BushCo crimes - lets do the world a favour

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: BushCo crimes - lets do the world a favour

jimmoyer said:
Let every nation of people spit with contempt on the hatred others promise.

Cryptic ?

Well, think about it.

Let someone hurt you some day.

Learn from it.

what the feck does that have to do with bush war crimes??? Sounds soo.........pouty and whiney. Common jim...... you know better.
 

no1important

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RE: BushCo crimes - lets

There was no bad intel on wmd in Iraq it was all lies and the Bush Crime Family spin and manipulation of the public and press, high on the heals of 9/11 and "W" took advantage of that emotion.
 

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: BushCo crimes - lets

no1important said:
There was no bad intel on wmd in Iraq it was all lies and the Bush Crime Family spin and manipulation of the public and press, high on the heals of 9/11 and "W" took advantage of that emotion.

In a nutshell. !! Good on ya. :thumbleft:

and milked it and milked it some more.... while continuing to milk it. Bush can't tell the difference between a terrorist attack and a full fledged military invasion/war. (or he can but manipulates it to his advantage. Man, have the americans been conned or what???
 

jimmoyer

jimmoyer
Apr 3, 2005
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Actually no1important, what's even more appropriate is the whiny statement I made earlier to which Ocean Breeze condemned.

Any nation of people will spit with contempt on the hatred others promise.

Force it.


Something will break.

Matter of time.

Always.
 

Ocean Breeze

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Wasn't sure whether to put this under "comedy" or "R.I.P ";-)

http://www.alternet.org/story/28634/


gosh, there is so much WELL WRITTEN, Perceptive information and analysis on the internet now.. (no need to turn on the telee except for "interior design programs" ;-)-- or Brit comedy.
 

Jo Canadian

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PEI...for now
 

Karlin

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Re:Magnet rats

Ocean Breeze said:
[Bush's] magnet rationale. It goes like this: Even though we failed to find WMDs in Iraq, we’ll make Iraq the central front in the “war on terrorism” by making U.S. troops a “magnet” that will attract “the terrorists” to attack U.S. soldiers in Iraq rather than people in the United States.

But the magnet rationale raises an important question: Why is it moral to use an innocent country for such a purpose,


Now this article brought something important "home"......and it is the fecking arrogance that the bush con savages have operated on. How dare they decide that some far off nation should be the terrorist magnet , so the US can fight these so called terrorists over there instead of at home [/color][/i][/b]

Ya, this is startling when you see it like this. I have been watching too much network news, they steer viewers away from questions like this.

I thought it was criticism of Bush policy when they said the war was "attracting terrorists to Iraq"... it certainly goes in the face of the War in Terror actually serving the purpose of reducing the numbers of terrorists, by "not creating terrorists".

They don't just come to Iraq, they are being recruited in larger numbers DUE to the fact they have a place to get really involved. Bush provides the enticement and Iraq provides the battle zone, it is no question that there are a lot more terrorists.

Bush just said again "we are goin' to WIN the War on Terror", whereas anyone and everyone knows it cannot be actually "won"
- not the "not a terrorist left anywhere" kind of won
- not the "winning hearts and minds" kind of won
- not even won by anything better than a favorable kill ratio.
- not even cleaning up the mess they made

... so they cant win it, but Bush persists in trying to win it, Iraq will be the proving grounds for a lot of terrorists for a long time.

Here is a thought - As long as the USA trooops are there, terrorist numbers will increase worldwide. When he leaves, their numbers will diminish.
 

Ocean Breeze

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Code:
November 25, 2005

The continuing destruction of Iraq's history - ancient and modern - of homes, lives and civil society under the watch of and at the hands of US and British troops - in defiance of a swathe of international law - is an uncanny and chilling mirror image of Pol Pot'sYear Zero.

In 1975 : 'Society was to be purified ... throughout Cambodia, deadly purges were conducted to eliminate remnants of the old society: the educated, the wealthy, the (religious elders) police, doctors, lawyers, teachers, former government offiicials, soldiers .... Education, health care... was halted, cities forcibly evacuated....The country sealed off from the outside world.' History, monuments, ancient and modern, world heritage sites, were erased from the earth. Newspapers, radio and television were banned.

