Edmonton, Litter Capital

[karrie]

So, this is really annoying me today. Seriously annoying me. I want to scream "what a bunch of jackasses!!"

I went walking with my dog. My dog did what dogs do. Being a dutiful dog owner (and not wanting to be fined as you can be if caught leaving it), I cleaned up after my dog, and continued on my walk.

And continued on my walk.

And continued on my walk.

Along the way I saw diapers. Coffee cups by the dozens. Chip bags. Cigarette packages. Gum wrappers.

What I did not see, along my 1 mile walk, is a garbage can. I saw bus stops strewn in litter, but not a SINGLE garbage can. I found this more than a bit annoying, as I dutifully packed along a bag of dog crap, since I was along a walking trail. But the icing on the cake came when I arrived home, and read the headline of the paper, stating that Edmonton has instituted a new by-law which will fine businesses or homeowners who fail to remove litter from their premises.

Argh!!!

Put some ****ing garbage cans out and perhaps the city wouldn't be awash in filth, and you wouldn't have to hunt down and fine the victims!

 

[Kreskin]

Is it worse than other cities you've lived in?

 

[karrie]

I've never lived in a city this size. But not in a single town, or tiny city I've lived in would you be able to walk 1 mile through a residential area or down walking paths without having access to a garbage can.

Add to that the spring thaw, and it's a gawd awful mess.

 

[Kreskin]

I guess spring thaw would uncover a lot of stuff.

 

[karrie]

What's most striking right now is the lack of garbage receptacles at the bus stops. They're the largest areas of collected litter (namely take-out coffee cups). Why on earth the city wouldn't have garbage cans at each bus stop (that would have made at least 4 garbage cans along my route), is beyond comprehension to me when you see the amount of litter at them.

 

[Kreskin]

Is it a tax and nothing to spend issue?

 

[karrie]

Is it a tax and nothing to spend issue?

I wouldn't think so Kreskin, but who knows?

Their newest by-law, to fine businesses and home owners that don't clean up litter or vandalism on their properties, certainly seems like a bit of a money grab when you consider that they're fining the victims of someone else's crimes.

 

[Kreskin]

I would think a city like Edmonton has a much bigger logistical nightmare than say Victoria. No matter what day of the year a garbage crew can find garbage cans and collect them in Victoria, whereas in a zone where deep freezing and white stuff can make life difficult perhaps it's best left to the people closest to be responsible for their own areas. Rather than have too many city workers driving bad roads hunting for frozen garbage cans.

 

[karrie]

They have to provide access to the bus stops anyway though. They have to be open and ploughed, and obviously accessible by vehicle. It still doesn't make sense to me.

 

[americanexpat]

My last trip through , Edmonton looked good

My last trip through Edmonton was years ago . At that time it was a very clean , and litter free city . I have traveled to most of the States and at least half of the Canadian Provinces , and in general Canada wins hands down in cleaner , litter free cities and towns . I do not wish to stir up any un - called for s---t , but I was informed by more than one Canadian of a large city that the landscape has gone down hill over the years due to the high immigration to the area . I have no idea , just the messenger here .

 

[karrie]

.... but I was informed by more than one Canadian of a large city that the landscape has gone down hill over the years due to the high immigration to the area . I have no idea , just the messenger here .

That tends to come with any population boom, especially if it's high in transient people (those who are there just to work for a bit and planning on returning home, for example the Newfies in a lot of Northern Alberta). I've seen it in towns as small as High Level, and cities as big as Edmonton, when the oil patch booms hit.

 

[Avro]

My last trip through Edmonton was years ago . At that time it was a very clean , and litter free city . I have traveled to most of the States and at least half of the Canadian Provinces , and in general Canada wins hands down in cleaner , litter free cities and towns . I do not wish to stir up any un - called for s---t , but I was informed by more than one Canadian of a large city that the landscape has gone down hill over the years due to the high immigration to the area . I have no idea , just the messenger here .

You must be referring to Toronto because it dosen't look good to me at all, not compared to other Canadian cities I've visited.

I've found European cities to be very clean.

Worst is Sao Paulo.

