystical Body.. not its human element that is perfect.
 
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Tecumsehsbones

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To your first point, that does not make you anything special. That is exactly what the rest of the World.. but especially the West has told the Catholic Church to do. It has decisively cast off the burdens of faith and Christianity to embrace a culture of prurient gratification.. sacrificing such structural cornerstones as marriage and the unborn to its new alter. I have predicted this will not produce the 'freedom' and 'equality'.. on which its simplistic sophistry is based.. but a cult of darkness and death. It might be centuries before the Light returns.
You should approve. Is the Catholic church not an international organisation? And were you not arguing that the nation-state is the sole unit for the good of Da Peeple?

As to the second, i would refer you the story of St. Kateri Tekakwitha .. the Lily of Mohawks, patron of the aboriginal peoples of North America.. which the best of the Catholic Church represents. You can certainly find examples of horrible acts perpetrated in the guise of the RCC.. which were conducted by frauds.. who were not acting as Surrogates of Christ.. as is required of all priests, but of their OWN debased motives. I've never denied that Catholic Church is rife with human frailities.. it is its Mystical Body.. not its human element that is perfect.
And perpetrated by its officials, with the knowledge, approval, and cover-up of the heirarchy.
 

coldstream

on dbl secret probation
Oct 19, 2005
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You should approve. Is the Catholic church not an international organisation? And were you not arguing that the nation-state is the sole unit for the good of Da Peeple?


And perpetrated by its officials, with the knowledge, approval, and cover-up of the heirarchy.

You'll certainly have no trouble finding atrocities committed by the First Nations before and after the arrival of Europeans. The politically correct picture of a pristine, peaceful eco utopia of the Americas, belies the predominance of ritualistic pagan blood cults of human sacrifice, of the mass die offs from disease and famine which are the lot of the hunter gatherer societies, and of constant warfare. So there's enough blame to go around.

In honesty it looks like the West.. without Christianity.. is returning to these roots.
 
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Mowich

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Dec 25, 2005
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Board OKs new Red Wings arena

LANSING, Mich. -- A state board on Wednesday unanimously gave the go-ahead for a new Red Wings hockey arena in downtown Detroit to be paid for in part with $284 million in tax dollars even as the broke city works through bankruptcy proceedings.


Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder and others defended against criticism that the $650 million project should be financed entirely with private money because the city currently can't provide basic services and retirees are facing cuts in their pensions. The 18,000-seat arena is designed to be a catalyst for more development and to link downtown and midtown, turning a blighted area into a business, residential and entertainment district.


"This is part of investing in Detroit's future," said Snyder, a Republican who blessed a state-appointed emergency manager's request to take the city into bankruptcy last week. "That's the message we need to get across. ... As we stabilize the city government's finances, as we address those issues and improve services, Detroit moves from a place where people might have had a negative impression -- although there are great things already going on -- to being a place that will be recognized across the world as a place of great value and a place to invest."


Michigan board OKs new Red Wings arena in Detroit - ESPN