Yeah, he was an ancestor of mine.
The Royal Navy runs through our clan. I'm a former Royal Navy man myself.
9/11 Anniversary
- Thread starter Tecumsehsbones
- Start date
Yeah, he was an ancestor of mine.
The Royal Navy runs through our clan. I'm a former Royal Navy man myself.
Another senseless war, BL. The Americans should repeal their unilateral Declaration of Independence and rejoin the community of democratic nations.
From former Python John Cleese:
NOTICE OF REVOCATION OF INDEPENDENCE
To the citizens of the United States of America,
In the light of your failure to elect a competent President of the USA and thus to govern yourselves, we hereby give notice of the revocation of your independence, effective today. Her Sovereign Majesty Queen Elizabeth II will resume monarchical duties over all states, commonwealths and other territories. (Except Utah, which she does not fancy.) Your new prime minister (The Right Honourable Tony Blair, MP for the 97.85% of you who have until now been unaware that there is a world outside your borders) will appoint a minister for America without the need for further elections. Congress and the Senate will be disbanded. A questionnaire will be circulated next year to determine whether any of you noticed. To aid in the transition to a British Crown Dependency, the following rules are introduced with immediate effect:
1. You should look up "revocation" in the Oxford English Dictionary. Then look up "aluminium". Check the pronunciation guide. You will be amazed at just how wrongly you have been pronouncing it. The letter 'U' will be reinstated in words such as 'favour' and 'neighbour', skipping the letter 'U' is nothing more than laziness on your part. Likewise, you will learn to spell 'doughnut' without skipping half the letters. You will end your love affair with the letter 'Z' (pronounced 'zed' not 'zee') and the suffix "ize" will be replaced by the suffix "ise". You will learn that the suffix 'burgh is pronounced 'burra' e.g. Edinburgh. You are welcome to respell Pittsburgh as 'Pittsberg' if you can't cope with correct pronunciation. Generally, you should raise your vocabulary to acceptable levels. Look up "vocabulary".
Using the same twenty seven words interspersed with filler noises such as "like" and "you know" is an unacceptable and inefficient form of communication. Look up "interspersed". There will be no more 'bleeps' in the Jerry Springer show. If you're not old enough to cope with bad language then you shouldn't have chat shows. When you learn to develop your vocabulary then you won't have to use bad language as often.
2. There is no such thing as "US English". We will let Microsoft know on your behalf. The Microsoft spell-checker will be adjusted to take account of the reinstated letter 'u' and the elimination of "-ize".
3. You should learn to distinguish the English and Australian accents. It really isn't that hard. English accents are not limited to cockney, upper-class twit or Mancunian (Daphne in Frasier). You will also have to learn how to understand regional accents - Scottish dramas such as "Taggart" will no longer be broadcast with subtitles. While we're talking about regions, you must learn that there is no such place as Devonshire in England. The name of the county is "Devon". If you persist in calling it Devonshire, all American States will become "shires" e.g. Texasshire, Floridashire, Louisianashire.
4. Hollywood will be required occasionally to cast English actors as the good guys. Hollywood will be required to cast English actors to play English characters. British sit-coms such as "Men Behaving Badly" or "Red Dwarf" will not be re-cast and watered down for a wishy-washy American audience who can't cope with the humour of occasional political incorrectness.
5. You should relearn your original national anthem, "God Save The Queen", but only after fully carrying out task 1. We would not want you to get confused and give up half way through.
6. You should stop playing American "football". There is only one kind of football. What you refer to as American "football" is not a very good game. The 2.15% of you who are aware that there is a world outside your borders may have noticed that no one else plays "American" football. You will no longer be allowed to play it, and should instead play proper football. Initially, it would be best if you played with the girls. It is a difficult game. Those of you brave enough will, in time, be allowed to play rugby (which is similar to American "football", but does not involve stopping for a rest every twenty seconds or wearing full kevlar body armour like nancies). We are hoping to get together at least a US Rugby sevens side by 2005. You should stop playing baseball. It is not reasonable to host an event called the 'World Series' for a game which is not played outside of America. Since only 2.15% of you are aware that there is a world beyond your borders, your error is understandable. Instead of baseball, you will be allowed to play a girls' game called "rounders" which is baseball without fancy team strip, oversized gloves, collector cards or hotdogs.
7. You will no longer be allowed to own or carry guns. You will no longer be allowed to own or carry anything more dangerous in public than a vegetable peeler. Because we don't believe you are sensible enough to handle potentially dangerous items, you will require a permit if you wish to carry a vegetable peeler in public.
8. July 4th is no longer a public holiday. November 2nd will be a new national holiday, but only in England. It will be called "Indecisive Day".