 

[mt_pockets1000]

Karrie, I take exception to your comment about Newfies (a derogatory term in itself, first spouted by the Americans during WWII) and their part in littering your towns and cities. I'm an ex-pat Newfoundlander myself and I have lots of friends and family from the rock living throughout Alberta, none of which live the kind of life you described above. On the contrary, we Newfoundlanders take pride in our place of residence. Although we may be transient by nature due to unfortunate circumstances back home, which is slowly turning around I might add, we are far from the litterbugs suggested by your comments. Not to say that some Newfoundlanders wouldn't litter, but I'm sure no more than the odd Albertan or Nova Scotian.
I put it to you that your town and city managers are falling down on the job by letting the parks, sidewalks, bus shelters, roads, etc., fall into disrepair. So much money in Alberta but not enough to keep your towns and cities up to standards. I guess you get what you vote for....

 

[karrie]

Karrie, I take exception to your comment about Newfies (a derogatory term in itself, first spouted by the Americans during WWII) and their part in littering your towns and cities. I'm an ex-pat Newfoundlander myself and I have lots of friends and family from the rock living throughout Alberta, none of which live the kind of life you described above. On the contrary, we Newfoundlanders take pride in our place of residence. Although we may be transient by nature due to unfortunate circumstances back home, which is slowly turning around I might add, we are far from the litterbugs suggested by your comments. Not to say that some Newfoundlanders wouldn't litter, but I'm sure no more than the odd Albertan or Nova Scotian.
I put it to you that your town and city managers are falling down on the job by letting the parks, sidewalks, bus shelters, roads, etc., fall into disrepair. So much money in Alberta but not enough to keep your towns and cities up to standards. I guess you get what you vote for....

I never said Newfies litter (and all my family and friends from the Rock refer to themselves as Newfie, so no, I'm not about to budge on that one darlin'... lol). What I said is that it's a phenomena you see in towns with boom populations, especially transient booms. It's a combination problem frankly. An influx of 'strangers' changes the dynamic of a town drastically, and leaves everyone, newcomers and oldtimers alike, feeling a disconnect of ownership and pride over the town.

 

[mt_pockets1000]

I never said Newfies litter (and all my family and friends from the Rock refer to themselves as Newfie, so no, I'm not about to budge on that one darlin'... lol). What I said is that it's a phenomena you see in towns with boom populations, especially transient booms. It's a combination problem frankly. An influx of 'strangers' changes the dynamic of a town drastically, and leaves everyone, newcomers and oldtimers alike, feeling a disconnect of ownership and pride over the town.

I'm sorry Karrie, but that particular topic has been a contentious one with me since I left the province in the late '70's.

Yes, I see where you were going with the generalities on the transient population. You may not have specifically said they were littering but you certainly inferred they were part of the reason why the 'landscape had gone downhill'. Well, what does Alberta want? Do you want your oil pumped out of the ground on not? You don't have the manpower here to do it so, here we are to help. All the work is done back home and we have nothing better to do, until Danny gets 'er up and runnin'. As for the term "newfie", it used to be endearing but because of it's mis-use it's taken on a meaning closely matching the 'N' word the world despises so much. Strike it from the english language I say. Some still hold it close to their hearts like a badge of pride but not this Newfoundlander. It doesn't make me any less proud of my home province because I don't refer to myself as newfie. And believe me I'm not alone in this thinking....sweetheart.:thumbup:

As you say, it's most likely a combination of many factors. Alberta's immigrant population is growing very fast. Perhaps they might be contributing to the littering problem due to bad habits brought here from the old country. Perhaps the youth of our cities and towns have lost their sense of civic pride and toss their junk everywhere. The ever increasing sales of fast foods have contributed a massive amount of garbage all over the place.

Anyway, this time of year is dirty no matter what part of the country you live. Soggy cigarette butts, coffee cups, trash everywhere. Let's see how swift the city cleanup crews are when the snow stops flying.

Peace out Karrie....

 

[karrie]

lol.. mt, you seem to be reading a lot more into my post than there was. Someone inferred that it 'the immigrants' causing problems (as you carry on to do, which frankly, is no less rude than the generalizations you think I'm making about Newfoundlanders). I pointed out that any population boom will cause problems, even the worker booms are from within our own country. Rest easy, I'm not trying to paint them as a bunch of littering jerks. lol. Workers go where they're needed, if they didn't, crises would ensue.

 

[shadowshiv]

I'm sorry Karrie, but that particular topic has been a contentious one with me since I left the province in the late '70's.

