Call for a Peaceful End to Zionism

[Erik]

palestine not only to muslims !

Must a person be a muslim to be considered a palestinian, does he have to believe in mohamad ??? or can he belong to other faiths as well like: druze, christians, jews. why have the muslims taken a monopolly on the name palestinian, while the palestinian druze,christians,and jews not ? why are the palestinian druze waging war against muslim palestinians and not the jews ? are you so sure this is an arab israeli situation or rather a muslim vs' non-muslim world situation. are palestinian jews not arabic speaking, are iraqi jews not arabic jews? to be a canadian must one convert to christianity? so why palestinian is only the muslim kind ?????????????? why is east-palestine called now "jordan" (named after a river) and not palestine? why the name change, why? are the arabs in the west-bank a different racial group then those across the river jordan??? why do they deserve a special status, as "palestinians" as if those on the east-bank are not palestinians, or is this a muslim hoax and conspiracy. palestine is a geographical word like levantine, it is not an ethnic group different from others, it includes all faiths !!! but the muslims would have you think otherwise. you should read "the protocolls of the elders of mecca" , not zion.

 

[earth_as_one]

"....Israel has committed war crimes and crimes against humanity" as has everyone else in the neighborhood. So?
I think what would be fair would be to let the people in that neighborhood sort out what is fair and everyone else mind their own biz.

All should be held accountable for their crimes. No nation is above international laws it agreed to in international treaties and conventions when it comes to international relations. People forget that those laws, treaties, conventions were put in place as a result of the consequences of international lawlessness. Need we repeat past mistakes?

What Israel does to Palestinians is no better than what Nazi Germany did to Jews. How long before Zionsists come to the conclusion that extermination is the only solution to the Palestinian refugee problem... Seems to me they've already past that line, they just haven't announced it.

Watch this video and you'll understand:

Gaza After Disengagement

 

[Zzarchov]

Well earth as one, the "4 million descendants" are entitled to Jack Squat.

Your own resolution you wave around points that out. They never lived in Palestine, they can never return to where they have never been.

They are Jordanian, as they were when they lived in the Palestinian territory OF JORDAN.

Jordan started a war, Jordan lost a war. If Palestine is ever abandoned by Israel, it goes back to Jordan.

Any children of Jewish settlers born in Palestine are Palestinians and have more claim to the land than "descendants" of Jordanian Palestinines that live in Jordan.


I know its Illegal for you to take another stance other than "Israel is wrong" and I don't want to get you thrown in Jail, but it may be better just not to involve yourself in threads like this at all.

 

[CDNBear]

Must a person be a muslim to be considered a palestinian does he have to believe in mohamad ??? or can he belong to other faiths as well like: druze, christians, jews. why have the muslims taken a monopolly on the name palestinian, while the palestinian druze,christians,and jews not ? why are the palestinian druze waging war against muslim palestinians and not the jews ? are you so sure this is an arab israeli situation or rather a muslim to non-muslim world situation. are palestinian jews not arabic speaking, are iraqi jews not arabic jews? to be a canadian must one convert to christianity? so why palestinian is only the muslim kind ?????????????? why is east-palestine called now "jordan" (named after a river) and not palestine? why the name change, why? are the arabs in the west-bank a different racial group then those across the river jordan??? why do they deserve a special status, as "palestinians" as if those on the east-bank are not palestinians, or is this a muslim hoax and conspiracy. palestine is a geographical word like levantine, it is not an ethnic group different from others, it includes all faiths !!! but the muslims would have you think otherwise. you should read "the protocolls of the elders of mecca" , not zion.

Good points and questions Erik...

Read this...
http://forums.canadiancontent.net/history/55217-history-israel-palestine.html

All should be held accountable for their crimes. No nation is above international laws it agreed to in international treaties and conventions when it comes to international relations. People forget that those laws, treaties, conventions were put in place as a result of the consequences of international lawlessness. Need we repeat past mistakes?

What Israel does to Palestinians is no better than what Nazi Germany did to Jews. How long before Zionsists come to the conclusion that extermination is the only solution to the Palestinian refugee problem... Seems to me they've already past that line, they just haven't announced it.

