Death knell for AGW

[EagleSmack]

Delicious.

Agreed. However this date will go by with little fanfare and without an admission of being wrong.

Alarmists have learned from these short apocalyptic predictions. Now they are pushing the dates out to 100s of years and attacking with just as much fervor.

 

[petros]

The sky is falling!

 

[Walter]

The sky is falling!

Rain or snow?

 

[petros]

Rain or snow?

Fog.

Date Recorded Location Temperature
July 5, 1937 Midale, Saskatchewan 45.0 °C
July 5, 1937 Yellow Grass, Saskatchewan 45.0 °C
July 11, 1936 St. Albans, Manitoba 44.4 °C
July 11, 1936 Emerson, Manitoba 44.4 °C
July 5, 1937 Fort Qu'Appelle, Saskatchewan 44.4 °C
July 16, 1941 Lillooet, British Columbia 44.4 °C
July 16, 1941 Lytton, British Columbia 44.4 °C
July 17, 1941 Lillooet, British Columbia 44.4 °C
July 17, 1941 Lytton, British Columbia 44.4 °C
July 17, 1941 Chinook Cove, British Columbia 44.4 °C
July 29, 1934 Rock Creek, British Columbia 43.9 °C
July 5, 1936 Midale, Saskatchewan 43.9 °C
July 11, 1936 Emerson, Manitoba 43.9 °C
July 11, 1936 Morden, Manitoba 43.9 °C
July 4, 1937 Rosetown, Saskatchewan 43.9 °C
July 5, 1937 Regina, Saskatchewan 43.9 °C
July 16, 1941 Oliver, British Columbia 43.9 °C
June 23, 1900 Cannington, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
June 25, 1919 Dauphin, Manitoba 43.3 °C
July 31, 1926 Fort Qu'Appelle, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 24, 1927 Greenwood, British Columbia 43.3 °C
July 25, 1931 Fort Qu'Appelle, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 5, 1936 Estevan, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 7, 1936 Emerson, Manitoba 43.3 °C
July 11, 1936 Waskada, Manitoba 43.3 °C
July 11, 1936 Virden, Manitoba 43.3 °C
July 11, 1936 Brandon, Manitoba 43.3 °C
July 11, 1936 Greenfell, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 5, 1937 Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 5, 1937 Grenfell, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 5, 1937 Francis, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 5, 1937 Regina, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 5, 1937 Estevan, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 5, 1937 Carlyle, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 12, 1937 Regina, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 27, 1939 Oliver, British Columbia 43.3 °C
July 17, 1941 Oliver, British Columbia 43.3 °C
July 17, 1941 Skagit River, British Columbia 43.3 °C
July 19, 1941 Elbow, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 19, 1941 Lumsden, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
August 6, 1949 Rosetown, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C
July 19, 1960 Newgate, British Columbia 43.3 °C
August 5, 1961 Maple Creek, Saskatchewan 43.3 °C


Is Canada part of the Globe? Why haven't we seen any records broken from over a minimum of 53 years ago? Warming makes it cooler? Did CO2 cause all those record temps that haven't been broken?

 

[Zipperfish]

Dipsh-t. 1934 was a record smasher GLOBALLY!

If you are going to provide evidence to that effect, you should then present global data, not just data from the continental US.

http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/tabledata_v3/GLB.Ts+dSST.txt

Data from NASA GISS disagrees with your claim. 1934 isn't even in the top ten for NASA or NOAA global records.

 

[petros]

If you are going to provide evidence to that effect, you should then present global data, not just data from the continental US.

http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/tabledata_v3/GLB.Ts+dSST.txt

Data from NASA GISS disagrees with your claim. 1934 isn't even in the top ten for NASA or NOAA global records.

Proxies? Riiiiiight proxies aren't jiving with actual records. Why not?

 

[Zipperfish]

Proxies? Riiiiiight proxies aren't jiving with actual records. Why not?

They aren't proxies. That's the instrumental temperature record. 0 for 2 so far.

 

[captain morgan]

They aren't proxies. That's the instrumental temperature record. 0 for 2 so far.

Time frame that they use is far too short to extrapolate.

Further, there are accusations that the raw data has 'changed' (for lack of a better word) in the last years to fit projections

 

[petros]

Empirical evidence does not lend much support to the notion that climate is headed precipitately toward more extreme heat and drought. - James Hansen August 1999

 

[captain morgan]

Any solid, empirical evidence heavily supports natural causation for so-called climate change.

To this day, no one is able to provide a reasonable definition of climate change as it (directly) relates to anthro sources AND would merit any force in supporting that ends.

 

[petros]

Any solid, empirical evidence heavily supports natural causation for so-called climate change.

To this day, no one is able to provide a reasonable definition of climate change as it (directly) relates to anthro sources AND would merit any force in supporting that ends.

But but but some goof on TV said so.