Yes, I see where you were going with the generalities on the transient population. You may not have specifically said they were littering but you certainly inferred they were part of the reason why the 'landscape had gone downhill'. Well, what does Alberta want? Do you want your oil pumped out of the ground on not? You don't have the manpower here to do it so, here we are to help. All the work is done back home and we have nothing better to do, until Danny gets 'er up and runnin'. As for the term "newfie", it used to be endearing but because of it's mis-use it's taken on a meaning closely matching the 'N' word the world despises so much. Strike it from the english language I say. Some still hold it close to their hearts like a badge of pride but not this Newfoundlander. It doesn't make me any less proud of my home province because I don't refer to myself as newfie. And believe me I'm not alone in this thinking....sweetheart.:thumbup:

As you say, it's most likely a combination of many factors. Alberta's immigrant population is growing very fast. Perhaps they might be contributing to the littering problem due to bad habits brought here from the old country. Perhaps the youth of our cities and towns have lost their sense of civic pride and toss their junk everywhere. The ever increasing sales of fast foods have contributed a massive amount of garbage all over the place.

Anyway, this time of year is dirty no matter what part of the country you live. Soggy cigarette butts, coffee cups, trash everywhere. Let's see how swift the city cleanup crews are when the snow stops flying.

Peace out Karrie....

You may find that word offensive, but I have friends from Newfoundland and they have no problem with being called a "Newfie". While you(and others) may feel that it is offensive, I don't think it will ever be stricken from the English language. The reason the "N" word has so much negativity is that it is so closly associated with slavery. I can see that word never being used again as a good thing, but there is no way the two words are even close in offensiveness(in my opinion, of course).

On the topic of littering, it is a problem here in Chatham for an entirely different reason. Crows. Thousands of the buggers. They get into people's trash and it gets strewn all over the place. Having plastic(or metallic) garbage cans can help(and that is what I use. I never just leave a bag out on it's own), but they swarm over dumpsters and from other locations and the garbage gets everywhere. Plus, they 'caw' all the time, and that is extremely annoying!:lol:

 

[mt_pockets1000]

As much as I dislike quoting this source, here goes. And I apologize for getting off topic, but not too far off.


From Wikepedia:
"The terms "Newf" or "Newfie" are considered derogatory by many Newfoundlanders. Newfoundlanders are of different views as to whether the term "Newf" is as derogatory as the term "Newfie." As with many ethnic groups saddled with pejorative terms, many Newfoundlanders use the terms to refer to themselves or to each other, and in this context they are less offensive than when used by non-Newfoundlanders.
The word "Newfie" is associated with "Newfie jokes", typical Canadian ethnic jokes told and retold since the days of the bankruptcy of the Dominion of Newfoundland government during the Great Depression. The jokes almost always depict Newfoundlanders as stupid, lazy or both. Many such jokes are identical to ethnic jokes that are used to put down other groups.
In March 2006, an Edmonton police officer was disciplined for using the word Newphie [sic] to describe the apprehension of an individual.[1] This explicitly derogatory usage is particularly prevalent in locations (such as northern Alberta) where large numbers of Newfoundlanders have migrated for economic opportunities.
In the 1970s, the Government of Alberta added the term "Newfie" to a list of words not allowed to be used on personalised licence plates, reasoning that it was an ethnic slur and hateful. In 2006, a man from Newfoundland argued that also a source of pride, and fought to have the word removed from the list, and he eventually won."

I'm sorry but I don't get the warm fuzzies whenever I hear the term. Just because a certain segment of society continues to use the word on a regular basis and don't see any problem with it does not make it ok. You see, if the word is used in a light hearted way to show friendship and comraderie, that's ok But if it's used in a derogatory, offensive way then we have a problem. The latter will never go away so I say we ban this insidious word from our vocabulary completely.

Karrie, again, when I see the words litter/Newfie/transient all combined in such a negative connotation, it raises my hackles. I've got my Irish ancestory to thank for that. My reference to immigrants was only to point out some of the other possible sources of the problem. If I came across as rude I apologize. Funny thing is if you saw me in person you'd find a very easy going, laid back individual. These forums have a way of bringing out the craziness in people sometimes.

 

[QuadroClip]

Most Canadian cities that have large amounts of snow look this way when spring arrives, hell they sometimes find homless people frozen in snow banks, my backyard as garbage in it that i did not put there, the wind blows it in, the snow covers it up.