Watch this video and you'll understand:

Gaza After Disengagement

Here earth, read this...
http://forums.canadiancontent.net/history/55217-history-israel-palestine.html

 

[CDNBear]

Hey earth, read this while you're at it...

http://forums.canadiancontent.net/history/55342-nazi-roots-hatred-arab-world.html

 

[earth_as_one]

Am I the only one here capable of backing up my points with references to reputable sources like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, the BBC, the UN... No one else here seems able to do this.

 

[CDNBear]

Am I the only one here capable of backing up my points with references to reputable sources like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, the BBC, the UN... No one else here seems able to do this.

Am I the only one that can back up my claims that these organizations have expressed a bias towords Israel, CONSISTANTLY ignoring the actions of the likes of the HEZBOLLAH and HAMAS???!!!

No one here is desputing the atrocities of Israels indiscriminat targeting and such, but you can not back up your claims this is some sort of Zionist genocidal conspiracy, while you ignore history and the fact that there is no such thing as a Palestinian. In fact I have posted the history of the region, the Israelis are the ones that built it. Not the Arabs...

From 1517-1917 Turkey's Ottoman Empirecontrolled a vast Arab empire, a portion of which is today Lebanon, Syria, and During World War I (1914-191, Turkey supported Germany. When Germany was defeated, so were the Turks. In 1916 control of the southern portion of their Ottoman Empire was "mandated" to France and Britain under the Sykes-Picot Agreement, which divided the Arab region into zones of influence. Lebanon and Syria were assigned (mandated) to France... and "Palestine" (today's Jordan, Israel and "West Bank") was mandated to Great Britain. Because no other peoples had ever established a national homeland in "Palestine" since the Jews had done it 2,000 years before, the British "looked favorably" upon the creation of a Jewish National Homeland throughout ALL of Palestine. The Jews had already begun mass immigration into Palestine in the 1880's in an effort to rid the land of swamps and malaria and prepare for the rebirth of Israel. This Jewish effort to revitalize the land attracted an equally large immigration of Arabs from neighboring areas who were drawn by employment opportunities and healthier living conditions. There was never any attempt to "rid" the area of what few Arabs there or those Arab masses that immigrated into this area along with the Jews!

Yes the Israeli's have done wrong, great we all get that. But they are just as entitled to the land as anyone else. As soon as you and the asshats that want Israel to vapourize relize that, the better off we all will be.

Your a nazi party booster if you keep defending the actions of the Hezbollah and Hamas. Do I need to post more proof of that to. ie historically documented minutes of meetings between the Arab leaders and Hitler...

http://forums.canadiancontent.net/history/55342-nazi-roots-hatred-arab-world.html

 

[Sassylassie]

Funny Earth quotes organizations that are rampart with corruption and are special interest groups that are funded by like minded people. Do you really think there reports are unbiased Earth, the majority of the UN is made up of countries like Iran in that case a religious nut job or have dictators that brain wash and control their people with an iron will. If you do indeed live in Iran I doubt you have ever heard or read anything that wasn't goverment sanctioned.

 

[Erik]

Druze not jews.

Did you know that the top warriors in the israeli army are the arabs of the druze faith, they are the one's serving in the territories, they are well versed in arabic and they hate their muslim cousins. so you see it's not jews against arabs. it's non-muslims vs' world jihad !!!

 

[L Gilbert]

Watch this video and you'll understand:

Gaza After Disengagement
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5V7nKCfr7k

Why? Who sys I don't understand?

 

[L Gilbert]

Did you know that the top warriors in the israeli army are the arabs of the druze faith, they are the one's serving in the territories, they are well versed in arabic and they hate their muslim cousins. so you see it's not jews against arabs. it's non-muslims vs' world jihad !!!

Yeah, some people think that all Israeli = Jew.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Israel

http://lexicorient.com/e.o/israel_4.htm

https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/print/is.html

 

[CDNBear]

Some people also think they know what the heck they are talking about, but then they defend the nazi parties like the Hezbollah,PA, Hamas etc, and prove they don't, when they say that these organizations are not the direct decendents of an Arab/nazi colaberation.

