Damn Yankees Trying to Steal our Victory in 1812

[EagleSmack]

There is much debate as to who won and lost the War of 1812. While most believe that the British won and the United States lost the war, there is even debate among those who answered this question. Below are the full arguments on both sides.
The British won due to the fact that they completed their objectives; defend Canada by killing the Americans who tried to invade.
American Deaths:11,300 killed, wounded or missing in action.

While most? Most who? Most British?

If defending Canada was the oblective... what were they doing in the Chesapeake, New York, Michigan Territories, and of all places New Orleans, Louisiana! Check a map Juan.

And when was the first or is this a typo? The Americans pretty much left "New France" and upper Canada alone during their revolution. There were incursions later, like the Feenians, but those weren't U.S. gov't supported and in some cases were actively opposed by US forces.

And heck... Confederates invaded Vermont from Canada... I guess the US beat Canada in the US Civil War. How absurd.

 

[petros]

This is like trying to claim a victory in the War On Drugs.

 

[CDNBear]

Hardly a draw. The British lost 8600 men while the Americans lost 11,300 men(killed or missing)
and the land that was invaded was taked back. By the way, Canada was British in those days.

That's right, Canada didn't exist. Stop being Nationalistic. It's one of the things you like to bitch and complain about Americans for.

You REALLY need to read history again. Canada as a country did not exist in 1812. it was considered to be a part of Great Britain.

The United States did NOT declare war against Canada, because Canada was just a colony of the mother country. They declared war against Great Britain (with damn good reason), and neither side won or lost, it was a stalemate. The treaty that was signed specifically outlawed the practice that Great Britain had been engaging in, so in one sense, the Americans got what they wanted.

The British had been stopping American ships and impressing sailors into the Royal Navy. In effect, they were kidnapping U.S. citizens at gunpoint. That was certainly worth going to war about, and Great Britain agreed to stop that practice in the treaty that ended the war.

Spelling aside, that's where your knowledge of the event ends.

Yes, Canada was invaded by a very small force of Americans. And that force was defeated, because it was outnumbered about 5 to 1 by the BRITISH settlers.

Native, Voyageurs, and Metis as well.

For someone that keeps claiming to be Metis and all knowing, you sure do make an awful lot of errors. Especially troubling when they are in regards to something you make steadfast claims of expertise.

I don't agree. It wasn't a draw.

That's because you're a nationalist.

 

[ironsides]

Prior to the war of 1812 starting, the United States had no desire to take Upper Canada, we were all friends on the border (the people there traded with each other more than they did with their countries).



Since the Treaty of Ghent (Status quo ante bellum) was signed before "The Battle of New Orleans", how come the treaty terms were so generous if the British Empire did so well during the war? ( this is a serious question, I never could figure out why.)

 

[CDNBear]

Since the Treaty of Ghent (Status quo ante bellum) was signed before "The Battle of New Orleans", how come the treaty terms were so generous if the British Empire did so well during the war? ( this is a serious question, I never could figure out why.)

Shush silly Murican!!! Occam's razor means nothing to nationalists.

 

[ironsides]

Shush silly Murican!!! Occam's razor means nothing to nationalists.

:lol::lol:

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[EagleSmack]

Since the Treaty of Ghent (Status quo ante bellum) was signed before "The Battle of New Orleans", how come the treaty terms were so generous if the British Empire did so well during the war? ( this is a serious question, I never could figure out why.)

Well as the Duke of Wellington said...

"I think you have no right, from the state of war, to demand any concession of territory from America ... You have not been able to carry it into the enemy's territory, notwithstanding your military success and now undoubted military superiority, and have not even cleared your own territory on the point of attack. You can not on any principle of equality in negotiation claim a cessation of territory except in exchange for other advantages which you have in your power ... Then if this reasoning be true, why stipulate for the uti possidetis? You can get no territory: indeed, the state of your military operations, however creditable, does not entitle you to demand any."

In other words... a draw.

 

[CDNBear]

Well as the Duke of Wellington said...

"I think you have no right, from the state of war, to demand any concession of territory from America ... You have not been able to carry it into the enemy's territory, notwithstanding your military success and now undoubted military superiority, and have not even cleared your own territory on the point of attack. You can not on any principle of equality in negotiation claim a cessation of territory except in exchange for other advantages which you have in your power ... Then if this reasoning be true, why stipulate for the uti possidetis? You can get no territory: indeed, the state of your military operations, however creditable, does not entitle you to demand any."

In other words... a draw.

Another silly Murican.

Since when did facts matter to nationalists?

 

[EagleSmack]

There is much debate as to who won and lost the War of 1812. While most believe that the British won and the United States lost the war, there is even debate among those who answered this question. Below are the full arguments on both sides.

Upon further research....

By the 21st century it was a forgotten war in the U.S., Britain and Quebec, although still remembered in the rest of Canada, especially Ontario. In a 2009 poll, 37% of Canadians said the war was a Canadian victory, 9% said the U.S. won, 15% called it a draw, and 39%—mainly younger Canadians—said they knew too little to comment.

37%=Most?

But hey Juan... keep teaching them the way you want and perhaps you'll somehow make up the few percentage points needed... at least in Canada.

 

[Bar Sinister]

And when was the first or is this a typo? The Americans pretty much left "New France" and upper Canada alone during their revolution. There were incursions later, like the Feenians, but those weren't U.S. gov't supported and in some cases were actively opposed by US forces.

The first invasion of Canada by a force considered to be American occurred during the first year of the Revolutionary War when a force led by generals Montgomery and Arnold (yes that Arnold) attempted to capture what is now the province of Quebec. The invasion was at first successful, but turned into a disaster at Quebec and was hampered by the expiration of enlistments, leading to large numbers of Americans going home. The arrival of British reinforcements led to a complete withdrawal of the remaining American forces. After that Canada was pretty much left alone for the remaining seven years of the war.

Invasion of Canada (1775) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[petros]

The damn Yankees also lost to Detroit with support of oodles of fans from Sandwich.