Karrie , how will solid proof and confirmation of your beliefs end your spirituality?
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- Thread starter Minority Observer84
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AJ i'am glad things have been working out for you . But I really see no pattern here whatsoever you ask for something then wait , something that has a chance of happening anyway eventually it does and you credit god , tell you what next time you want to sell a truck don;t pray for it and see how quickly that happens .
It wouldn't end my spirituality, as I stated, but it would drive a skeptical nail further into my religious belief.
The reason being, that almost every 'miracle' out there has been accomplished by a variety of illusionists. What you call 'proof' is impossible, due to the faulty nature of humanity's perceptions of the world. If people felt they'd seen proof, I'd probably doubt it as illusion.
What I trust, is my own mind. That thrumming sense of a deeper power surging through the world. I'd have much less faith in a physical manifestation and 'proof', than I do in my own senses of the 'supernatural'.
You know what karrie , your right . Most miracles are illusions , even group miracles are the power of suggestion and the desire to see manifesting . No matter what creationists like kent hovind will tell you the eye is far from perfect . I really cannot answer to this sense of the supernatural that you have . I personally do not believe in the supernatural as you no dbout have gathered , do I get loney sure , do I get scared yes . Sometimes I wonder about the purpose behind it all . The fact is that there is no proof for the supernatural and that;s lead me personally to conclude that there is also no purpose to life . We each make our own purpose whatever it is we are concerned about and care about and work towards becomes our purpose . Like I said i cannot rationally discuss your sense of a deeper power it;s irrational .
Doc, the material on that website didn't cost me a penny. No donations and the material is not copy righted, so it's free to use whenever I please.
If it weren't for my new understanding, I won't be having this conversation with you.
Call the salvation army and donate all your junk, and take a tax write off. I', sure that God will bless you beyond your imaginations.
Religion is not your bag and not worth making money at it.
But I tell you what is better to do, and that is to share the good that life gives you with others so as to help them through their tough times.
You do that, and you won't need a religion to identify with.
The word would be" Look, there goes Doc, a good man".
Peace>>>AJ
To you, yes, it must seem irrational.
To me, no, it's not. Because it's addressing a physical manifestation I am aware of. The fact that you are unaware of the same manifestation doesn't make it irrational... it simply makes it beyond your perception. Like trying to explain the color purple to someone who can't see colors, or the smell of a rose to someone who was born without the ability to smell.
To me karrie anything not mathematically quantifiable is irrational . I've been told I have a very analog mind I take it as a complement .
Yes to quote Lisa Simpson ([SIZE=-1]mis-quoting Samuel Johnson)[/SIZE]:
"[SIZE=-1]Prayer, the last refuge of the scoundrel"[/SIZE]
Thanks. You are in effect claiming that god sold your truck for you, sold your business for you, changed your wife's mind on your behalf and in your favour, and led you to a web site that supported and encouraged you. I wouldn't call those coincidences, stuff like that happens all the time, but you're choosing to interpret them as god working in your life when there are much simpler explanations. Your wife's change of heart is the one I find most interesting. You're giving her no credit at all for figuring anything out on her own or being responsible for what she does and how she relates to you, god gets it all. If I were your wife, I'd find that deeply insulting. You don't have proof that your prayers were answered, all you've got is some fairly mundane circumstances that worked out in your favour that you're interpreting in a self-serving way. Try praying for something that'd really make a difference to somebody besides yourself. Ask for the remission of all cancers, for instance, or pray for people who've lost a limb to regrow it, or pray that everybody with spinal chord injuries will be healed. You know what'll happen as well as I do: nothing; those prayers will not be answered. And then you'll have to explain why god responds to your mundane concerns but not to something that would be a great boon to many and is certainly within his capabilities, if he has the powers usually attributed to him.
There's no good evidence that prayers are answered. I still don't believe you. I think you're deluding yourself.
At least the scoundrel knows to take the chances of the possibility; who knows... he thinks... it might just work.
For the rest, well, they won't know until they try it. And if they did once, twice, and got no results, is because it was asked amis.
Yes, to quote brother James:
Jam 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
Mat 21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.
A promise in a prayer.
"Ah! I never will win the lotto!" Well, if one doesn't buy a ticket, one many never know!
Peace>>>AJ
BS. You believe, ask for the remission of all cancers. You won't receive it. Prayer doesn't really work, look.
Yes, prayer for others are well intentioned, but if there is no action on my part to go with those prayers, then I will agree with you.
But, on the personal level, one a one relationship with God, God does answer prayers. Call it selfish if you will, but that's one of the benefits of being in His kingdom.
So, my good friend, continue your journey, and I wish you the best.
Peace>>>AJ
If I was detected to have cancer, Yes, I would pray. If, my God is willing to heal me, directly or with whatever resources are available to mankind, then so be it.
But if not, then I will still hold my faith as if I had never gotten Cancer.
There is a story of 3 men who were asked to deny their God to worship an earthly person king at the risk of being thrown into a fiery furnace.
They responded, we know that our God is able to deliver us from the fiery furnace, but if He doesn't, we will still not deny our God and still not bow to your king.
My attitude is similar.
Peace>>>AJ