They also prove that they have no clues, when they dismiss the history of the area, for the rewritten Arab version. Which is fully of more holes then a wheel of swiss.

 

[CDNBear]

Sig Heil!!!

This salute was hijacked from the Six Nations or Romans (I can't remember which), by Adulph, then passed on to the next Reicht, the Muslim Brotherhood and if you follow the followers, it leads you to the heart of the anti Israeli crowd.


Need I say more???

 

[CDNBear]

"The Arabs appropriated anti-Semitic ideology directly from the Nazis and have recycled it ever since. In the 1950s, the Baathist parties in Syria and Iraq modelled themselves on Hitler's heady brew of nationalism and socialism. Charismatic dictators from Nasser and Gaddafi to Saddam Hussein and Yasser Arafat turned themselves into little Hitlers, weaving anti-Semitism into their political agendas. However, the Nazi connection is usually mentioned by Arab nationalists and Islamists sotto voce, because they constantly identify Zionism with Nazism in their propaganda."

I like this quote from Daniel Johnson, The New York Sun

 

[Zzarchov]

Am I the only one here capable of backing up my points with references to reputable sources like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, the BBC, the UN... No one else here seems able to do this.

Other people have backed up their sources too, you just ignore them. No one is saying Israel is clean as a saint. But saying you should set a cannabalistic paedophile free because his jailer commits spousal abuse isn't a form of fair logic.

Israel has some ammends to make, Its neighbours have far more.

 

[L Gilbert]

All should be held accountable for their crimes. No nation is above international laws it agreed to in international treaties and conventions when it comes to international relations. People forget that those laws, treaties, conventions were put in place as a result of the consequences of international lawlessness. Need we repeat past mistakes?

No $h|te, Sherlock. But in that particular set of circumstances, Isreal is dishing back what it has gone through. There are a few of its neighbors that think nothing of taking pot shots at Israel to get a rise out of it. They're constantly being harassed by someone over there. Then there's Iran who wants to do little else but wipe Israel and its people off the map. You are ranting as if everything is on Israel. I have news for you, it isn't. It's a two-way street. IMO, if it doesn't involve any other countries (for example some Israeli missile meant for Lebanon accidently wanders off and hits Borneo, or some Hezbollah anti-tank rocket hits a restaurant in Buenos Aires) then the other countries should bloody well butt out.

What Israel does to Palestinians is no better than what Nazi Germany did to Jews. How long before Zionsists come to the conclusion that extermination is the only solution to the Palestinian refugee problem... Seems to me they've already past that line, they just haven't announced it.

But it's ok if Syrians or Irani or Palestines subject Israelis to attack? Get a grip.

And I didn't watch your video because there are just as many showing the reverse. As I said, it's a two-way street and the onus is not all on Israel.

 

[L Gilbert]

Funny Earth quotes organizations that are rampart with corruption and are special interest groups that are funded by like minded people. Do you really think there reports are unbiased Earth, the majority of the UN is made up of countries like Iran in that case a religious nut job or have dictators that brain wash and control their people with an iron will. If you do indeed live in Iran I doubt you have ever heard or read anything that wasn't goverment sanctioned.

Right on Sass and Bear.

 

[earth_as_one]

Israel is just dishing out what it gets? You must be kidding.

How many Israel homes have been demolished by Palestinians?
This is a link to an Israeli source:
http://www.btselem.org/english/Publications/Summaries/200411_Punitive_House_Demolitions.asp




How many Palestinian only settlements have been built on land confiscated from Israelis?

Same Israeli source:
http://www.btselem.org/English/Publications/Summaries/200205_Land_Grab.asp

My source is B'TSELEM

The Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories was established in 1989 by a group of prominent academics, attorneys, journalists, and Knesset members. It endeavors to document and educate the Israeli public and policymakers about human rights violations in the Occupied Territories, combat the phenomenon of denial prevalent among the Israeli public, and help create a human rights culture in Israel.

Denial of what is going on in Palestine is also prevalent in North America.

Palestinians under Israeli occupation are far worse off than blacks were in South Africa under Apartheid.