Secret prisons were built, Moslems 'were forced to eat pork.' 'Up to twenty thousand people were tortured into giving false confessions in a schoolin Phnom Penh,converted into a jail ... elsewhere suspects were often shot before being questioned.'(1) Think Abu Ghraib (and don't forget Guantanamo) and all those other centres where Iraq's disappeared are incarcerated, now admitted - but not where. Think the shootings at road blocks, the 'cleansing' of Iraq's towns and cities. Add to Pol Pot's horrific regime only the the killing of nearly eighty journalists in thirty months,the bombing of two television stations - Al Jazeera and Al Arabiya, whose map grid reference had been trustingly given to the Pentagon - so any light falling on the slaughter and destruction of a nation and it's heritage, becomes impossible - and the all is Iraq, writ with succint accuracy.

Iraq's society too is being 'purified', with precisely the same categories of humanity targetted by Pol Pot being killed in their hundreds: academics to doctors, scientists to soldiers. Former US Viceroy Paul Bremer called his purification 'de-Ba'athification' and sacked just about every strata of society needed to run a civilised one - in Iraq's Year Zero, as Cambodia, their real sin was their race and its heritage, ancient and modern.

The destruction, looting of the haunting wonders of the National Museum, Mosul Museum, the two million irreplaceable books, manuscripts reduced to ashes, records of the National Library, the University of Endowment with its unique collection of ancient Q'urans, the vandalisation of Babylon and Ur by the new Barbarians - US soldiers - and desecration of thousands of archeological sites - the very history of mankind - have been heart wrenchingly recorded. Not recorded is the equally illegal and ongoing, planned destruction of every vestige of Iraq's more modern history, on the orders of the Supreme Committee for de-Ba'athification - Pol Pot could'nt have bettered that tag.

In Basra, early casualties were the dead heroes of the US-driven Iran-Iraq war, whose great bronze figures lined part of the corniche, arm out, pointing toward Iran. They were controversial and subject of much debate in a nation invaded repeatedly, throughout its history, its people utterly weary of war. But they were Iraq's sons and died in defence of their country. They are no more.

The museum up the road, commemorating more of the dead of the eight year conflagration, of whom so many on both sides were lost it has been compared to World War 1, was also destroyed and with it, the only memory for so many: their identity cards, with details and photograph, hundred upon hundred, of the silent dead, living, staring from wall after wall. Real people, mostly so young:; the date they celebrated their birthdays, for all to see, occupation, skills learned over student years, engendered by youthful aspirations, never now to be met. The last vestiges of them has now vanished. Imagine if the Imperial War Museum in London, the Vietnam Memorial Wall, Arlington Cemetary, the Holocaust Museum, the Hiroshima Memorial were raised to the ground. Unthinkable - but Iraq's grief is, it seems, simply inconsequential. That these are 'grave breaches' under Additional Protocol 1 of the expanded Geneva Convention of 1977 and happened under watch of the British Army has not been addressed. That the British Army itself looted a vast statue of Iraq's President and took it back to their Somerset, south of England, base (2) - at British tax payers' expense - has also not been addressed and Protocol 1 also applies.

The British though, had been told their first duty was to head for the oil terminal and secure it (3). Statues and museums clearly paled against of the significance of Iraq's oil..

North in Baghdad early violations by the US army, included the statue toppling and squatting in Palaces, 'using national historic buildings' as a 'command centre' is also a violation. It is incumbant in the region, for each leader to leave behind him something more magnicent that his predecessor, the Palaces are both national assets - not American ones - and tomorrow's history. National buildings too are protected, not free board and lodging for illegal invaders. Reports too numerous to cite recorded US soldiers returning home with palace 'souvenirs' they thieved and also priceless artifacts, prosecutions have been minimal or missing.

Over fifteen hundred modern paintings and scuptures disappeared from the city's Museum of Fine Arts, where to visit was to gaze in awe at the wonderous imagination which created unique beauty. In June1993 an American missile killed the Museum's curator, Leila Al Attar in one of numerous illegal bombings. Now her legacy too, is no more. 'A cultural disaster', near unmentioned, was how UNESCO's Mounir Bouchenak described that cultural vandalism.(4) Thank goodness the troops thought to perfectly preserve the Oil Ministry.

Bit by bit, un-noticed, is the destruction of every statue, every landmark, which was the vibrant beauty, history's hallmarks, which enchanted Baghdadis and visitors, marked the passing of a personality, commemorated Gilgamesh, the Thousand and One Nights, probably the earliest great epic story; Sinbad the Sailor, Iraq's triumphs and tears.

Ironically,' international guidelines protecting cultural property against damage and theft,date back to the American Civil War.' That carnage 'led to the 1863 Lieber Code, protecting libraries, scientific collections and works of art' and was strengthened by the '1954 Convention for the Protection of Cultural Property.' The Nuremburg Trials after World War 11, sentenced Nazi officials to death for destruction of cultural property.(5) This did not deter US soldiers from the first truly breath taking act of desecration.