9. All American cars are hereby banned. They are crap and it is for your own good. When we show you German cars, you will understand what we mean. All road intersections will be replaced with roundabouts. You will start driving on the left with immediate effect. At the same time, you will go metric with immediate effect and without the benefit of conversion tables. Roundabouts and metrication will help you understand the British sense of humour.
10. You will learn to make real chips. Those things you call French fries are not real chips. Fries aren't even French, they are Belgian though 97.85% of you (including the guy who discovered fries while in Europe) are not aware of a country called Belgium. Those things you insist on calling potato chips are properly called "crisps". Real chips are thick cut and fried in animal fat. The traditional accompaniment to chips is beer which should be served warm and flat. Waitresses will be trained to be more aggressive with customers.
11. As a sign of penance 5 grams of sea salt per cup will be added to all tea made within the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, this quantity to be doubled for tea made within the city of Boston itself.
12. The cold tasteless stuff you insist on calling beer is not actually beer at all, it is lager. From November 1st only proper British Bitter will be referred to as "beer", and European brews of known and accepted provenance will be referred to as "Lager". The substances formerly known as "American Beer" will henceforth be referred to as "Near-Frozen Knat's Urine", with the exception of the product of the American Budweiser company whose product will be referred to as "Weak Near-Frozen Knat's Urine". This will allow true Budweiser (as manufactured for the last 1000 years in Pilsen, Czech Republic) to be sold without risk of confusion.
13. From November 10th the UK will harmonise petrol (or "Gasoline" as you will be permitted to keep calling it until April 1st 2005) prices with the former USA. The UK will harmonise its prices to those of the former USA and the Former USA will, in return, adopt UK petrol prices (roughly $6/US gallon - get used to it).
14. You will learn to resolve personal issues without using guns, lawyers or therapists. The fact that you need so many lawyers and therapists shows that you're not adult enough to be independent. Guns should only be handled by adults. If you're not adult enough to sort things out without suing someone or speaking to a therapist then you're not grown up enough to handle a gun.
15. Please tell us who killed JFK. It's been driving us crazy. Tax collectors from Her Majesty's Government will be with you shortly to ensure the acquisition of all revenues due (backdated to 1776).
16. Last but not the least, and for heaven's sake.....it's Nuclear as in "clear" NOT Nucular. Thank you for your co-operation and have a great day.
Unilateral declarations of independence must not be recognized by the international community. Remember Rhodesia in 1965. Who knows who will be next. Could it be Palestine? Would the USA have the moral authority to object?
in one of MMM Bennetts books she claims that a large proportion of the Royal Marines rank and file in the attack on the Chesapeake was made up of Disaffected French former Prisoners of war, who by 1813 despaired of their moldy oat bran and water diets
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Natural Amphibians, but not he best when the Yankee line stiffened...
The USS Chesapeake was attacked twice by the British - in 1807 and 1813. In 1813 she was captured, sent to England and turned into a watermill.
She was attacked in 1807 because she refused to stop for HMS Leopard in order for the British to board her and search for British deserters (not to press-gang Americans into the Royal Navy, as many Americans still believe today).
In 1813 she was captured by HMS Shannon when captain Philip Broke was eager to engage and defeat one of the American frigates that had already scored a number of victories over the Royal Navy in single ship confrontations.
The Royal Navy took her into service as HMS Chesapeake, where she served until she was broken up and her timbers sold in 1820. They are now part of the Chesapeake Mill in Wickham, England.
Chesapeake Mill, a watermill in Wickham, not far from Portsmouth, in Hampshire, was designed and constructed in 1820 using the timbers of HMS Chesapeake, which had previously been the United States Navy frigate USS Chesapeake. The interior of the mill was designed around the dimensions of the deck beams. The mill remained in operation until 1976 and now serves as a retail centre for antique and gift sellers. It is a Grade II* listed building.
Even to this day many Americans wrongly believe that the British press-ganged Americans into the Royal Navy. But that's not the case. The vast majority of the so-called "Americans" they press-ganged into the Royal Navy were actually British citizens who were trying to pass themselves off as Americans by using forged identity documents. When the British boarded American ship they only took back British citizens who had deserted from the Royal Navy. But it still didn't stop the Americans using the "fact" that "The British are press-ganging American citizens into the Royal Navy" as one of their excuses to declare war on Britain and start the War of 1812, and even today many Americans and others believe the myth that the British went round stealing Americans citizens and press-ganged them into the Royal Navy.
She was attacked in 1807 because she refused to stop for HMS Leopard in order for the British to board her and search for British deserters (not to press-gang Americans into the Royal Navy, as many Americans still believe today).