Apartheid means having limited or no citizenship rights, segregation, arbitrary detentions, collective punishment, and other injustices based on race, nationality, ethnicity, or religion. That describes the Palestinian condition as much as it describes Apartheid in South Africa.

When anti-Apartheid activists Archbishop Desmond Tutu visited Palestine, he recognized what he saw. Here is what he had to say:

Apartheid in the Holy Land

[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Desmond Tutu
Monday April 29, 2002
The Guardian [/FONT]

In our struggle against apartheid, the great supporters were Jewish people. They almost instinctively had to be on the side of the disenfranchised, of the voiceless ones, fighting injustice, oppression and evil. I have continued to feel strongly with the Jews. I am patron of a Holocaust centre in South Africa. I believe Israel has a right to secure borders.

What is not so understandable, not justified, is what it did to another people to guarantee its existence. I've been very deeply distressed in my visit to the Holy Land; it reminded me so much of what happened to us black people in South Africa. I have seen the humiliation of the Palestinians at checkpoints and roadblocks, suffering like us when young white police officers prevented us from moving about.
On one of my visits to the Holy Land I drove to a church with the Anglican bishop in Jerusalem. I could hear tears in his voice as he pointed to Jewish settlements. I thought of the desire of Israelis for security. But what of the Palestinians who have lost their land and homes?
I have experienced Palestinians pointing to what were their homes, now occupied by Jewish Israelis. I was walking with Canon Naim Ateek (the head of the Sabeel Ecumenical Centre) in Jerusalem. He pointed and said: "Our home was over there. We were driven out of our home; it is now occupied by Israeli Jews."
My heart aches. I say why are our memories so short. Have our Jewish sisters and brothers forgotten their humiliation? Have they forgotten the collective punishment, the home demolitions, in their own history so soon? Have they turned their backs on their profound and noble religious traditions? Have they forgotten that God cares deeply about the downtrodden?
Israel will never get true security and safety through oppressing another people. A true peace can ultimately be built only on justice. We condemn the violence of suicide bombers, and we condemn the corruption of young minds taught hatred; but we also condemn the violence of military incursions in the occupied lands, and the inhumanity that won't let ambulances reach the injured.
The military action of recent days, I predict with certainty, will not provide the security and peace Israelis want; it will only intensify the hatred.
Israel has three options: revert to the previous stalemated situation; exterminate all Palestinians; or - I hope - to strive for peace based on justice, based on withdrawal from all the occupied territories, and the establishment of a viable Palestinian state on those territories side by side with Israel, both with secure borders. We in South Africa had a relatively peaceful transition. If our madness could end as it did, it must be possible to do the same everywhere else in the world. If peace could come to South Africa, surely it can come to the Holy Land?...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/comment/0,10551,706911,00.html

Recently, former US President Jimmy Carter wrote a book about the daily oppression and injustice suffered by Palestinians:

Former U.S. President Jimmy Carter is accusing Israel of creating an apartheid system in the West Bank and Gaza. The charge comes in his new book "Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid."


The Nobel Peace Prize winner has been deeply involved in Middle East policies for the past three decades. As president he negotiated the Camp David Accords - which secured a lasting peace between Israel and Egypt.

In his new book, Jimmy Carter writes, "Israel's continued control and colonization of Palestinian land have been the primary obstacles to a comprehensive peace agreement in the Holy Land."
Carter criticizes Israel for building what he describes as an imprisonment wall through the West Bank. He accuses Israel of strangling the residents of Gaza where the poverty rate has reached 70 percent and where the malnutrition rate mirrors countries in Sub-Saharan Africa. And Carter is critical of Washington's role. He writes, "The United States is squandering international prestige and goodwill and intensifying global anti-American terrorism by unofficially condoning or abetting the Israeli confiscation and colonization of Palestinian territories."...

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/11/30/1452225

Here is what John Dugard, South African law professor and Special Rapporteur (reporter) on Palestine to the United Nations Human Rights Council has to say about Carter's book.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]By John Dugard[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]01 December, 2006
Countercurrents.org[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]n principle, the purpose of military occupation is Former President Jimmy Carter's new book, "Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid," is igniting controversy for its allegation that Israel practices a form of apartheid. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]As a South African and former anti-apartheid advocate who visits the Palestinian territories regularly to assess the human rights situation for the U.N. Human Rights Council, the comparison to South African apartheid is of special interest to me...[/FONT]

The rest here:
http://www.countercurrents.org/pa-dugard011206.htm

[/FONT]

President Carter can see it. Archbishop Tutu can see it. How is it, so many here cannot?