Michel Aflaq was the Syrian born, French educated, Christian 'Father of Pan Arabism'. A towering intellect, with Salah al-Din al-Bitar, a Moslem - the two met whilst studying in Paris in the 1920's and 1930's - '... created the political movement which would come to dominate Syria and Iraq in the modern world.' Thinker, philosopher, student of Nietzsche, Gide, Tolstoy, French theorist Henri Bergson, with Bitar he had founded France's Arab Student Union. Finally devoting their energies to politics, culminating in the formation of the Arab Ba'ath Party with Jalil Said, in 1947 with '.... a secular focus ' with Islam's significance acknowledged, contributing to world wide emancipation, with a central tenet being that there were Arabs before there were Muslims - thus the ideal of the Arab state. For Aflaq, 'theorist of integrity ....... incorruptable'; a central tenet of the movement was representing : ' .. the Arab spirit ... Arab nation, emphasising culture rather than politics. (6) He survived imprisonment, high office and the region's turmoils, dying in Paris in 1989 and buried in Baghdad where his tomb, statue in his honour and dome, occupied a ten km square site. In September 2003 the US army 'levelled the all to earth', on orders of 'Viceroy' Bremer.(7) Think flattening the Lincoln Memorial and you'll be getting there.

Vandalising religious and historic monuments are also prohibited and illegal acts under the Hague Convention. Desecrating a grave is a criminal act of the lowest order, in any society.

Driving into central Baghdad from the west, in Nasr Square, Sa'doun Street, a small, resolute figure graced a plinth. He was Abdul Muhsin Al-Sa'doun. Born in Nasiriya in 1889, he became Minister of Justice, then in 1922, Minister of the Interior, then Prime Minister four times, a youthful, political shooting star. In his fourth term as Prime Minister, in 1929, he left the Parliamentary chamber, went into a side room and shot himself, rather than give in to British Colonial demands. He died of integrity, aged just forty years. His statue, made by an Italian sculpture in 1933, stands no more, razed shortly after Michel Aflaq's, and reportedly melted down. Reports differ as to who was responsible, but not disputed is that it happened under US Army's watch - even if not at their hands. Symbolism is stark: a man who died of integrity has been razed - along with integrity itself.

In January 2004 the US Army 1st Armoured Division did the unthinkable. They made a camp beneath the great turqoise dome of the Shaheed (Martyrs) Memorial to the dead of the Iran-Iraq war, where the names of over half a million dead are inscribed in marble, in memorium, that their names, at least, live on. Grafiitti was sprayed on the names, the Division's motto obliterted others. The Museum where foreign dignitaries and families had brought items in honour of the fallen was, of course, looted. (Agencies, websites.) The dome is split, allowing the souls of the dead to fly heavenward. A great fountain flowed to the courtyard below - representing endless tears, or eternity as represented by the Euphrates river, depending on who one asked. A place of memory is, anyway, in the interpretation of those who visit and the solace found there.

On November 2nd the landmark statue of Abu Ja'afar Al Mansour (713-775AD) founder of Baghdad, was destroyed by a bomb.(8) No Baghdadi, Iraqi or Arab, would, arguably, blow up this revered historical figure, creator of' the city named over the centuries: 'The Paris of the Ninth Century', 'Mother of the World', 'Abode of Peace', 'Round City', 'Abode of Beauty', 'Triumph of the Gods' ....(9)

Since journalists are shot and Iraqis lucky to return from a domestic outing in one piece and not in a body bag containing their parts and UNESCO has gone awol, comprehensive records of every day destruction of Iraq's heritage, numerous, haunting, superb statues, sculptures, monuments is impossible. This surely barely scratches the surface. But an important and chilling plea appeared on a website (10). With the benefit of post invasion destruction, it had horrific clarity. From 'An Iraqi Tear' (most 'liberated' Iraqis are more fearful of revealing their identities now than they ever were under Saddam) is a plea to our place in history: 'Please help us protect these monuments.'

'Tear' asserts that the Supreme Committee for de-Ba'athification has now ordered the razing of the turqoise Shaheed monument to rivers of tears and the Monument to the Unknown Soldier. The Unknown Soldier was completed in 1959, the year after the revolution which ironically, toppled the British imposed royal rule, which had opened the door to foreign monopolies plundering the country's oil wealth. It was in homage to all those, who over the centuries: 'fell in defence of the country's dignity and pride.'