In 1813 she was captured by HMS Shannon when captain Philip Broke was eager to engage and defeat one of the American frigates that had already scored a number of victories over the Royal Navy in single ship confrontations.
The Royal Navy took her into service as HMS Chesapeake, where she served until she was broken up and her timbers sold in 1820. They are now part of the Chesapeake Mill in Wickham, England.
Chesapeake Mill, a watermill in Wickham, not far from Portsmouth, in Hampshire, was designed and constructed in 1820 using the timbers of HMS Chesapeake, which had previously been the United States Navy frigate USS Chesapeake. The interior of the mill was designed around the dimensions of the deck beams. The mill remained in operation until 1976 and now serves as a retail centre for antique and gift sellers. It is a Grade II* listed building.
Even to this day many Americans wrongly believe that the British press-ganged Americans into the Royal Navy. But that's not the case. The vast majority of the so-called "Americans" they press-ganged into the Royal Navy were actually British citizens who were trying to pass themselves off as Americans by using forged identity documents. When the British boarded American ship they only took back British citizens who had deserted from the Royal Navy. But it still didn't stop the Americans using the "fact" that "The British are press-ganging American citizens into the Royal Navy" as one of their excuses to declare war on Britain and start the War of 1812, and even today many Americans and others believe the myth that the British went round stealing Americans citizens and press-ganged them into the Royal Navy.
Oh yeah, because British subs are so terrible, aren't they?
I'd rather have British subs defending me than Russian subs, for example.
And remember, Canada is defended by a navy which went out and bought submarines with faulty wiring.
The USS Chesapeake was attacked twice by the British - in 1807 and 1813. In 1813 she was captured, sent to England and turned into a watermill.
She was attacked in 1807 because she refused to stop for HMS Leopard in order for the British to board her and search for British deserters (not to press-gang Americans into the Royal Navy, as many Americans still believe today).
In 1813 she was captured by HMS Shannon when captain Philip Broke was eager to engage and defeat one of the American frigates that had already scored a number of victories over the Royal Navy in single ship confrontations.
The Royal Navy took her into service as HMS Chesapeake, where she served until she was broken up and her timbers sold in 1820. They are now part of the Chesapeake Mill in Wickham, England.
Chesapeake Mill, a watermill in Wickham, not far from Portsmouth, in Hampshire, was designed and constructed in 1820 using the timbers of HMS Chesapeake, which had previously been the United States Navy frigate USS Chesapeake. The interior of the mill was designed around the dimensions of the deck beams. The mill remained in operation until 1976 and now serves as a retail centre for antique and gift sellers. It is a Grade II* listed building.
Even to this day many Americans wrongly believe that the British press-ganged Americans into the Royal Navy. But that's not the case. The vast majority of the so-called "Americans" they press-ganged into the Royal Navy were actually British citizens who were trying to pass themselves off as Americans by using forged identity documents. When the British boarded American ship they only took back British citizens who had deserted from the Royal Navy. But it still didn't stop the Americans using the "fact" that "The British are press-ganging American citizens into the Royal Navy" as one of their excuses to declare war on Britain and start the War of 1812, and even today many Americans and others believe the myth that the British went round stealing Americans citizens and press-ganged them into the Royal Navy.
that is kinda yes, kinda no.
Its the Romantic M M Bennetts view that 'you were a citizen of the country you were born into '
War of 1812 « M.M. Bennetts
However, it was relatively easy for a
British citizen to get American citizenship. What Bennetts forgets is that this was the revival of an 'old , great idea' Rome would confer citizenship on a non Roman.
(so would Mexico, etc. in contemporary times)
If you were an evicted Irish peasant, or a 'clearance Scot', the Old country didn't give you very much. OR want you back. Until war broke out and you were 'British' again.
It's where the 'rights movement ' broke out after 1812 in Britain. One good thing that Napoleon did for Britain. so yes, they were Kidnapping Americans, for the most part.
The British didn't recognise those Brits who got American citizenship.
They were already in the Royal Navy to begin with. They were people who had deserted from the Royal Navy and then tried to claim they were American citizens. The British just merely got them back.
The Americans then through the toys out of their pram and claimed, as many still do today, that the British kidnapped Americans and forced them into the Royal Navy.
And this claim, just like all the other claims the Americans made which made them declare war on Britain, just didn't wash at the Treaty of Ghent. It was ignored.
They were kidnapping British citizens who were falsely claiming to be Americans, mainly by using forged identity papers.
It is a myth, forged by American nationalists and ignorant historians, that the British kidnapped Americans and impressed them into the RN. It just didn't happen.
This is what I wrote on a history discussion forum in May last year after reading about the War of 1812 in the BBC History magazine, which basically stated that the Amercians were the aggressors and that, at the signing of the Treaty of Ghent to end the war, not one American onjective was even discussed, let alone me, whereas the British got what they wanted - the status quo...