Good thing proxies aren't used in sh-t plant analytics.

 

[Zipperfish]

But but but some goof on TV said so.

Good thing proxies aren't used in sh-t plant analytics.

The numbers I linked to aren't proxies. That is the instrumental temperature record. Proxies refer to inferring temperature based on on other data sets such as tree rings or ice core data.

Time frame that they use is far too short to extrapolate.

Further, there are accusations that the raw data has 'changed' (for lack of a better word) in the last years to fit projections

I'm not extrapolating. I'm saying that you can't use the US temperature record to directly infer the global temperature record. If inceed the data are "changed" then there's no case that 1934 was the hottest year, since that assertion is based on temperature records.

 

[petros]

Cores and rings are paleoproxies.

Are you claiming it wasn't a record smasher in North Africa, Southern Europe,and Eurasia as well as continental US? In Canada it was 1937. Have we came close to breaking Canadian records from 80+ years ago?

Yes or no?

Was it CO2 that caused those records?

Yes or no.

 

[captain morgan]

I'm not extrapolating. I'm saying that you can't use the US temperature record to directly infer the global temperature record. If inceed the data are "changed" then there's no case that 1934 was the hottest year, since that assertion is based on temperature records.

Geologic cycles aren't measured in decades or centuries.

Having a hundred years or so of data, from a small number of locations relying on varying technologies is not a strong foundation to start making statements about 'new records'.

I needn't remind you that much of NorAm was covered with a 1 kn thick glacier on more than one occasion

Cores and rings are paleoproxies.

Are you claiming it wasn't a record smasher in North Africa, Southern Europe,and Eurasia as well as continental US? In Canada it was 1937. Have we came close to breaking Canadian records from 80+ years ago?

Yes or no?

Was it CO2 that caused those records?

Yes or no.

Those are awfully inconvenient questions Petros... Damned inconvenient actually

 

[petros]

Only inconvenient if you are an alarmist.


For Eastern US 1934 was a record cold winter. Some of them finally fell last winter. Think how much higher the average for 34 would have been if the winter were within norms.

Middle left is 1934 GLOBAL temps. Why is it all pink or dark pink? Boob cancer donations per capita?

 

[Zipperfish]

Cores and rings are paleoproxies.

Are you claiming it wasn't a record smasher in North Africa, Southern Europe,and Eurasia as well as continental US? In Canada it was 1937. Have we came close to breaking Canadian records from 80+ years ago?

What I'm claiming is very simple. Firstly, that the continental US temperature is not necessarily indicative of the global temperature in any given year, secondly that the data set I linked to is comprised of the instrumental temperature record, not proxies and thirdly, that according to the global instrumental temperature record 1934 was not the hottest year on record.

Geologic cycles aren't measured in decades or centuries.

I've never said otherwise.

Having a hundred years or so of data, from a small number of locations relying
on varying technologies is not a strong foundation to start making statements
about 'new records'.

It is if the record you are talking about is over the span of a hundred years or so.

I needn't remind you that much of NorAm was covered with a 1 kn thick glacier on
more than one occasion

I've never said otherwise.




Those are awfully inconvenient questions Petros... Damned inconvenient actually[/QUOTE]

Only inconvenient if you are an alarmist.


For Eastern US 1934 was a record cold winter. Some of them finally fell last winter. Think how much higher the average for 34 would have been if the winter were within norms.

Middle left is 1934 GLOBAL temps. Why is it all pink or dark pink? Boob cancer donations per capita?

Middle left is 1934? Really, because I can't read anything on that map.

 

[petros]

It is indeed 1934 GLOBAL temperatures.

 

[captain morgan]

What I'm claiming is very simple. Firstly, that the continental US temperature is not necessarily indicative of the global temperature in any given year, secondly that the data set I linked to is comprised of the instrumental temperature record, not proxies and thirdly, that according to the global instrumental temperature record 1934 was not the hottest year on record.



I've never said otherwise.



It is if the record you are talking about is over the span of a hundred years or so.



I've never said otherwise.

So basically, there is no support then for any anthro argument in terms of climate change (again, not having any form of functional definition as it relates to anthro causation).

Is that pretty much your message then?

 

[petros]

They even had alarmists 80 years ago discussing GLOBAL warming.

 

[Zipperfish]

So basically, there is no support then for any anthro argument in terms of climate change (again, not having any form of functional definition as it relates to anthro causation).

Is that pretty much your message then?

No. That's not my message.

My message is that:
(a) continental US temperature is not necessarily indicatiove of global temperatures in any given year,
(b) the temperature data set I linked to consists of the instrumental temperature record, not proxies, and
(c) according to the instrumental data records (for both NASA and NOAA) 1934 was not the warmest year on record globally. Not even top ten in either case.

It is indeed 1934 GLOBAL temperatures.

Well, can I see the one for 1998 or 2010, to compare?