any muslim here

[Machjo]

Re: RE: any muslim here

It also refers to the 12th Imam of Shi'ah Muslims, who we believe will reappear before Judgement Day with Jesus to restore peace and justice to the world. Jesus will lead prayers and Imam will follow behind him.

It's interesting to note that the Baha'i Faith believes the Mahdi has already returned:

"I am, I am, I am, the promised One! I am the One whose name you have for a thousand years invoked, at whose mention you have risen, whose advent you have longed to witness, and the hour of whose Revelation you have prayed God to hasten. Verily I say, it is incumbent upon the peoples of both the East and the West to obey My word and to pledge allegiance to My person."

The Bab

 

[Jersay]

ITN, Canada was suppose to send 200 soldiers to Darfur, however that got screwed up.

However, if a U.N mission happens, hopefully a number of Canadian battalions go.

Besides having already had 100,000 soldiers go on peacekeeping missions, and have gone on 50+ U.N missions I think Canada would be a good choice.

 

[I think not]

ITN, Canada was suppose to send 200 soldiers to Darfur, however that got screwed up.

However, if a U.N mission happens, hopefully a number of Canadian battalions go.

Besides having already had 100,000 soldiers go on peacekeeping missions, and have gone on 50+ U.N missions I think Canada would be a good choice.

Now don't think for a minute I am trying to degrade the Canadian Armed Forces, I know very well what they contribute.

The problem is political and economical in nature, if you want to "stick" to the US and say "i told you so" then take more action other than words.

 

[Machjo]

Re: RE: any muslim here

As far as I know, Muslims are encouraged to recognize and believe the Books (the Bible, the Qur'an and the Torah) as the word of God and, therefore, sacred and true.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong here.

A few quotes from the Qur'an which might answer that question:

Verily, we have sent down the law (Towrat) wherein are guidance and light. By it did the prophets who professed Islam judge the Jews; and the doctors and the teachers judged by that portion of the Book of God, of which they were the keepers and the witnesses. Therefore, O Jews! fear not men but fear Me; and barter not away my signs for a mean price! And whoso will not judge by what God hath sent down–such are the Infidels.
And therein have we enacted for them, "Life for life, and eye for eye, and nose for nose, and ear for ear, and tooth for tooth, and for wounds retaliation:"–Whoso shall compromise it as alms shall have therein the expiation of his sin; and whoso will not judge by what God hath sent down–such are the transgressors.
And in the footsteps of the prophets caused we Jesus, the son of Mary, to follow, confirming the law which was before him: and we gave him the Evangel with its guidance and light, confirmatory of the preceding Law; a guidance and warning to those who fear God;–
And that the people of the Evangel may judge according to what God hath sent down therein. And whoso will not judge by what God hath sent down–such are the perverse.
And to thee we have sent down the Book of the Koran with truth, confirmatory of previous Scriptures, and their safeguard. Judge therefore between them by what God hath sent down, and follow not their desires by deserting the truth which hath come unto thee. To every one of you have we given a rule and a beaten track.
And if God had pleased He had surely made you all one people; but He would test you by what He hath given to each. Be emulous, then, in good deeds. To God shall ye all return, and He will tell you concerning the subjects of your disputes.

Qur’án 5:44-48

 

[Ali Mahdi]

Machjo, those verses refer to the fact that Judas Iscariot was crucified in Jesus' place as punishment for his betrayal of Jesus. He was given the likeness of Jesus and the Romans thought he was Jesus, but he wasn't.

 

[Machjo]

Re: RE: any muslim here

Machjo, those verses refer to the fact that Judas Iscariot was crucified in Jesus' place as punishment for his betrayal of Jesus. He was given the likeness of Jesus and the Romans thought he was Jesus, but he wasn't.

Remember when God said, "O Jesus! verily I will cause thee to die, and will take thee up to myself and deliver thee from those who believe not; and I will place those who follow thee above those who believe not, until the day of resurrection. Then, to me is your return, and wherein ye differ will I decide between you.
Qur’án 3:55

Then why does God say: "O Jesus! verily I will cause thee to die"?

And for their saying, "Verily we have slain the Messiah, Jesus the son of Mary, an Apostle of God." Yet they slew him not, and they crucified him not, but they had only his likeness. And they who differed about him were in doubt concerning him: No sure knowledge had they about him, but followed only an opinion, and they did not really slay him, but God took him up to Himself. And God is Mighty, Wise!
Qur’án 3:157

Yet here it states: "and they did not really slay him, but God took him up to himself".

Unless we understand that Jesus, like any other human, is fundamentally a spiritual being, and that the body is merely a temple which we use during our time on earth, then it's understandable taht while, according to Qur'an 3:157 Jesus was killed in the sence that his body was crucified, he at the same time was not killed as per Qur'an 3:157 in that his spirit lived on and returned to God.


I am well aware, however, that the interpretation you gave about Judas Iscariot is popular among Muslims, even many scholars. While the majority of Muslims agree with your interpretation, Muslim scholars are not so unanimous in this regard. I'm sure there are plenty of websites in this regard. I will look them up as soon as I have a chance.

 

[Machjo]

Here's the first site I found on the alternative understanding of the crucifixion by some Muslim scholars. Bear in mind that since they are a small minority, it might take me a while to google it.

http://www.islamawareness.net/Christianity/substitution.html

Here is a Christian apologetic perspective:

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aiia/islam-cross.html

And while I can't open this website, I suspect it might touch upon it as well:

http://www.mostmerciful.com/substitution.htm

And an interesting site here which gives a slightly different third perpective besides my own and the popular one about Judas Iscariot:
http://www.real-islam.org/jesus/jesus.html

It actually suggests that jesus did die, but not through crucifiction, rather that God Himself caused jesus to die at the appointed time. Fist time I've come across that interpretation, honestly, but it does show again that your interpretation, while certainly popular, is still theory and open to debate.

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/abdul_ibrahim/easter.htm

And this one suggests that Jesus was crucified but did not die on the cross. Yet a fourth interpretation. Again, my first time comming across this one.

Anyway, I'm sure there are plenty more. But due to the wide range of interpretations, it's probably better to just quote the Wur'an and ahadith and let people decide for themselves.

Unfortunately I don't have the book anymore which looked at the crucifixion in greater depth, and it does seem that many of the websites above aren't all that good. But it's a start. And it's only natural that any belief held by a minority "unorthodox" group will be hard to find on-line. You'll probably have more luck in a bookshop.

 

[Avatar]

I've always believed that, ITN.


Religion is like magic...Three frog legs a bat wing spat upon, tossed into the cauldron...turn around twice and "poof" Beelzebub appears.

Faith requires none of this.


I do like to see a little ritual in church, but too much of it and it turns me off.

Faith is the act of denying the validity of your experiences. It is exactly the same as magic.
A.

 

[Explicit_insinuendo]

Yeah..i'm muslim but I'm not from around your area. I live in beautiful British Columbia.lol