Basically, the Americans were to blame. It was they who declared war on Britain. It was they who were the aggressors. President Madison saw Britain's preoccupation in fighting Old Boney as the perfect opportunity to grab Britain's North American territory - i.e. Canada.
Madison and his advisers believed that conquest of Canada would be easy and that economic coercion would force the British to come to terms by cutting off the food supply for their West Indies colonies.
The Americans thought that by snatching Canada they could use her as a bargaining chip to persuade the British to hand over Indian lands to the west.
The US also had its eyes set on annexing Spain's territory of Florida.
So the US invaded Canada and attacked British merchant shipping in the West Indies and the North Atlantic.
It was mainly the southern and western states that were supportive of the war. The northern and eastern states of New England were allies of the British and traded with them. New England grain fed Wellington's troops in Spain and British troops in Canada.
Another issue the Americans had with the British was that they were angry that the Royal Navy arrested American vessels and press-ganged US Navy sailors into the RN.
But the British only arrested American ships that were trying to break Britain's economic embargo of Napoleonic France, so the British were actually justified in their actions.
The British press-ganged many of these US Navy sailors into the RN.
But the British also claimed - with justification - that most English-speaking sailors that they press-ganged into the RN were actually subjects of the King (many so-called "Americans" were actually British subjects who tried to fool the British into thinking they were Americans by carrying bogus US papers) and so they were justified in press-ganging these USN sailors into the RN.
When the peace treaty between the two nations was signed in Ghent it was the British who got what they wanted: the status quo, the way things were before the war started. Not a single American aim was even discussed, so it seems as though the authorities sided with the British. For this reason, it can be said that the British won the War of 1812.
BL, with all due respect, you are WRONG. A crewman in1812 could swear allegiance and with his captain as 'voucher', get genuine citizenship through a common court of record as a crewman on an American vessel. . Naturalization Act of 1790 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
BRitish citizenship for the masses didn't exist, you were a 'British Subject of the king".
What you are calling British Citizenship ,BL, was the old Anglo Saxon principles updated in modern form, and they mostly showed up after the Napoleonic war. Originally suspended in 1066 for 750 years in favor of State Slavery.
No, I'm not.
Many British citizens who were supposedly Americans were NOT Americans. They were using FORGED papers. In fact, this is the case in the overwhelming majority of cases of supposed "Americans" being press-ganged into the Royal Navy. The vast majority were Brits trying to pass themselves off as Yanks.
And even those Brits who HAD become American citizens were still targeted for impressment into the Royal Navy because the British did NOT recognise naturalised American status, even if they had possession of citizenship certificates. The criterion was: "Once an Englishman, always an Englishman."
Though the American government repeatedly protested the practice, British Foreign Secretary Lord Harrowby contemptuously wrote in 1804, "The pretention advanced by Mr. [Secretary of State James] Madison that the American flag should protect every individual on board of a merchant ship is too extravagent to require any serious refutation."
The only difference between being a British "subject" and a British "citizen" is a word. Other than that there is no difference between the two. A "subject" doesn't automatically get less rights than a "citizen".
British "subjects" in the 18th and 19th centuries were the freest people on Earth, and were much freer than their French "citizen" neighbours over the Channel.
If they are anything but ice-beakers what would be the use? HMS Drone #396211ac, cost $1,999,93
Then there was the company town mentality that made business owners a bigger threat to heath and welfare than any standing foreign army. Force immigration to Australia is a war-crime in this day and age, that it wasn't on the books back then does erase the crime, it only means they should have been stripped of power centuries ago.
Good point .Bl is remembering the 'Romantic view ' of the Britain during the Napoleonic era, 'We are all in this together , Alf" which was 'sort of true- a Napoleonic occupation of Britain would have been a pretty punitive event.
In 1798 a French Republican fleet was driven back from Ireland by storms. The Irish rebellion was beaten back with a huge amount of brutality - as bad as anything Massena meted out in Spain
Irish Rebellion of 1798 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
One of the causes of Casltreagh's suicide was the released knowledge after 1814, of how brutal his repression was.
Charles Webster concludes:
"There probably never was a statesman whose ideas were so right and whose attitude to public opinion was so wrong. Such .[1]disparity between the grasp of ends and the understanding of means amounts to a failure in statesmanship."[2
]to quote Shelley
:I met Murder on the way –He had a face like Castlereagh –Very smooth he looked, yet grim;Seven bloodhounds followed himAll were fat; and well they mightBe in admirable plight,For one by one, and two by two,He tossed them human hearts to chewWhich from his wide cloak he drew.[1]
