Anti-Americanism is madness, says Blair.

[cortez]

Re: RE: Anti-Americanism is madness, says Blair.

I would rather the grand US military imperialist adventure TOTALLY fail, if only for my friends in the US.. fail SO BADLY that some serious reconsideration may even be required, ....
---------------------------mabudon--------------------------


It's more important to them that America fails, than
for Iraq to succeed as a viable peaceful nation.
-----------------jimmoyer's response to mabudon----------

i think the point of the post was that if american fails---
it might reconsider its policy of pre-emptive strike-- and choose another more productive strategy
imperialism - is not something i believe most americans want their country to participate in
----------------cortez response to jimmoyer--------------


I guess Cortez, the old definition of Imperialism meant
you conquered a country and then governed it and
owned it outright.

The new definition of Imperialism is the ownership
of Capitalism through world trade.

Doesn't seem like such a stretch to people like Cortez
but in reality it was brutally a world of difference.

I'm not sure Cortez can go beyond that subtlety
to see a further subtlety as he predictably will challenge
this point.

im well aware of your point
nowadays its more complex so outright invasion isnt always required
various stragtegies can be employed
yes- capital-- specifically buying off corrupt foreign leaders to do the empires bidding
propaganda thru mass media-- the nazis started that -- its been fined tuned since
covert military involvement- ie the infamous right wing death squads of central america
the iran-- contra type of thing to bypass a democratic senate that might prevent foreign intervention
and of course outright war
a special type though
massive arial bombardment
shock and awe
a modern variant of
blitzkreig-- is often a key component

---- all these surely not uniquely american
just to make the point that empires evolve in complexity
employing newer more subtle mechanisms of preventing local the local populace from controlling their own just destiny -- in ADDITION to the old methods...

for example where you have imperialism -- you have resistance and one method the empire always uses at some point is TORTURE-- weve seen that in vietnam-- projeect phoenix-- the french in north africa, the british-- all over -- weve seen it in abu graib-- theres probably at lot more of it going on than we know...

c est la meme chose

it is what it is if you dont wanna call it imperialism call it bob or joe or sister mary-- or better yet call it freedom-------

war is peace

 

[jimmoyer]

Well, the reality was always that America (both Left and
Right) does not want our troops there any longer, but we
started this mess and it's even more immoral to leave.

And the reality was always that Iraqis would control
their own oil, just as the Saudis do theirs.

On those 2 counts alone (not wanting our troops
there any longer and who will own the oil) , imperialism by any narrow or broad definition is lacking.

And on a third count, even a meaningless broad definition of Imperialism is hollow when you read how the Ministries are doling out the contracts, as they should be the ones to do so, corrupt
or not.

And so by foreign trade the act itself is deemed imperialist, enough to water down the label to meaninglessness.

To give you your rightful due, we did attack,
and that is a debate all itself.

 

[cortez]

war is watered down to meaningless

i did say the american people dont want to be an empire-- so yes you agree they dont want the troops there
the control of oil you speak of has not been proved
ministries are doleing out contracts to western companies who will profit from them in the long run

its not a meaningless term

you are playing word games

 

[jimmoyer]

No word games. The points prior to your post still
stand. It is impossible for America to own Iraqi oil.
Just as it was with Saudi oil.

If it were as you say, we certainly could really
muck around for it far more fiercely and boldly,
but even the Americans of both Left and Right
will stop it.

The Iraqis are going to have their oil, and it will
certainly corrupt them like it has everybody else.

Hardly imperialism.

Hardly word games.

Recheck my prior post, while I try to get Haggis to give
me a good bye spanking.

 

[cortez]

hey you talking to me...

 

[Blackleaf]

Re: RE: Anti-Americanism is m

Mr Blair and Mr Howard are both bum boils

The strange thing is that even though Australia has a population of only 20 million, I always know who the Australian Prime Minister is.

But I NEVER know who the Prime Minister of Canada is despite the fact that Canada has a population of 33 million.

I still don't know who the Canadian PM is even though you have just had a General Election.

Why is that?

 

[FiveParadox]

Blackleaf, I would be quite surprised that you don't know who the head of government in Canada is, considering the numerous posts on Canadian Content relating to that very matter, lol. Nonetheless, our current leader is the Right Honourable Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P., the Member for Calgary Southwest and Prime Minister of Canada.

 

[Jersay]

Because you only wallow in the crappyness of Britain Blackleaf.

 

[Jay]

Re: RE: Anti-Americanism is madness, says Blair.

Blackleaf, I would be quite surprised that you don't know who the head of government in Canada is, considering the numerous posts on Canadian Content relating to that very matter, lol.

No doubt, Five.

Blackleaf is either just starting his new medication, or isn't taking the old stuff anymore.

 

[darkbeaver]

Re: RE: Anti-Americanism is m

Mr Blair and Mr Howard are both bum boils

The strange thing is that even though Australia has a population of only 20 million, I always know who the Australian Prime Minister is.

But I NEVER know who the Prime Minister of Canada is despite the fact that Canada has a population of 33 million.

I still don't know who the Canadian PM is even though you have just had a General Election.

Why is that?

We don't know him either.

 

[darkbeaver]

Re: RE: Anti-Americanism is m

Mr Blair and Mr Howard are both bum boils

The strange thing is that even though Australia has a population of only 20 million, I always know who the Australian Prime Minister is.

But I NEVER know who the Prime Minister of Canada is despite the fact that Canada has a population of 33 million.

I still don't know who the Canadian PM is even though you have just had a General Election.

Why is that?

We don't know him either. He's such a hideous piece of shit that we're trying to forget all about it.

 

[mabudon]

RE: Anti-Americanism is m

Yeah, what the Beav said.. and who knows, his ass may hardly have time to hit the seat, so technically he could have already pretty much served his first term (don't know exactly where I stand on that BTW but it is a real possibility)

 

[Jay]

Ya sorry about that...I guess your party is going to have to look for alternative sources of funding rather than stealing it from the tax payers.