 

[L Gilbert]

Israel is just dishing out what it gets? You must be kidding.

Perhaps if you'd climb out from behind the pinhole you're looking through, you may notice stuff like this:

http://web.amnesty.org/library/index/engmde020252006

http://www.adl.org/main_Israel/hamas_attacks.htm

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Hamas-will-Resume-Suicide-Attacks-against-Israel-39791.shtml

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200607/17/eng20060717_283700.html

http://www.indiadaily.com/editorial/11616.asp

http://www.adl.org/Israel/israel_attacks.asp

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-1849215,00.html

http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/12/29/mideast.alqaeda.claim/index.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence_in_the_Israeli-Palestinian_conflict_2003

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=52598

It seems the whole planet is willing to accept that Israel has been attacked a few times except you.

 

[earth_as_one]

You should read more of my posts:

I never said Israel is evil. Those are your words. I said that to support what Israel does to Palestinians is to be callous or misinformed.

I don't see this conflict as a struggle between good and evil. That's far too simplistic. Some Palestinians and Israelis do evil things in a struggle for the same small piece of desert. My problem is with our news which doesn't give the same level of coverage to both sides. Instead our news selectively informs us and manipulates our opinions.

For example, everytime a suicide bomber or rocket kills innocent Israelis, our front pages are full of graphic images and personal testimony for days, like this Grandmother suicide bomber story. Yet the daily atrocities suffered by Palestinians seldom make the news and when they do, they are usually buried somewhere, without pictures or personal testimony. With that type of biased reporting on this conflict, Canadians don't have informed opinions. That is why I post stories, facts, information..., not covered by our news. If a Palestinian suicide bomber story doesn't make the news, then I'll post that story if it relates to a discussion.

Also unlike our news/propaganda, I don't tell people what to think. In fact I want people to debate me and challenge what I post. But please attack the message, not the messenger.

http://forums.canadiancontent.net/news/53445-grandmother-blows-herself-up-2.html#post752204

or this link

http://forums.canadiancontent.net/news/53445-grandmother-blows-herself-up.html#post751665

Israel's creation caused the first wave of Palestinian refugees in 1947. Back then Palestinians weren't nearly so violent or numerous as they are today. Over time they have become more organized, more hostile and more numerous.

The current situation is an inevitable result of injustice and oppression. People who suffer injustice and oppression tend to be more violent. The greater the injustice and oppression, the more likely they are to become violent.

I doubt increasing the level of injustice and oppression will decrease the violence.

One way or another, this cycle will end.

Palestinian extermination is unlikely. Israel would have convince the Jordanian, Egyptian, Lebanese... governments to do the dirty deed on Israel's behalf. That's unlikely.

The current path of injustice and oppression inevitably will result in Israel's violent destruction.

Only Palestinian freedom and justice can lead to peace, but each day that also seems more and more unlikely.

Your examples of Palestinian violence reference occasional incidents over the last five years. I can find daily examples of Israeli injustice and oppression. For example:

Israeli raid leaves 4 dead in West Bank

An incursion in Ramallah sours the prime minister's meeting with Egypt's president.

By Richard Boudreaux and Maher Abukhater, Special to The Times
January 5, 2007

RAMALLAH, WEST BANK — Israeli troops staged a rare incursion into this city Thursday, bulldozing cars and vegetable stands near the central square as they engaged gunmen and stone-throwing residents in a chaotic two-hour battle that left four Palestinians dead.

The raid, aimed at rescuing a team of undercover Israeli agents, was a diplomatic embarrassment for Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert as he headed to Egypt for talks with President Hosni Mubarak on how to revive peace negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians...


http://www.latimes.com/news/nationw...ry?coll=la-headlines-world&ctrack=1&cset=true

What examples of Palestinian violence against Israelis can you find during the last week?