'Riverbend' (11) another blogger and insightful, astute chronicler of the Barbarians returned, notes: 'The occupation has ceased to be American. It is American in face, militarily, but in essence, it has metamorphised slowly and surely into an Iranian one.' An astute Midle East watcher remarked recently:'Are you aware that the dominant language among those dominant in the puppet parliament is Farsi?' ( Iran's main language.)

Has an unholy alliance been formed between religious fundamentalism in Washington and Whitehall and religious fundamentalism from Iran which bans 'graven images'? 'Satan lives in Falluja ..' a priest who gives God a bad name, told US troops before they used banned weapons and vapourised much of its population.

When the Taliban ordered the destruction of the ancient Banyiman statues in Afghanistan - the world, including Britain and American governments, declared outrage. Now, from Ur to the threat to Unknown Soldier, they are guilty of crimes of historic enormity. Quite apart from those, unquatifiable, against humanity.

In June 2005, the World Monument Society named, for the first time, an entire country, Iraq, an endangered site. 'Every significant cultural site in Iraq is at risk today ....' It also emphasised: '... preserving 20th century structures ...'

A spokesperson for the Iraqi 'government', boasted after the illegal invasion in 2003: 'We came to power on a CIA train.' By a different route, so did Pol Pot. Spot the difference.

courtesy of : Uruknet....( which refuses to link to the proper page.... :(
 

Ocean Breeze

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moghrabi said:
Thank you OB. Very good article.

I took the liberty to put a proper link.

http://tinyurl.com/9c9pe

thanks mog. For some reason when I do the link to a certain page on that site.......It comes up with either the home page or something else.. so appreciate that... :thumbleft:

Probably should try : tinyurl.....
 

Canucklehead

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Ocean Breeze said:
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article11146.htm

an article that captures the deeper essence of things...

Do you really think the US populace has the wherewithall to stand up and be counted on this issue? How shocking it would be to their comfy little lives to realise that soundbites and simplistic views don't represent the reality of this world. Besides, it would require an admission that they were wrong... and we know that 50% of em couldn't conceive of such a thing.
 

Ocean Breeze

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CH:
Do you really think the US populace has the wherewithall to stand up and be counted on this issue?

truthfully??? No, I don't. I don't think the populace has the courage or stamina to do the really "right" thing now. Their creature comforts and lifestyle has contributed to make them passive and compliant with the regimes they put in office. Many don't even KNOW what is going on........let alone question it. Those that do ........simply cannot be bothered..

complacency , excuses ,callous indifference and the blame game are the order of the day..
 

Canucklehead

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Ocean Breeze said:
CH:
Do you really think the US populace has the wherewithall to stand up and be counted on this issue?

truthfully??? No, I don't. I don't think the populace has the courage or stamina to do the really "right" thing now. Their creature comforts and lifestyle has contributed to make them passive and compliant with the regimes they put in office. Many don't even KNOW what is going on........let alone question it. Those that do ........simply cannot be bothered..

complacency , excuses and the blame game are the order of the day..

Spot on, OB !
 

moghrabi

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Jo Canadian said:
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Karlin

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Jun 27, 2004
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A permanent occupation of Iraq would serve the BushCo interests better than leaving.

Iraqi Oil, Iraqi reconstruction contracts, military spending, political powers in Iraq, regional conquests, and the divide-and-conquer effect the war is having on the American Mainlanders are good enough reasons for BushCo to stay. It doesn't really matter if it is Bush or a Democrat at the helm either, thats how BushCo gets away with pissing off voters.

So they will stay as long as they have enough control at home in the USA to do it. This could just as easily continue with a Democratic government in power too - there is not much difference between the two American political parties.

I would expect it will be at least 10 years before the American people get their way and see the troops come home. In that time, they will have pumped [stolen] a lot of oil, established Iraqi government friendly to the USA, killed off the most troublesome Iraqis [who resist americanism], and built the pipelines in the region that they want.

It takes time to transfer trillions of dollars from the USA taxpayers to the Elites thru contracts and oil consignments - I believe that is one of the primary reasons BushCo had for invading Iraq. During that time, they want to get corporations established that can continue the pillaging of Middle Eastern wealth and resources.

Back home, the war will continue the distraction from America's internal problems of poverty health deterioration, pollution,severe weather events from global warming and so on. Establishing the conditions for the 2nd coming just might be part of it too, who knows with these whakcos. Keeping the public off-balance and afraid is very helpfull when conspiring to implement the evil agenda of the Corporate Elite NWO Bilderberger Globalist Cabal.

Getting out of Iraq is not the goal of BushCo. Not ever.

Karlin